BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Amos
Date: 19 Jul 05 - 09:51 AM

Larry:

Buying slime is a poor choice.

Choose wisely, grasshopper!!


A

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,RoveGate
Date: 19 Jul 05 - 10:35 AM

"Just a quarter of Americans think the White House is fully cooperating in the federal investigation of the leak of a CIA operative's identity, a number that's declined sharply since the investigation began. And three-quarters say that if presidential adviser Karl Rove was responsible for leaking classified information, it should cost him his job.

President Bush USED to agree with 3/4 of Americans. Not anymore."

More HERE

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: jpk
Date: 19 Jul 05 - 06:05 PM

had a relitive who had an accident and was found to be brain dead.yet his heart was still beating.we did not know what to do with him.you see we never had a liberal in the family before.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Amos
Date: 19 Jul 05 - 10:55 PM

JPK:

It would be nice if you could raise your head out of the swamp long enough to say something intelligent and articulate.

If it is not clear tyo you that Rove is an unmitigated liar, you must be wearing the thickest rose-colored glasses ever made.

And if all you can offer is mindless half-baked jibes, japes and caterwauls, I'd personally prefer you said nothing at all.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Bobert
Date: 19 Jul 05 - 11:01 PM

Hey, Amos, like why would you expect something intellegent from an unintellegent earth-form???

Hey, a rose is a rose and an idiot is an idiot...

Some things never change...

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Jul 05 - 11:01 PM

Amos,

Freedom of speech means letting even people you disagree with talk.

.....


Should I presume you feel that members of the executive branch who commit felonies should lose their jobs?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: dianavan
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 12:45 AM

"Our friends and colleagues have difficult jobs gathering the intelligence, which helps, for example, to prevent terrorist attacks against Americans at home and abroad. They sometimes face great personal risk and must spend long hours away from family and friends. They serve because they love this country and are committed to protecting it from threats from abroad and to defending the principles of liberty and freedom. They do not expect public acknowledgement for their work, but they do expect and deserve their government's protection of their covert status.

For the good of our country, we ask you to please stand up for every man and woman who works for the U.S. intelligence community and help protect their ability to live their cover.

Sincerely yours,
Larry C. Johnson, former Analyst, CIA

JOINED BY: Mr. Brent Cavan, former Analyst, CIA
Mr. Vince Cannistraro, former Case Officer, CIA
Mr. Michael Grimaldi, former Analyst, CIA
Mr. Mel Goodman, former senior Analyst, CIA
Col. W. Patrick Lang (US Army retired), former Director, Defense Humint Services, DIA
Mr. David MacMichael, former senior estimates officer, National Intelligence Council, CIA
Mr. James Marcinkowski, former Case Officer, CIA
Mr. Ray McGovern, former senior Analyst and PDB Briefer, CIA
Mr. Jim Smith, former Case Officer, CIA
Mr. William C. Wagner, former Case Officer, CIA"

Posted by David Corn


Its my hope that the CIA gets good and mad at the Bush administration. If they value the principles of liberty and freedom, then maybe, just maybe, they'll expose the whole gang of liars and crooks.

Diana

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,G
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 09:19 AM

What would lead us to believe that the CIA is being honest
with us? Some of the things that are used to criticize past Republican
Administrations were the work of the CIA. And also happened during Democrat regimes.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,G
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 09:27 AM

"A Rose is a Rose and an Idiot is an Idiot" - it is becoming increasingly more difficult to differentiate as I remember my Grandmothers advice from years ago,
"NEVER argue with an idiot, someone might walk by and would not be able to tell who's who."

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Amos
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 09:35 AM

BB:

I didn't ask him not to talk. I asked him to stop talking shit. Surely you see the difference.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 09:45 AM

I received the following in an e-mail from a friend. In my opinion, it says it all:

"Do you think Charlie McCarthy is going to fire Edgar Bergen?'

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,RoveGate
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 10:10 AM

"It's no wonder the Supreme Court announcement [was made last night]. It's looking like this week's revelations are going to show that Fitzgerald has enough to indict Rove for obstruction of justice [and 18 U.S.C. 1001, the Martha Stewert crime]. "

More HERE

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Metchosin
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 12:31 PM

Rove in trouble for the same crime as Martha Stewart? Don't be silly. Most know that not telling the whole truth about fiddling with stocks and money is a lot more serious crime than jepardizing human life.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Don Firth
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 01:22 PM

"Kinda like the real Christians [always assuming there are any] are still carrying the can for the "christian"[sic] Fundamentalists."

