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BS: The Family
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Subject: BS: Sharlet -- From: toadfrog Date: 02 Jul 09 - 09:07 PM I can't resist this one, which confirms what I had suspected for about the last 10 years. Modern market fundamentalism has nothing to do with Adam Smith or David Ricardo--people I've always respected. It is just like divine right absolutism. It just means rich and powerful people are the chosen of god, and can do no wrong. See the cite to Jeff Sharlet, "Family, Fundamentalism, Friends in High Places" http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=106115324 |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Bill D Date: 02 Jul 09 - 09:24 PM I had not heard the details of this semi-cult before, but it doesn't surprise me at all. There are many, many on the religious far-right who assume...and like to 'explain' how being wealthy proves you have some sort of 'divine destiny' to be wealthy. Does the "divine right of kings" sound like it has modern adherents? Every few months I get some sort of mail 'suggesting' that $$$$$ can be coaxed from God by 'proper' behavior..... usually including 'seeding' the metaphysical system with your own money... ☺ The whole bit takes so many forms.....but seeing that list of members of "The Family" sure clarifies some of the recent news.... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: GUEST,Russ Date: 02 Jul 09 - 09:33 PM see John Calvin (1509-64)on the Marks of Election. Russ (permanent GUEST) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: toadfrog Date: 03 Jul 09 - 02:07 AM I think of the religious far right as a little bit cleaner than this. This is sort of a bastard far right with all the vices all kinds or rightists and the virtues of none. Almost the exact opposite of what I used to think of as Christinaity. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: robomatic Date: 03 Jul 09 - 07:59 PM This was profiled on NPR's "Fresh Air with Terry Gross" a couple of days ago. According to the interviewee, this organization was behind the institution of "National Prayer Breakfast" in 1953. I'm not convinced it's a 'bad' thing. Not all conspiracies are evil, and these folks are for the most part well meaning. Their policy, according to the Fresh Air show, was less low key in the 50's, but has changed. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: GUEST,Russ Date: 04 Jul 09 - 11:31 AM Latest version of "Might makes Right". Russ (Permanent GUEST) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: toadfrog Date: 05 Jul 09 - 03:38 PM Well, robomatic, let me explain a bit more. I was raised to believe that as a principle, "all men"--meaning all people--were created equal, as it said in the Declaration of Independence, and as Lincoln said many times. And the Christianity I learned about in Sunday School included the Book of Matthew and made kindness toward less fortunate people a basic moral value. So although I have differences with the religious right, I have always assumed that we all shared a few beliefs about right and wrong. I am aware the "The Family" was profiled on Fresh Air. You would have have guessed that if you clicked on the hyperlink I provided. If the account on Fresh Air is correct, "The Family" is made up people who make a principle of inequality and reject the idea that kindness has any value. I had suspected certain members of the Republican Party (like maybe Governor Sanford) had some un-Christian ideas, but I was not willing to believe anything quite this extreme until just now, when it was spelled out for me. So if you think people like these--like the Governor of South Carolina--who make a principle of inequality and repudiate the very idea of kindness, are o.k. because they organize "prayer breakfasts," I think you are coming from a very strange place. The best that can be said for these "Christians" is that they are smart enough to know there is money in pandering to wealth and privilege. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Neil D Date: 05 Jul 09 - 04:31 PM Didn't Christ say it was easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into heaven? Of course I did have a rich Christian try to tell me that He was referring to a gate in the walls of Jerusalem that was known colloquially as the "Eye of the Needle". |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Stringsinger Date: 05 Jul 09 - 05:26 PM The Family is attempting to tear down the Wall of Separation between Church and State. It looks like they are succeeding. I'm not surprised that Billy Graham is in back of this. Obama is playing right into this with his "faith-based initiatives". I am convinced that this is not a good thing and these people may claim to be well-intentioned but what they are doing is inimical to democracy. They are theocrats, pure and simple. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Paul Burke Date: 05 Jul 09 - 05:57 PM My nephew was involved with a cult called The Family back in the 1990s. Can't say if it was the same lot, but they were his reaction to early teen homosexuality via a f***-up of a home life. Tried to explain, but being far too reasonable lost the argument. He's more-or-less stable now as a lowly accountant's assistant, a total waste of someone with his promise, but I can't say whether the mental illness that he went through was a result of the involvement with a load of manipulating, uncaring substitutes for human beings. