BS: Where now Thatcher haters?

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Aug 12 - 03:31 AM

"It was based on the advice of the military"
With a little help from her friend.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/world-history/sinking-the-belgrano-the-pinochet-connection-7609047.html
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 12 Aug 12 - 03:16 AM

Mike, you've obviously got something going when it comes to blondes....Ruth Ellis, and now Margaret Thatcher.

I understand totally..... with me it was Barbara Windsor and Dusty Springfield, Mary Travers...andto a certain extent Jet Harris.

I don't like to think of you calling people cunts. You'll be shouting at people in the park as you eat your pasty, and going round with a dog on a piece of string - not the way to go at our age.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 12 Aug 12 - 02:10 AM

Re the necessity of sinking the Belgrano ~~ what is the saying, just remind us, beginning "He who fights & runs away..."?

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Aug 12 - 01:39 AM

100
Belgrano WAS a threat to the UK service people who were Thatcher's first responsibility.
I would not like to be faced with such a decision.
It was based on the advice of the military.

Subject: The best thing tRE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 12 Aug 12 - 12:24 AM

"The best thing to do with MtheGM is to ignore him. The man is incapable of saying anything beyond stringing together a load of unjustified and unjustifiable petty insults." Owen Woodson
.,,,,,

A real challenge there. Have been agonising all night to think of an insult petty enough for the fatuous Owen Woodson. Call him a Spurs supporter, perhaps? Or accuse him of thinking Thomas Mann a greater novelist than Jane Austen [assuming him ever to have heard of either]? Or perhaps just call him Gogglehead or Lollylegs?

But I have just thought of the perfect one.

Owen Woodson is an even more stupid and vindictive nonentity than Steve Shaw.
And ~ to avoid drift ~ neither of them fit even to be allowed to breathe the same air as Margaret Thatcher.

There!

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: ollaimh
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 10:22 PM

most of us were not culpible for the banking crisis. the culpible are the neo con free marketeers who sold the pie in the sky and thatcher was the most prominent of those.

in canada we had the liberals in power and the finance minister paul martin (briefly prime minister) and the pm jean chretien refused the banking and neo con lobby to deregulate. surprize none of our banks needed bailouts and none went bankrupt.

the present conservatives lobbied for the deregulation, and got the gift of a stable economy which they are wasdting on the two largest deficits in canadian history. that'[s the double think of the noe cons. the liberals ran eleven surplusses in a row.they paid down out debt by twenty per cent and the present government has pissed that away on fighter jets and prisons.

more inportantly though thatcher authorized torture in northern ireland. she was a monster in power from a long line of british governing monsters who allowed torture ethnic cleansing and starvation to be used as political tools. her minions developed the water boarding techniques and taught them to the americans. the noe cons abandoned a holistic view of society in favour of the rich and powerfull and they brought us back to inhuman abused that were briefly internationally outlawed.

in addition her economic success was only possible due to oil revenues that are now running out. then the problems of the real economy will become apparant to all. she was the first of the neo cons to sacrifice the manufacturing economy to create a financial sector dominated parasitic economy. now the parasitic economy is done and the manufacturing is gone.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: gnu
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 09:12 PM

I can't see that anyone knew what Thatcher knew at the time.

And, seriously now, what decisions are made and what decisions are dictated?

My Prime Minister tells me in the newspaper that Canada is in Afghanistan to "fight the Taliban'. What a load of fuckin horseshit. Yet he says it in the newspaper and on radio and on TV... with A STRAIGHT FACE... LIKE IT'S TRUE!!! Of course, that begs the question, "Who is stunned as me arse?" It ain't Harper. He is just a lacky. It's the Canucks that allow the bullshit at the polls.

Sooo, give Maggie a break eh? She didn't pull trhe trigger without some "help". Yes, it's far more complicated... IF ya know everything from hindsight ad ya don't understand or believe in field testing weapons and battle training troops (something the Brits and her allies have been at for well over a thousand years to ensure your safety and standard of living).