Greg, I definitely agree with what you say about real conservatives. I know some, and they tend to alternate between being confused (wanting to speak out, but not wanting to agree with "liberals") and being anywhere from dubious to furious at the actions of the Bush administration.

But just to set the record straight:—    liberal Christians are not just sitting back quietly while the Fundies try to usurp Christianity. There is a fair number of prominent Christians who, for a long time have been speaking out loudly against this narrow view and its adherents' attempts to take over as spokespersons for all Christianity—and take over the government with their "America is a Christian country" war-cry.    One of these is retired Episcopal bishop John Shelby Spong, with his books like Rescuing the Bible from Fundamentalism and another is Rev. Barbara Rossing with her book, The Rapture Exposed (she wanted to title it The Rapture Racket, but that frightened her publisher). These are only two of hundreds. Not only do they write books and articles, but they go around speaking at churches all over the country and giving lectures in various venues.

One of the most prominent recently is Rev. Jim Wallis. Right now, he's traveling from city to city talking at churches, giving book signings in bookstores, giving lectures, and appearing on television and radio talk shows whenever they have the guts to give him air-time, flogging his recently published book, God's Politics : Why the Right Gets It Wrong and the Left Doesn't Get It (interview HERE).

If the word is not getting around, it's because the media (that horrible "liberal" media) gives the Fundies a lot of air-time and generally tends to ignore people like Wallis. Also, the Fundies can really get vicious about the things Spong, Rossing, Wallis, and others say and sometimes organize boycotts of any station or other media outlet that is willing to give them air-time.

Up until recently, in this country religion, has been relatively safe from government interference. But government is definitely not safe from religion. "Liberal" Christians like Wallis recognize that if groups like the religious Right get the foothold they want in government, then freedom of religion—and freedom from religion—will be a thing of the past. Kiss the First Amendment goodbye.

Karl Rove's perfidy has much more far-reaching implications than most people realize.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 02:04 PM

Tomorrow night - July 21 - a course in disecting God's Politics is going to start at a local hall. The hope is that the subject will be - and is beng - discussed across the country and that the people in response will be heard.

I'm sure that there are people across the country that are trying to be heard, are trying to get grassroots actions going. We're going to try to add our bit.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 04:05 PM

Amos,

So, you would only regulate WHAT he says? Sounds like a liberal definition of free speech to me... ( sarcasm)


IF he is talking shit, it only hurts his own cause.

IF he is expressing an opinion, YOU are trying to stifle free expression.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 04:11 PM

bb, choose your windmills- it is difficult, to say the least, to stifle anyone's BS on this forum. *G* However, calling someone on their BS just may make them stop and think.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Frankham
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 04:22 PM

Karl Rove is merely using the Christian Right as a political tool.
He realizes that many of these people are off the wall. If he goes around the corridors of Washington whistling "Onward Christian Soldiers'" it's only because he has a vested interest in the success of these fanatics. He doesn't believe it himself but it makes his Puppet George stronger.

Karl Rove is the unofficial president of the U.S.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 04:28 PM

I think you're right, Frankham, but it doesn't give one much hope for his being punished. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. At some point, I still believe, the bush administration's shenanigans will beome so blatant that the Great Faithful's eyes will suddenly spring wide open.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: jpk
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 05:20 PM

the sad thing is,your all beliveing every thing you read,if it is what you want to belive it is all the easer.
you should all know by now that the info media in all its forms,is suspect as to what is/isn't true.
all should be taking this in[regardless of what you want to belive,either way] with a bucket of salt.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,The Phantom of the Uproar
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 05:26 PM

So, jpk, you are the only one around here with the capacity for judgment? Keep on believing that if it makes you happy.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: jpk
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 05:37 PM

who is judging,can not do it with out some facts which no one has.
all we got is he said she said,and being under oath does not mean it is true either.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Azizi
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 06:14 PM

"and being under oath does not mean it is true either."

Isn't that the main point?

Rove lied. People died-and continue to die {and be severly injured} in a war that is based upon lies.

Not to mention the fact that undercover agents are reported to have died as a result of the outing of Plame's name and the name of corporation where she worked.