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 05 Jul 09 - 06:22 PM There are two well known cults called The Family. One is Children of God/The Family, founded by David Berg. A web site for ex-members is http://www.xfamily.org/index.php/Main_Page The Family/The Fellowship Foundation covered in Jeff Sharlet's book is a different cult than Children of God/The Family. Alice |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 05 Jul 09 - 06:25 PM BTW, knowing now that Gov. Mark Sanford is a member of the Fellowship Foundation cult, that explains a lot for me in his wording of public confessions and justifications that he has done. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Richard Bridge Date: 05 Jul 09 - 09:08 PM The Eye of the Needle was a low and narrow gate in the walls of Jerusalem. In order to get a cemal through it was necessary for the baggage the camel was carrying to be unloaded. Thus, by analogy, the rich man (the male embraces the female and vice versa in this sense) wishing to enter the kingdom of heaven had to unload his "baggage". Geddit? |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Amos Date: 05 Jul 09 - 09:55 PM Giddyap, dromedary. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 06 Jul 09 - 08:02 AM As Les Barker reminds us, it's easier if you put the camel through a liquidiser first. But I'd draw the line at doing that to a poor beast. On the other hand I can think of a fair number of rich people who might be improved by the process... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 16 Jul 09 - 09:50 PM Interesting interview tonight, the author of The Family. They believe that morals is a secular concept and those who are not "the chosen", who are not part of the C Street Family, may follow morals, but the Family members are above that. One weird concept... a wife saying her husband does not satisfy her sexually means SHE is demonically possessed. "we are a Christian Mafia" You Tube Video 7/15/09 |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Stringsinger Date: 16 Jul 09 - 10:00 PM Remember that Ensign, Craig and Sanford were shielded by the Family (Doug Coe) and were given money to support their continuance in office by them. Ensign stayed on their premises. Politicians who are influential stay there with low rent. (I think they are low rent). The deal with them is that they believe that power rules and that's what their religion is all about. It's a rehash of "Dispensationalism". To dismiss them as a tiny cult is to underestimate their influence in politics. The Family supported Suharto in Indonesia. They like dictators because the wield power. This is a good thing? I don't think so! |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 16 Jul 09 - 10:04 PM More insight into The Family (politicians living in C Street house) interview video, now on You Tube. This one discusses the Family's concept of being the Christian Mafia, how wealth and power shows someone is chosen by God. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aizL4fVhK8w |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 16 Jul 09 - 10:09 PM More detail about the actual C Street "dormitory" where the Family sect politician members live: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibFQAeubTak |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 16 Jul 09 - 10:18 PM Listen to the sermon quotes from the end of that video link I just posted... that is CLASSIC destructive cult leader talk. Most destructive cults manipulate their members to be loyal to ONLY THE CULT and to leave all other relationships, family, their own interests, everything far behind. If it is a Christian cult, they usually use gospel quotes in a twisted way to make people think that they must cut off from family and leave all behind to follow the cult (cult leader). I've seen this over, and over, and over again, a pattern from Jim Jones to the most obscure group you've never heard of, that twisting idea of loyalty to the group (the leader) is paramount. The Family leader, Coe, describes the Red Guard member cutting his mother's head off to prove loyalty to the group. Classic cult thought reform and manipulation. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Bill D Date: 16 Jul 09 - 11:07 PM Ÿep...Rachael Maddow has had 3-4 consecutive nights of unraveling the C-Street story now...with interviews with Jeff Sharlet, who wrote the book on them. It is a classic case of circular reasoning and rationalization designed to justify whatever it is you WANT to be true. "Morality is a useful 'concept' to apply to others, but not to **US CHOSEN ONES**. Wealth & power came to us because we are superior, and chosen by God to BE wealthy & powerful: therefore what we do to extend & protect that situation is justified." Of course, I doubt that within "The Family" it would never be expressed quite so ...ummm... directly. They rely on little homilies and assumed references to cover whatever they are doing...until someone questions directly on some issue...then they slip and SAY some of the seldom voiced beliefs...like Rep. Zack Wamp did the other day. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Stringsinger Date: 17 Jul 09 - 10:22 AM " Former Congressman and C Street resident Chip Pickering's estranged wife has filed a lawsuit against Pickering's alleged mistress. Leisha Pickering is suing Elizabeth Creekmore-Byrd for alienation of affection. Rep. Pickering, a Republican from Mississippi, allegedly continued seeing his college sweetheart while they were both married. According to the suit, some of the "wrongful conduct" occurred at the C Street facility for Christian congressmen -- the same one where Sen. John Ensign (R-NV) and Sen. Tom Coburn (R-OK) have lived, and where Gov. Mark Sanford (R-SC) has recently sought counseling. What's with this place? The suit alleges Pickering and Creekmore-Byrd are still together. Perhaps they're soul mates? The complaint, filed Tuesday in Hinds County Circuit Court in Mississippi, is 28 14 pages long, plus evidence, so we'll be posting more if we find anything particularly juicy. Late Update: The suit says Rep. Pickering and Creekmore-Byrd rekindled their relationship while he was a congressman, before and while living at the C-Street facility. The relationship was "completely unknown" by Leisha Pickering, as it occurred in Washington on weekdays, and the congressman would return home to his wife and five children only on weekends. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Bill D Date: 17 Jul 09 - 01:14 PM "What's with this place?" Just follow Alice's links...*grin*... it's a gathering place for like-minded guys who DO put loyalty to their |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 17 Jul 09 - 02:20 PM 6 to 8 Republican congressmen stay at C street at a time. The Family author lived in the house to do the research for the book. The leader, Coe, actually believes that Totalitarian leaders are the examples of how Christian leaders should lead. He counsels that Hitler, Pol Pott, etc., should be these congressmen's examples. In 1935, the founder of The Family believes he got a revelation from God that the rich and powerful were chosen to become more rich and powerful. WATCH THIS VIDEO interview of the author of the book about the Family. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDdHrl0xmT0 As explained in the interview, they do not think "normal" rules of morality do not apply to members of The Family. Alice |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 17 Jul 09 - 02:22 PM correction.... that should be... "they think normal rules of morality do not apply to members of The Family." |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Stringsinger Date: 18 Jul 09 - 12:52 PM Alice, they cite the bible as a source for their rules of morality. King David had his revenge by putting to death Uriah so he could sleep with Bathsheba. He was "above the law". This is who Doug Coe cites as being "holy" and above reproach. It's no wonder that Ensign, Craig, Sanford and now Chip Pickering were shielded by the Family. The Family believes that power and a kind of Christian Dictatorship will take over the world. This view has it's roots in Calvin in Dominionism and the founder of the Family philosophically, Vereide. These religious nuts unfortunately have too much influence in the politics of the United States with their propagandistic "National Prayer Breakfasts" endorsed by Billy Graham. This "Prayer Breakfast" was a political move on the part of Coe and the Family. Oddly enough, the Family (Coe) think of themselves not churchy which requires a kind of institutionalization but superior to that. If you can imagine Christian Nazis, that's what they look like. Coe thinks these Christians are the "chosen people" very much like the notion of a "master race". We dismiss their influence at our peril. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 18 Jul 09 - 12:58 PM Yes, I've heard that part of the interview about the Family sermons and King David. It is very common for Christian and Christian/New Age cults to refer to those parts of the bible that Coe uses... it's not the first time I've seen it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 18 Jul 09 - 01:09 PM As an aside to this, we currently have a member of an apocalyptic new age cult who is the Bozeman leader of the local "Tea Bag" protest group (remember our counter protest group thread, Green Coalition of Gay Loggers for Jesus?) For years, he has had a right wing local talk radio show on the same station (Clearchannel) that broadcasts Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck, Michael Savage, etc. He calls his radio show Open Range. This guy hides his real background and membership in the Church Universal and Triumphant aka Summit Lighthouse aka Elizabeth Clare Prophet, because when they did their fallout shelter apocalypse fiasco south of us near Yellowstone AND were found guilty of illegal arms buying, most people in Montana have a clue about the fact that the group is a cult that manipulates and has been destructive to its members and neighbors. Well, Tea Baggers show up following him, the most recent in the last few days a protest against the government regarding health care reform. Most of these Tea Bag people would be shocked to know that he STILL is an active member/leader in the cult, but he keeps that fact under wraps. He'd fit right in to the mind set of the type who would join the Family.... but he is already in a cult, one led by a "Mother" figurehead who weaves far right wing politics into the beliefs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: heric Date: 18 Jul 09 - 09:21 PM Strange thing about that book probably explained somewhere: His secret visit was in 2002, and he wrote it up in Harpers in March, 2003. Anecdotes in this July 2009 article are lifted right out of that old Harpers article. Maybe he kept right on researching for another five or six years, I dunno. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Bill D Date: 18 Jul 09 - 10:47 PM so... Elizabeth Clare Prophet is still at it? I used to see her 'shows' on late night TV a number of years ago...I thought her group had run afoul of the law and had problems. (I used to live in Wichita, where several board members of the John Birch Society lived....now I live in walking distance of a Jehovah's Witness hall AND the big east coast Mormon temple....the Witnesses knocked on my door this morning!) I think we're surrounded... |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 18 Jul 09 - 11:34 PM She has Alzheimers and has been incapacitated, cared for privately by cult members here for years. But, the group is still trying to keep going, still sell their books, tapes, have there gatherings, etc., and have gone back to calling themselves Summit Lighthouse because of the bad press that CUT got from their illegal gun crimes, etc. Her children - some were being groomed to take over until they all left the cult. Her daughter has written a book that was recently published. "Prophet's Daughter", by Erin Prophet. It's on Amazon.com. Her brother Sean wrote a good review of it on Amazon. It's interesting to read the reviews, as there are ex-members who are glad to know the secrets behind what was going on, and there are current members making comments about the ex-member reviews, in denial about what was going on. Sean Prophet is an atheist now and has a blog called Black Sun Journal. http://www.blacksunjournal.com/ |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Stringsinger Date: 19 Jul 09 - 11:38 AM Sean Prophet's blog is interesting. I like his expose on Tolle. I think he's right in that some scientists get caught out on stuff occasionally. They are human. But science eventually gets it right. Re Coe's views, they can be traced to Vereide, Norwegian theologian and back to the Dominionist Calvinists. This is not new stuff. The funny part is that with all the cloak and dagger secrecy he has attempted, it's now on the front page. What was Hillary Clinton doing with them? Or is this a rhetorical question? Frank |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 17 Aug 09 - 10:02 PM A major Christian magazine has done an expose on The Family. Link here: World magazine, The ABCs of C Street |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Bill D Date: 17 Aug 09 - 10:35 PM Yep... and while they are 'exposing' The Family, Texas has quietly put thru a law requiring "information" on The Bible to be part of the curriculum. I don't see any requirement to provide info on any other religion. (The Family barely USES the Bible, anyway). They prefer to get their guidance directly from God...or someone who purports to have God's ear. Adherence to any standard church is way too limiting for the concept of "Divine Right of the Rich & Powerful" they espouse. I need to copy this logical truth into a file, so I can paste it in about 4 times a week: "From false premises, anything follows!" |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Donuel Date: 17 Aug 09 - 10:59 PM Blessed be the C street mafia for Jesus says unto them things that he does not say unto anyone else on earth. Go forth and fucj your brains out with anyone but your wife. Thou shalt steal and murder in the name of the family. Thou shalt covet anything you desire. Thou shalt bear false witness upon all democrats and queers. The meek shall inherit different instructions (as in the Bible) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Ebbie Date: 18 Aug 09 - 01:04 AM In an evident effort to stay away from cliches, Sharlett uses some odd images:"... teeth like a slab of white marble, dark eyes so big they didn't need to move to take in the room." Hello? Since it is the pupil in an eye that can see things and pupils the world over are the same size within millimeters, how does an eye get that big? And I love "slab of white marble" in the guy's mouth. And I hate to mention it, really- in those interviews with Maddow I didn't like Sharlett. Something beneath surface I can't put my finger on, something he is saying or not saying. I have heard fundamentalist people talk about "God wants a Christian to do well in all things, including in wealth". It turns my stomach; it seems totally alien to the whole concept of love and compassion. I've had a few conversations on it with my fundamentalist preacher brother- and he truly believes it. I have no idea where he got it- certainly not from the Bible he espouses. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 02 Oct 09 - 09:17 PM update on the C Street cult of politicians: Illicit Sex and Illegal Lobbying Are All In a Day's Work For Christian Right's Sen. Ensign "Now comes word, through some masterful reporting by New York Times journalists Eric Lichtblau and Eric Lipton of even more hanky-panky than was previously revealed." CLICK HERE |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Stringsinger Date: 03 Oct 09 - 12:53 PM Ebbie, metaphors are for dramatic purposes. Sharlett is a journalist but is obviously trying to make a point about the character of the people in the Family. If it wasn't for him, we would still be in the dark about this pernicious organization. No one else had the temerity to cover it. We have become so complacent and enabling in this country that we often in annoyance turn on the messengers of important messages. Micheal Moore is now catching hell for his observations which are IMNO quite truthful. I think we should be thankful for those who have the courage to tell the truth and support their efforts instead of tearing them down. Frank |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 04 Feb 10 - 09:48 PM President Obama and Secretary of State Clinton addressed "The Family" aka "the Fellowship Foundation" aka "The Foundation" sponsored prayer breakfast in D.C. today and brought up the issue of the Uganda proposed legislation against gays. Obama criticizes Ugandan anti-gay bill at prayer breakfast (CNN.com) |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: mousethief Date: 04 Feb 10 - 10:22 PM I'm rather disappointed he's met with them at all. O..O =o= |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Bill D Date: 04 Feb 10 - 10:43 PM It's sad he needed to, but just like the Q&A session with the Republicans a few days ago, he used their own venue, with public TV access to call them out on some things...along with Hillary. Maybe next year, he won't be invited. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Ebbie Date: 04 Feb 10 - 10:45 PM Very true, Stringsinger. However, it is also necessary to check the messenger. |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: akenaton Date: 05 Feb 10 - 03:25 PM I dont believe in the "Death penalty", but anyone suffering from hiv/aids, who has sex without informing their parner of their condition is in my opinion guilty of a serious crime. If the sex is non- consentual then the crime is much more grave. Life imprisonment? I am referring to heteros and homos. Does anyone know why Obama is against homosexual marriage, or is it simply another example of homosexuals used as political pawns? |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: beeliner Date: 05 Feb 10 - 04:48 PM "The Eye of the Needle was a low and narrow gate in the walls of Jerusalem. In order to get a cemal through it was necessary for the baggage the camel was carrying to be unloaded. Thus, by analogy, the rich man (the male embraces the female and vice versa in this sense) wishing to enter the kingdom of heaven had to unload his "baggage". Geddit? " The post quoted above is several months old, but since no once else seems to have "called him on it", and since the poster is active on at least one other thread today, I feel compelled to respond. The 'gate' explanation is an 'urban legend'. There was no such gate. There was no analogy with a gate. Jesus meant just what He said. http://www.biblicalhebrew.com/nt/camelneedle.htm http://www.debunker.com/texts/needleye.html From the lower link: "The Jerome Biblical Commentary is a standard reference work found in many libraries, written by Catholic scholars. Its commentary on Matthew 19:24 states bluntly, "the figure of the camel and the eye of the needle means exactly what is said; it does not refer to a cable or a small gate of Jerusalem." The Abingdon Interpreter's Bible is a major reference work compiled by Protestant scholars, and its analysis of this passage is in full agreement. Unfortunately for the fundamentalists, the concensus of New Testament scholars is that Matthew's passage barring rich people from heaven means exactly what it says. It remains to be seen how many of them are willing to give up all their wealth in accordance with the ideals they claim to profess." |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Donuel Date: 05 Feb 10 - 09:24 PM Bill? Where you been? We've been talkin bout this book since last Autumn. This group and prayer breakfast along with their dogmatic credo goes back to the 1930's |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: GUEST,Steamin' Willie Date: 06 Feb 10 - 12:36 PM Well, I have read this thread with interest. You see, here in the UK, we have a state church, yet in The USA, the declaration of independence reckons that government is secular. And yet..... The UK has very few practising Christians and an outsider could be forgiven for thinking The USA was a theocracy. Is it me, or bigotry and sanctimony so ingrained now that people actually believe the invisible friend justification for their pathetic outlook on life? |
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Subject: RE: BS: The Family From: Alice Date: 24 Feb 10 - 04:19 PM News UPDATE: The Family, aka C Street, aka The Fellowship Foundation Tax Status Of Lawmakers' Religious Refuge Disputed snip-- "...now a group of 13 ministers has asked the IRS to revoke that church status." --snip-- Article Here . Click C Street house target of clergy's IRS complaint --snip-- "...The clergy suspect that the C Street Center, which rents living space to lawmakers, is "an exclusive club for powerful officials . . . masquerading as a church," according to a request for an investigation addressed to IRS Commissioner Douglas Shulman." -snip- full article here CLICK Alice |