Are thee actions right and good in a strict moral sense? Maybe not. I am just glad Beth ain't pissed at me. Your mileage may vary. Good luck with that.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,mauvepink
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 08:54 PM

Yes, I understood the accidental italics Steve. That's fine

Well you make of my words as you will but they were heart meant and not cynical like politicians. Any loss of life on any side is always bad and I never see war as a justification. It's never the politicians sons is it? Yes, I am aware they all had mothers on all sides.

At that time I enlisted to join the Navy as a medic. Passed all the tests. Was only then told I was too old. I did not want to fight but I considered I had skills that could have been used to save life (on either side). I do not consider that action cynical like the words of politicians. I was fully aware men were dying.

mp

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 07:26 PM

Only the first two lines of the above should have been in italics.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 07:25 PM

Thatcher may have been wrong over certain factors to do with the Falklands. She should have been honest about the Belgrano. It was a threat: we sunk it. End of. Sad but very true. As for the loss of life. Well that is to be regretted on all sides and can never be justified. But we have been in far worse places morally since.
With respect, you seriously need to review this. The Belgrano was not a threat when Thatcher ordered its sinking (an event which she encouraged us to rejoice over - remember?) And you sound just like the most cynical of cynical politicians when you "regret" the "loss of life" (aka "needless slaughter??"). Every one of those hundreds of young men had a mother, you know. Your final sentence of the above quote would be a challenge to enlarge upon too.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 07:16 PM

Quite unlike Cockercunt, then, who is obviously a shining intellect capable of instantly evaluating objectively any argument or situation and coming to an infallible judgment.

I rarely use such locutions on this forum; but, even here, I rarely come across quite such crass conceited cuntishness.

You're a disgrace, old boy, and a hypocrite to boot. I seem to recall your high-minded "righteous indignation" a few weeks ago arising from far milder criticism of your good self than this. I recommend a cold bath and another bottle or two of the cheap whisky that brought about this tirade. You never know - it might just keep you quiet.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 05:57 PM

Owen W: Noted. I have copied & pasted your comment to the file I keep of comments made on threads about me, favourable & otherwise. Some have called this a vanity: I prefer to think of a well-kept filing-system as a mark of efficiency.

Just for the record, here are one or two previous ones which might just demonstrate [if you are not too closed-minded to be convinced of the truth of the assertion] that your view is not entirely universal ~~~ all are fully documented by thread & contributor so their genuineness can easily be checked:~

Subject: RE: BS: Is Google getting political ?
From: Murray MacLeod - PM
Date: 25 Dec 09 - 02:52 PM
MtheGM, your posts on here (and on other threads) are shining beacons of dispassionate reasoning and fact in the midst of a sea of (mostly) fuzzy waffle.
Long may you contiunue to post on Mudcat.
=====
Subject: RE: BS: Muslim prejudice
From: Keith A of Hertford - PM
Date: 01 Apr 11 - 01:36 AM
Michael, your calm, reasoned and rational post is like a breath of mountain air in the fetid atmosphere of this thread.
Thank you.
==========
Subject: RE: BS: Racial stereotypes in retellings?
From: GUEST,999 - PM
Date: 28 Oct 11 - 10:05 AM
Michael (MtheGM) has much depth in matters folk. He's an accomplished writer and researcher, as a btw.
========
Regards ~Michael~

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 04:43 PM

call me what you like (though it is an awkward and ugly word you have chosen) but it seems a little bit unfair to accuse me of being 'objective' -the whole point of my post (ok, rant) was to say that i was not objective or logical in my irrational feelings towards thatcher (and her friends) just how it is.....on the other hand i am quite willing to read a defence of the current system from anyone who can make one......still waiting

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 04:02 PM

mauvepink. "But this latest lot have reached the depths of anything that could be called uncaring....."

I'm not sure what to make of that one. The years of the Thatcher regime were the most vicious I can remember in all of post war Britain. On the other hand, this latest lot are to some very limited extent constrained by the Lib-Dems. I seriously hope we never find out what can happen if Cameron and Co are ever able to govern with a tory majority.