Shame on us if there are no indictments and convictions for traitors to American freedom & justice.


Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 06:56 PM

If Rove knew that "Joseph Wilson's wife" was a CIA operative, I don't think there is any doubt but that he knew more than that - including the rumour that Valerie Plame was one of those brought home from her theatre 10-12 years ago when turncoat CIA agent, Ames, waw nabbed, because of fear that she might have been uncovered and put at peril. Intelligence gathering operations by their very nature require long-term, patient relationships. If a foreign power becomes aware of an operative being outed, it might easily be worthwhile to them to trace the relationships they had while they were working in their country. Karl Rove is an arrogant man who thought he could get away with anything. That's my opinion.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,G
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 09:21 PM

This is interesting to me. Azizi said "Not to mention the 'fact' that undercover agents are reported to have died as a result of the outing of Plame's name and the name of the corporation where she worked".
I am not doubting you at all, I just want to read this for myself.
Please, when you get time, give us a source we can go to.
Thanks

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: dianavan
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 09:32 PM

Jpk - You said, "the sad thing is,your all beliveing every thing you read,if it is what you want to belive it is all the easer.
you should all know by now that the info media in all its forms,is suspect as to what is/isn't true.
all should be taking this in[regardless of what you want to belive,either way] with a bucket of salt."

I have been reading alot about Karl Rove. One of the things I noted was the suspicion that he was a closet "gay". While I don't care if he is gay or not, I do think that if it is true, the religious right might like to know since he has been bilking them for millions.

I take this information with a grain of salt. What about you?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Amos
Date: 20 Jul 05 - 11:02 PM

BB:

You are missing the point. Slanderous insults are not an effort to communicate, but to upset or shut others up.

I am always interested in anything he or anyone else actually has to say as a communication.

But if all he can do is emit negativity I would prefer he not do it here. That's my preference, and I am voicing it.

You may prefer that he post his stupid little remarks. If so, that's your preference, and welcome to it.

I prefer it when people use their brains instead of their lower GI to communicate.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 21 Jul 05 - 11:39 AM

Snippets:

"The paragraph identifying her as the wife of former ambassador Joseph C. Wilson IV was clearly marked to show that it contained classified material at the "secret" level, two sources said. The CIA classifies as "secret" the names of officers whose identities are covert, according to former senior agency officials.

"Anyone reading that paragraph should have been aware that it contained secret information, though that designation was not specifically attached to Plame's name and did not describe her status as covert, the sources said. It is a federal crime, punishable by up to 10 years in prison, for a federal official to knowingly disclose the identity of a covert CIA official if the person knows the government is trying to keep it secret."

And later in the article:

"Almost all of the memo is devoted to describing why State Department intelligence experts did not believe claims that Saddam Hussein had in the recent past sought to purchase uranium from Niger. Only two sentences in the seven-sentence paragraph mention Wilson's wife.

    The memo was delivered to Secretary of State Colin L. Powell on July 7, 2003, as he headed to Africa for a trip with President Bush aboard Air Force One. Plame was unmasked in a syndicated column by Robert D. Novak seven days later."

More

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Stephen L. Rich
Date: 21 Jul 05 - 10:11 PM

Q:Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar?

A: Karl Rove is not fat. He weighs only thirty-two pounds. He is hollow.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Jul 05 - 10:18 PM

Ahhhhhh, you might want get yer scales rechecked, Steve....

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,G
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 12:09 AM

Azizi, my post dated 20 July 05 @9:21

?????????????????????????????????????

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Azizi
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 01:16 PM

Guest G,

I appreciate your persistence. However, with much respect, I'mma haveta do a Rove since I don't recall what my source was for that information. Maybe it was here, and maybe it was there {where ever "there" is}.

On second thought I'm not "doin a Rove" since I believe that Rove is lying BIG TIME.

Although I can recall what {as opposed to who} was my source for asserting that one or more secret agents died as a result of Plame's outing, I know that it was the online print media since I gave up watching television news a long time ago.

And, Guest G., I don't know about you, but it stands to reason to me that there could have been severe consequences to outing a secret agent and passing along information in super doober top secret memos {information that isn't even supposed to be shared with 'friendly international governments}. Included in those severe consequences might have been the Valarie Plame's death, the death of other people who could be tied to her, and the compromising of years of undercover activities.

