What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: John Hardly
Date: 21 Jun 01 - 09:28 PM

Two more possibilities for smaller hands to try (no guarantees but worth a try);

Learn how little of your thumb is really necessary to fret the low E. Sometimes it's surprising how little is necessary.

Overdo the thumb so that the thumb frets the low E and dampens the A. Then play your fretted D,G,B, and high E strings. As long as the A string remains dampened the chord is still F and is still a movable chord. This is a solution because, even though the stretch for the thumb is further, the angle left for the three fingers isn't so hard to do accurately.

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: Marion
Date: 21 Jun 01 - 09:51 PM

Thanks Rick. I'll keep at it a while longer.

The Gmaj7 you describe doesn't feel that hard (unless I'm also supposed to be fretting a G with my thumb) - though I couldn't get to it quickly in the middle of a song, I can already play it clearly and painlessly in isolation.

Not sure I understand this: "Run your index and middle finger up and down the back of your guitar neck..to the point where you can really feel them stretching." Do you mean putting the back of the guitar neck in the V between my fingers then pulling my hand up towards the body? Or trying to make my fingers do "splits" (sideways, or one front one back?) on a surface?

Trying to learn the thumbed F capoed halfway up the neck: good idea, bad, or indifferent?

The hardest thing I'll ever have to learn on guitar, eh? That's encouraging in a way, and discouraging in a way. From your opening post, I had the idea that it was an easier alternative to a barre F.

Thanks again, Marion

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: Marion
Date: 21 Jun 01 - 10:18 PM

Thanks, John, I'll see what I can do with your ideas as well.

Rick, or anybody knowledgeable about guitar specs: I looked at the "Mudcat vow" thread and found that you said something about needing a Gibson-style neck for this. According to the Lasido website, my guitar's nut width is 1.8" and the fingerboard radius (whatever that means) is 16". The Gibson website didn't include sizes in its specs chart... can anyone tell me if the Seagull neck size is in the right range?

Marion

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: John Hardly
Date: 21 Jun 01 - 10:46 PM

Marion,

Most Seagull's necks are wider and therefore harder to tackle that F on. The Gibson neck to which Rick refers is the narrow (some people say it's narrower than the old standard 1 11/16") neck. One thing you have going for you though is that I believe that the Seagull's also sport a shorter scale which means less tension and less reach--better angle of attack in first position. If you ever come across a Gibson LG or 00 (like the "Nick Lucas" reissue) try your thumb-over F on that and see if it doesn't suit you--besides that beautiful sunburst making yerownself at least 10% more attractive to thur opposite sex--I know it does fer me!

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 21 Jun 01 - 11:38 PM

Dammit ted, don't tell Marion about the "C barre" form!!

Actually, you can play some pretty good guitar without having to use that little bugger, whereas the Thumb F gives you that nice low bass and can used up and down the neck.

Yup split those fingers into a "V". My mum told me about this one. Seems when she was a kid, her piano teacher had a couple of polished dowels sticking up on either end of the ol' upright. She'd have the little girls force their little fingers onto it and slide up and down. She swore by it, and the proof was my Mum could easily do a 10th (C octave plus 2) on the piano and I with bigger hands could barely reach the octave.

Naturally these Thunb chords (which are played by merle travis, Chet atkins, and a lot of others, are easier on a narrow neck guitar, but I've never worked with anyone (in person) who wasn't able to nail it with a little work. (do you ever get to Toronto Marion?)

Now, John Hardly makes a good point. You don't need MUCH of the thumb...literally just the tip. Try it.

And from that Segovia of lyrics Bob Dylan, here's a GREAT and simple way to play an odd Eb without struggle. He used it in "Baby Let Me Follow you down"

play a normal C chord (five string version). now put your pinky on the first string third fret (G note). Now just slide the whole sucker up three frets. Don't play the sixth string. Presto, Eb.

Cheers

Rick

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: Marion
Date: 22 Jun 01 - 02:09 PM

Here's

Subject: RE: What the 'F' is goin' on at Mudcat?
From: Marion
Date: 22 Jun 01 - 02:23 PM

I'll try that again:

Part 2

Marion