BTW. The best thing to do with MtheGM is to ignore him. The man is incapable of saying anything beyond stringing together a load of unjustified and unjustifiable petty insults.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 03:32 PM

"Cockercunt,"
"In 1973 Augusto Pinochet joined a coup d'état which overthrew Allende's elected socialist government. In December 1974 the military junta appointed Pinochet as President by a joint decree, with which Air Force General Gustavo Leigh disagreed.
During his seventeen-year military regime in Chile, his security forces were responsible for the murders of 3,197 Chilean citizens. Of those, 1,100 were "disappeared" bused to death and buried in still-secret graves, or thrown from military helicopters into the Pacific Ocean. An estimated 30,000 Chileans survived imprisonment and severe torture by agents of Pinochet's secret police electric shock, beatings, near-drowning, and rape in secret detention facilities. In the mid-1970s, the Pinochet regime also organized a network of secret police agencies (given the code name Operation Condor) that coordinated the repression of groups and individuals who had been identified as opponents of the military governments of the Southern Cone (Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Paraguay, and Uruguay). Condor's methods included secret surveillance, kidnapping, interrogation, torture, and terrorist attacks. International efforts to hold General Pinochet legally accountable for human rights atrocities in Chile and acts of terrorism abroad led to his arrest for crimes against humanity in London in 1998.
During his 18 months house arrest he was befriended by Mrs Thatcher – this is a description of the 1999 Conservative Party conference:
…… was a packed meeting on Wednesday evening addressed by former Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, entitled "General Pinochet: the only political prisoner in Britain".
In a hall bedecked with Chilean flags, Thatcher was flanked by two Chilean senators, former chancellor Norman Lamont and Pinochet's son, Marco Antonio. Met by rapturous applause, she decried the extradition proceedings against the former dictator as "international lynch law", She described his arrest as "judicial kidnap" and the equivalent of a "police state".
Her description of Pinochet:
"I'm also very much aware that it is you who brought democracy to Chile, you set up a constitution suitable for democracy, you put it into effect, elections were held, and then, in accordance with the result, you stepped down."
General Pinochet said it was an honour to have Lady Thatcher there at the "simple house" on the estate, and thanked her for her "kindness.

There but for the grace of…. Whoever, nearly went Britain.

Thatcher's legacy:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/southyorkshire/content/articles/2009/03/02/lesley_boulton_orgreave_photo_feature.shtml

Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,Sugarfoot jack
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 02:28 PM

Nice.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 02:13 PM

"when she was leader she was an embarrassment - shrill, ignorant and proud of the fact that she was unable to change her mind or consider the merits of any other argument other than those put in front of her limited understanding"
.,,.
Quite unlike Cockercunt, then, who is obviously a shining intellect capable of instantly evaluating objectively any argument or situation and coming to an infallible judgment.

I rarely use such locutions on this forum; but, even here, I rarely come across quite such crass conceited cuntishness.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,mauvepink
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 02:09 PM

I thought I knew what detestment of a politician meant back then. But it has taken latest crew to teach me the true meaning.

I was in the NHS back in Thatcher's reign (am I right in saying she was the first UK politician to have a brand of politics named after her? Thatcherism?). I was certainly aware what happened in the NHS and mental health back then. Community could not care less was more the branding.

But this latest lot have reached the depths of anything that could be called uncaring as I have witnessed in my life time. Daily I see what the cuts are doing to vulnerable people and our aged population. Tragedy does not come close as a descriptor. Compassion has been taken from the system with a vengeance.

Thatcher may have been wrong over certain factors to do with the Falklands. She should have been honest about the Belgrano. It was a threat: we sunk it. End of. Sad but very true. As for the loss of life. Well that is to be regretted on all sides and can never be justified. But we have been in far worse places morally since.