And less we forget, thousands of people have died and been severely injured as a result of the Iraqui war, a war that -IMHO-was based on lies.

Sp Guest G, that's the best that I can do.

If you want more, paraphrasing the lyrics popularized by singer Eykah Badu, "you gotta call Tryone".

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Amos
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 01:21 PM

Look upthread, guys:

"Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,Rovegate - PM
Date: 14 Jul 05 - 06:50 AM

Truth or Consequences:

"ROVEGATE -- July 10, 2005 --Newsweek magazine is reporting on the contents of a July 11, 2003 email between reporter Matt Cooper and Time Washington bureau chief Michael Duffy that was handed over, along with other email and notes, to special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald. Although the email shows that Rove talked to Cooper about Ambassador Joe Wilson's wife, there is no mention of how columnist Robert Novak obtained the information on Brewster Jennings & Associates, the carve out brass plate firm that was used by Valerie Plame and her colleagues and which was rolled up as a result of the leak. Rove and his lawyer are trying to limit the spin to Rove "not knowing" Plame's name, let alone that she was a covert CIA agent. Yet Plame's association with a non-official cover (NOC), by default, means that she was covert, pure and simple. Brewster Jennings reportedly "suffered greatly" as a result of the disclosure, according to a knowledgeable source. Another source reported that at least one Brewster Jennings NOC operating in a hostile intelligence environment was executed by counter-intelligence agents as a result of the White House disclosure. Other B&JA assets were forced to abandon their ongoing operations to identify networks involved in weapons of mass destruction proliferation."


A

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Azizi
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 02:06 PM

Thanks, Amos.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: jpk
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 05:14 PM

the thing that gets me most is wilson on book,#1 it is not worth reading[i tried]#2without the leak bit for an ending[so to speak],it has nothing to say#3wilson was only a minor dept hack[unless you listen to him]#4mrs wilson also was only minor player.
how much money has revolved around this mess and the book,did wilson have a backseat involvement we don't know of.
kind of like the timing of woodwards book and deep throat comeing out.
also whats to be gained by rove telling cooper that it was ok to blab about it.
also is it possible that the one sitting in jail does not want to say she got it all from wilson??

it is possible.but whether it is or isn't,we may never know.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 05:35 PM

I see. It's okay to out an undercover CIA operative as long as they are only a minor player. Thank goodness the Whitehouse didn't out a biggie. Mighty patriotic of them I say. In fact, they deserve medals.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 05:49 PM

I disagree with most of what you say there, jpk, including your repeated insinuations about Woodward's book coming out so quickly after Deep Throat outed himself. FWIW, Woodward didn't have to start from scratch- Deep Throat's identity was no secret to him.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: jpk
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 05:52 PM

who is saying anything about right or wrong,only pointing out items of possible intrest and interesting thoughts on matter.
also if you dig a little you will find that the cia figured her usefullness[what little there was]was shot when she first took up with wilson.
also take the whole post together,not just snippets of it,it is like a bible thumper taking only parts of book that support what he wants,but when you read the whole thing or a different part,it says something totaly different.
that has happened to this whole mole hill so far,plus to much finger pointing and whinning and not enough real questions being put forth.
like maybe lets start following all the money an see where it goes.
have a good day an god bless!

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 06:01 PM

It appears that 'experts' don't agree with you, jpk. Unless you outrank them?

"WASHINGTON - Former U.S. intelligence officers criticized    President Bush on Friday for not disciplining Karl Rove in connection with the leak of the name of a CIA officer, saying Bush's lack of action has jeopardized national security.

"In a hearing held by Senate and House Democrats examining the implications of exposing Valerie Plame's identity, the former intelligence officers said Bush's silence has hampered efforts to recruit informants to help the United States fight the war on terror. Federal law forbids government officials from revealing the identity of an undercover intelligence officer.

"I wouldn't be here this morning if President Bush had done the one thing required of him as commander in chief — protect and defend the Constitution," said Larry Johnson, a former CIA analyst. "The minute that Valerie Plame's identity was outed, he should have delivered a strict and strong message to his employees."

