Sing Out! vs. the blind

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Susan of DT
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 05:42 PM

pdf's can be of words or images. If the pdf is of words, the various reading programs "should" be able to handle it, but if it is a pdf of an image, there is nothing for the program to read. I don't know enough about the special reading programs (and I should learn since I have several blind friends and acquaintances who sometimes ask me questions)

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 05:32 PM

I am not an expert but I think that word files are more readily accesible to voice readers and braille readers than pdf are.

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Wesley S
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 04:54 PM

Let's face it. It costs extra to have special needs. As the father of a special needs child I wish it wasn't that way - but that's the reality. I'm going to need a lot more information before I start thinking badly of Singout. But as of now a lot of your response Jack just sounds like spin to me. Sorry. Am I missing something?

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Maryrrf
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 04:48 PM

It may be that Sing Out is doing what it can to accomodate. I wouldn't imagine that they are swimming in money, and it can get expensive to redesign websites and issue braille editions of the magazine. I noticed that they asked to be referred resources that might be able to help. Their response didn't seem hostile to me. Maybe some exchanges went on that weren't made public.

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Rifleman (inactive)
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 04:39 PM

I think some people (above posting)complain and think negatively just for the sake of it.

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Jack Campin
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 04:12 PM

"we understand" = "we haven't even considered actually testing it to find out".

"special software" = "blind users can expect to shell out several hundred dollars for flaky commercial products that only run under a flaky operating system that will cost them a few hundred dollars more".

"actively researching" = "our teenage webmaster might get round to reading a book about accessible design when he finishes college".

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Wesley S
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 04:00 PM

This is from that page. Whats wrong with what they propose?

Can you give us examples of "egregious hostility to the needs and civil rights of visually impaired Sing Out! members as expressed by Mr. Moss in email correspondence." ??

From Sing Out's website:


"For subscribers or members who are visually impaired, we can supply the magazine on disc -- by special request -- in PDF format which we understand can be used with special software to make the magazine more accessible. If you would like to start receiving the magazine in that fashion, please contact our executive director Mark D. Moss via phone [phone] x203) or e-mail (see below), and he will make the necessary arrangements.
We are also actively researching better alternative ways to make the magazine easily accessible. If you have any contacts within the Blind or Vision Impaired community resources who can help us do that, please send those contacts to us as well!"

Subject: RE: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 03:52 PM

looks like they are covering themselves

The link to the above is on their home page.

Have to agree. It is noit very user friendly even to the casual browser, much less someone with visual impairment.

Subject: Sing Out! vs. the blind
From: Jack Campin
Date: 10 Jun 09 - 03:44 PM

Spotted on rec.music.folk:

Dear Sing Out readers and members:

It is with a sad and heavy heart that I inform you that the members of
the National Association of Blind Musicians at its annual meeting this
past Saturday, June 6, voted to boycott Sing Out! magazine and its
advertisers and to also ask the general membership of both the
National Federation of the Blind and the American Council of the Blind
to join forces in the boycott. This is the first such boycott in the
history of NABM.

The boycott is in protest of the Mark Moss, Executive Director of Sing
Out!, refusal to agree to provide the content of Sing Out! magazine in
a format that blind and visually impaired readers can access with
their own computers, and egregious hostility to the needs and civil
rights of visually impaired Sing Out! members as expressed by Mr. Moss
in email correspondence.

This boycott is scheduled to begin on Sunday, June 21, 2009, with a 1
PM ET press conference and official notification to Sing Out
advertisers. This timing is to support a seperate legal action to be
taken by visually-impaired Sing Out! members. A civil rights
complaint has already been filed with the US Department of Justice.

The members of NABM cordually request the Support of Sing out Members
and urge them to ask Executive Dircotor Mark Moss to reconsider his
position and formally agree to make Sing out! available in a
accessible format.

Sincerely,

Greg Austin
National Executive Secretary
National Association of Blind Musicians

The National Association of Blind Musicians is non-profit organization
dedicated to making music education and educational materials
available to blind and visually impaired students.

Somebody posted a link to the "new improved" Sing Out! site a while back, and I agree entirely with Greg - it was indeed one of the most appallingly ignorant and inconsiderate pieces of web design I've ever seen. Well beyond needing a repair job - the whole thing needs to be thrown away and rewritten from scratch (by a designer with a clue).

---

Moderator's Note: Please read the entire thread before making any hasty judgment against Sing out! Magazine. It appears that Mr. Campin's allegations are totally unfounded.
-Joe Offer, Forum Moderator-

Singout website: http://singout.org/

Sing Out! for the visually impaired

last edit 29 Oct 2009