What happened to the miners is probably the most bitter non war scenario this country has seen in some years. Families and friends torn apart with a divide and rule strategy that caused so much death and hatred. The vestiges are still with us today. I cry when I see the end of "Brassed Off" every time because in my opinion Pete Postlethwaites words are bang on as to how the miners got treated and not just by the government. The taunting by the Police on picket lines was a very low moment in this countries Police history. It served it's purpose though in the divide and rule conditions. It was not right what some miners did but it was equally not right what some of the police did. No Police ended up in jail though. For me it was not Thatcher's war with the Falklands that ruined her image (it likely got her re-elected) it was her poll taxing compassionless war on the miners. I wonder if she ever lost one wink of sleep over the hardship she brought about to all those families?

Just like I wonder if this present crew lose any sleep over those struggling to survive now?

Hate as a word can never adequately cover the emotion that they are generating in caring people over the harm they are causing to innocent folks who have worked all their lives only to have it robbed from them now, their money, their health, their dignity. The rich get richer seems all they care about and it's all so very sad indeed :-(

mp

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 02:00 PM

From the Grauniad.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 01:58 PM

Sorry it's from the Telegraph:)

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 01:39 PM

i have to confess, when it comes to thatcher logic is not my strong point. from the moment she first opened her gob in public i have had an irrationally intense hatred that overrides any rational judgment. when she was leader she was an embarrassment - shrill, ignorant and proud of the fact that she was unable to change her mind or consider the merits of any other argument other than those put in front of her limited understanding by the likes of sinister goons like friedman, joseph, pinochet and reagan. i know there are others who are equally culpable - notably bliar- but they just don't get me in the guts like she did. that gove though - he has something of the same certainty/stupidity/ridiculousness about him. and he seems like a right little tory boy creep. where now? just waiting for the party

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: theleveller
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 01:25 PM

Oh, and I suppose your implication that anyone today can achieve an academic qualification without a lot hard work and a substantial intellect isn't incrediby insulting to people like my son. Logic obviously isn't your strong point.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: theleveller
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 01:17 PM

"it's the last refuge of those lost for a decent riposte."

Perhaps you'd like to supply some evidence to back up that statement. Or is it, like your previous one, simply you trying to put across your opinions as fact?

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 12:43 PM

Ah yes, lets get personal, it's the last refuge of those lost for a decent riposte.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: theleveller
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 12:18 PM

"That was gained, long before the recent dumbing down of education."

What dumbing down are you referring to? What evidence can you supply to support this statement. Would it be sufficient to gain you at least a 2.1 in a degree course?

Having closely followed my son through a History and Politics Degree course I can tell you that there is no dumbing down in education at this level. (He got a high 2.1, incidentally.)

Do you think that you have the intellectual capacity to gain a good degree today? You certainly have never demonstrated this on Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 11:17 AM

Where am I now? Right where I've been since May 1971. Just a itchin' and a scratchin' and a bustin' these goddammn' britches to dance on her grave and kick the headstone to bits.

"Where there is discord, may we bring harmony. Where there is error, may we bring truth. Where there is doubt, may we bring faith. And where there is despair, may we bring hope." At the end of the barrel of a gun no doubt.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 10:53 AM

What Shimrod. And Leadfingers.

Correction T'bus: Australian coal £8.00, UK coal £0.00.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 10:35 AM

See ya later! Thatcher Hater!
In a bit! Tory Git!
See ya later! Thatcher Hater!
In a bit! Tory Git!
Can't you see that the alliance
Is nothing more, its just the same old shit!

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 10:22 AM

i'm not quite sure how to respond to the furiously intellectual point above.....however. maybe the right or well-connected don't need to be that clever to succeed, they may reach the top with a bit of charm and a lively social life. not so easy for the left who - while we are past the days of workers' reading groups and pedalling to kinder scout trespasses while discussing marx and cuba in a cloud of pipe smoke, do need to work harder and be brighter than the tory types. relatively easy for a young graduate to live and find work in london if they can rely on their parents' money - otherwise its a struggle. once you realise that the rules are grossly unfair - to be 'left' is only natural for anyone with half a brain who isn't directly benefitting from the indulgence of friends of daddy.
despite asking -genuinely- for a reasoned argument from the right in favour of the current system of global capitalism and its gross injustice and inequalities, i've never seen one on here any more intellectual than 'well it's better than mao or stalin' - not good enough you twerps!