Sez the CIA

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: DougR
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 07:59 PM

Boy, for a lot of self-professed liberals, some of you are really blood thirsty! I guess it depends on whose blood is shed, right?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: dianavan
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 07:59 PM

James Marcinkowski, a former CIA case office and a former prosecutor testified:

" There is a very serious message here. Before you shine up your American flag lapel pin and affix your patriotism to your sleeve, think about what the impact your actions will have on the security of the American people. Think about whether your partisan obfuscation is creating confidence in the United States in general and the CIA in particular. If not, a true patriot would shut up.

Those who take pride in their political ability to divert the issue from the fundamental truth ought to be prepared to take their share of the responsibility for the continuing damage done to our national security.

When this unprecedented act first occurred, the president could have immediately demanded the resignation of all persons even tangentially involved. Or, at a minimum, he could have suspended the security clearances of these persons and placed them on administrative leave. Such methods are routine with police forces throughout the country. That would have at least sent the right message around the globe, that we take the security of those risking their lives on behalf of the United States seriously. Instead, we have flooded the foreign airwaves with two years of inaction, political rhetoric, ignorance, and partisan bickering. That's the wrong message. In doing so we have not lessened, but increased the threat to the security and safety of the people of the United States."

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: dianavan
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 08:01 PM

Go get 'em!

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 08:58 PM

It depends on whose pig is being gored, I guess. And somehow, DougR, you never squeal until it is your pig.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 09:20 PM

And, BTW, Dougie... The tables have turned dramitically since 2000 and ***YOU*** are now the "LIBERAL".... And a mighty radical one at that....

I mean, let's examine the facts... You are for huge deficits. You are for using the US's military might to change governments that you don't like???? LIkie where exactly is the conservatism here, my friend???

Well, no whhere at all... That's where....

Maybe you'd like to talk a little bit about just waht being a conservative means to you??? I'm havin' a little trouble figuring you guys out...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 09:39 PM

Doug, I'd like to recommend a book to you. I think you actually have read it because once you recommended it to me--but I read it already.

The Conscience of a Conservative by Barry Goldwater. Reread it and refresh your memory on what a conservative is.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 10:04 PM

Last night I went to a political meeting- we're hoping that cells like this (gasp! Sounds awfully red) are forming all across the country.

The point was made that we are not dealing with Liberal versus Conservative here- it is Liberal versus Radical. We hope to get some Conservatives to join us.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 10:17 PM

They first have to answer the questions that I posed to Dougie, Ebbie, before they are willing to step back from the "winner's circle" mindset and ask themselves, "Hey, what do I really believe???"

One thing about progressives is that we ain't got that winner's circle syndrome messin' with us so our core values stay purdy much unchanged, Dems, Repubs 'er Whatevers...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: GUEST,Ron Davies
Date: 22 Jul 05 - 10:57 PM

Oh, Rove and Bush are conservatives all right. But, as I pointed out earlier, the word is now spelled differently--either D-E-M-O G-O-G-U-E, in recognition of their mastery of the politics of hate and fear, or R-E-A-C-T-I-O-N-A-R-Y, as in their respect for the natural world and for science.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: Frankham
Date: 23 Jul 05 - 03:43 PM

Larry Johnson, Valerie Plame's classmate at the CIA is a registered Republican and gone on record as saying that he is ashamed of the GOP and their tactics.

It appears that the GOP is no longer conservative but proligate, spendthrift, impulsive, rash and irresponsible. Everything that the GOP has accused liberals and dems of having done, they do themselves. They lie, they smear and justify it by discrediting their "enemies". Their smear against Wilson is ongoing.

The actual smear tactic seems to be the standard OP (MO) of the GOP. Rove inherited it from Lee Atwater who used it to advantage during the Dukakis primary.

It may be that Rove and company have committed treason and it would be in the best interest of the US if they were investigated for this. Otherwise, the CIA is compromised. If not, this means that there can be no meaningful security for the US.

Bush has finally managed to alienate the CIA. Who will it be next?

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: BS: Is Karl Rove a Big Fat Liar???
From: jpk
Date: 23 Jul 05 - 05:18 PM

lets see,nobody wants to have novaks head,or the publishers either.seems that they would be just as responsable as rove,hmmmm.
seems that the very defenders of the cia are the same ones that were beating them up over the iran contra bit[good guy/bad guy,depends on which day and issue i guess]
and you are siting the very people under scrutiney as to there ability,a rather one sided veiw.
and congressional hearing rarely ever bring the truth to lite.
also i am no great fan of rove or any of the rest of the life long politician or public [sic]servant[no such thing]