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 09:29 AM

"the right wing tends to eschew people who actually think."
.,,.,.

Whereas the left is peopled exclusively by intellectual giants...

teeheeteeheeteeheeteeheeteehee·hahahahahahahahaha......

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Stu
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 09:07 AM

I know she was a scientist and that she invented Mr. Whippy ice cream, in my view about the only thing she deserves credit for.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 08:57 AM

Is "Where now Thatcher haters?" sung to the same tune as "What Now My Love" ?

Scansion's a bit tight, but it's doable.
So what are the rest of the lyrics ?

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 08:53 AM

She bade us rejoice over the outrageous deaths of hundreds of young men on the General Belgrano, for which she was personally responsible. She gave succour to a vicious dictator and friend of hers, General Pinochet, who was responsible for tens of thousands of deaths of his "opponents". There is plenty of reason to hate, and hate is not always misguided. I don't care whether she's alive or dead. That's worse than wishing her dead.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 08:48 AM

I believe she was the first, and so far only PM to hold a science degree.
That was gained, long before the recent dumbing down of education.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Stu
Date: 11 Aug 12 - 08:19 AM

Thatcher was never really clever, the right wing tends to eschew people who actually think.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Greg F.
Date: 10 Aug 12 - 06:26 PM

Naah, Bruce- she's more like Ronnie Reagan without the senile dementia.

Making her a lot more dangerous.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 10 Aug 12 - 05:59 PM

In some ways she [Thatcher] reminded me of Golda Meir. Heartless bitch, but very smart gal.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Musket
Date: 10 Aug 12 - 03:58 AM

Don't dig the bugger up!

You'll ruin the sprung dance floor Al......

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Aug 12 - 03:25 AM

Where now...though?

Perhaps we cou;d form a social club and have outings to Blackpool on the bus. On the back seat we could have a sing song - Which side are you on, Glad to be Gay, Things Can Only get Better, that sort of thing.

As we are all socialists, we could have crates of champagne, and frequent stops for having a wee.

We could have fancy dress nights - The general Galtieri costume being particularly popular. A quiz night called 'On Yer Bike!'. An Irish Reconciliation night with the IRA, where we tell Frank Carson jokes about thick paddies. A race night, where we suck up to the BNP.

Really hating Thatcher has so much more mileage in it - its a bit like the UK coal industry used to be - two hundred years of supplies just waiting to be dug up.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 10 Aug 12 - 02:49 AM

Out drinking in Mansfield with my sons last Saturday. (Celebrating that I am to become a Granddad,) and was drinking a nice hand pull of something or other for £1.80 a pint.

The barmaid was nice, polite and courteous. Wonder if she used to work at No.10?

zzzzzzzzzzz

(CLANG!!!). Just pointing out I have been to No.10 a few times, receptions and once to a meeting. The staff under Bliar certainly seemed happy. They didn't flinch if I raised my arm too quickly or seemed impoverished? Presumably they were the same people employed by the same department and managed by the same system as under any ruddy Prime Minister. They don't work for the PM, they work for the civil service. Ministers and advisors are the ones getting the likes of Broon's hair dryer. Newspapers may report staff attitudes to ministers but staff are bound by The Official Secrets Act and a contractual code of conduct, so whilst views will out by heresay and indiscretion, I wouldn't use them myself to judge how a PM ran the bloody country.

Not too sure of the relevance of your point?

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 07:20 PM

sounds like one or two gross generalisations here - some tories are probably quite good to their servants. but them bullingdon club types seem a bit rude. and beer is not well over £3 here - a pint of jennings bitter -£2.70

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: sapper82
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 04:11 PM

And to comment further, despite the Left's hatred of Margaret thatcher and the Tory's tag of being called "The Nasty Party," it's ironic that, amongst the drivers, cleaners, table servers and other support functions at No.10 and Westminster, Tories tend to have a better reputation for showing a great deal more respect and consideration than their successors.
Lady Thatcher herself was very well liked by the staff at No.10 in stark contrast to Gordon Brown!

Perhaps the Tories are viewed as being "nasty" in the same way that a dentist, having to carry out painfull treatment to remove or repair a tooth after years of neglect and misuse can be viewed as nasty?

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: sapper82
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 03:56 PM

To cut and pates from a post of mine elsewhere on the net:-

The Steel Industry in 1979 required a bailout of £1.8billion from the taxpayer to cover losses. Given that the price of a pint of ale was about 25p to 30p and is now well in excess of £3.00, that is the equivalent of over £20billion today.

The steel industry had VAST over production problems no one was previously prepared to face. Most of the production at plants like Ravenscraig was going into storage in open air stockyards and either waiting up to 24 months for dispatch to Vauxhaul, BL or Fords, or being scrapped and going back into the smelters.

That habit of sending steel sheet out to the customer that had been stored for so long was one of the causes of the poor reputation the British Car Industry had for rust.

Going to alternative suppliers, who were rolling to order, during the 1980 steel strike opened the customers eyes to the poor quality product British Steel was providing because of the stockpiling policy and was the death knell of large parts of the industry.

What was left was a much smaller, but much healthier steel industry more matched to it's market.

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 01:42 PM

Richard....if it wasn't for Mudcat and another couple of forums, I would have binned it long ago......still might, if I get any more aggro!

Cost £80 on ebay.....dont know if it was a bargain :0(

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,Cs
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 08:00 AM

As for grabbing whats going. Probably not a bad idea, copy the banks! Max out the credit card then scarper (as the previous tenants of our current home appear to have done, at least if the debtors letters we receive for them are anything to go by!)

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 07:48 AM

I agree with Ake. Growing up a poor kid (council house, single Mum on benefits) in a highly affluent Tory area, I learned not to aspire after the consumerism and materialism of my peers. Instead I learned to despise the empty shallowness that such lifestyles represent, and I still do. I read Marx at sixteen during my A levels, and still believe he had the right of it.

My home is filled with hand me downs and second hand finds. The only valuable items I own, were saved for. My Mac took me a year. My camera took me two years!

I don't believe in credit unless it's needed to pay the rent, and if credit is needed to pay the rent then there's something wrong - probably with the high rents imposed by property owners that the working poor can't afford.

I loathe the materialism Thatcher issued in and Blair consolidated. I'm very much tempted to get away from Daily Mail England and move to Scotland before the Scots gain independence and it become harder for us sassenachs to gain entry!

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 04:40 AM

I think you were lucky with that guitar - I ahve seen many Suzuki guitars (not all the same maker) and most ahve been delights to hear. But you do have a computer...

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Stu
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 03:46 AM

Perhaps everyone isn't as lucky as you ake?

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Aug 12 - 03:30 AM

Hi Al... didn't mean to sound superior.
But I think the simple life might suit most people better than the rat race?
I've got an old kiso suzuki which I bought for a tenner years ago, and it still looks and sounds great.....I mean the tone, not the poor attempts I make at playing!

But being able to play a few tunes which are recognisible, is one of my joys. I am always amazed that I can manage it.

One things for sure the template of the last few decades is broken and we all must change our outlook on life.
We have to start dismantling the wasteful....and criminal capitalist system now. but we are still being assured by politicians and "liberals" that it can be fixed!

Perhaps we need another Thatcher....hopefully of a different political persuasion....   :0)

Subject: RE: BS: Where now Thatcher haters?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 12 - 06:57 PM

well bully for you Ake. but most of us were in the position of living within our means or having no cream buns for a period of about thirty years.

And you may well decide that you don't need cream buns, however what gives you the moral authority to decide that your family will go bunless?

Bugger it. flash the plastic, and bite the bullet at some later date. No use saying - I would have been a genius guitar player if I could have afforded that Gibson guitar. Find out by buying the bloody guitar. then at least you've been a man who once owned a Gibson guitar.

Sod prudence, and financial probity - in the long run we're all dead. Grab what's going - while you still have blood coursing through your veins - it doesn't last for ever. Nothing does.