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Origins: Bury Me Beneath the Willow

Goose Gander 03 May 05 - 01:19 AM
Stewie 03 May 05 - 04:27 AM
open mike 03 May 05 - 11:39 AM
GUEST,Dale 03 May 05 - 11:57 AM
Q 03 May 05 - 03:48 PM
open mike 03 May 05 - 05:39 PM
Q 03 May 05 - 06:18 PM
GUEST,Charley Noble 04 May 05 - 07:58 AM
Q 05 May 05 - 12:18 AM
GUEST,Jacki 25 Jul 05 - 10:07 AM
Charley Noble 25 Jul 05 - 09:52 PM
Kaleea 25 Jul 05 - 09:56 PM
Malcolm Douglas 25 Jul 05 - 10:13 PM
Kaleea 25 Jul 05 - 10:19 PM
katlaughing 25 Jul 05 - 10:51 PM
Q 25 Jul 05 - 11:41 PM
Richie 24 Sep 08 - 01:34 PM
the lemonade lady 24 Sep 08 - 01:42 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 02:45 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 02:54 PM
Amos 24 Sep 08 - 02:59 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 03:26 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 03:42 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 04:14 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 04:27 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 05:06 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 06:03 PM
Richie 24 Sep 08 - 06:08 PM
Q 24 Sep 08 - 06:21 PM
Richie 24 Sep 08 - 06:45 PM
Q 25 Sep 08 - 01:48 PM
Q 25 Sep 08 - 02:06 PM
GUEST,Q 25 Sep 08 - 03:13 PM
Fortunato 25 Sep 08 - 05:07 PM
Fortunato 25 Sep 08 - 05:09 PM
GUEST,Bob Coltman 26 Sep 08 - 11:55 AM
Richie 04 Oct 08 - 01:31 AM
Richie 04 Oct 08 - 01:35 AM
GUEST,Jaze 04 Oct 08 - 10:15 AM
Richie 04 Oct 08 - 01:16 PM
GUEST,Buddy 08 Dec 10 - 04:19 PM
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Subject: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Goose Gander
Date: 03 May 05 - 01:19 AM

I know that the weeping willow motif was used a lot in popular song in the 19th century, and it's probably much older than that, but I'm curious about the origin of the particular "Weeping Willow" done best by the Carter Family. Belden lists a couple of variants that are close to the Carter Family's version, but I'm having trouble finding references earlier than those two.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Stewie
Date: 03 May 05 - 04:27 AM

Meade's earliest printed citation for this is Sandburg's 'American Songbag' (1927), the same year as the Carter Family's recording and 4 years after the first recording by Henry Whitter in 1923. Other recordings earlier than the Carters were: Ernest Thompson (1924), George Reneau (1925), Kelly Harrell (1926), Ernest Stoneman (1926), Burnett & Rutherford (1926) and Holland Puckett (1927). [Info from Meade et alia 'Country Music Sources' p 197.

--Stewie.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: open mike
Date: 03 May 05 - 11:39 AM

there were often weeping willows carved on older grave head stones
100 years ago


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: GUEST,Dale
Date: 03 May 05 - 11:57 AM

From the song notes by Charles K. Wolfe in the book included with the Bear Family Box Set:

Bury Me Under The Weeping Willow was a song both Sara and Maybelle had known since childhood. Like many mountain songs, it was probably based on a 19th century parlor song though nobody has yet been able to identify an exact source.

(lists versions with a few comments)

One stanza which the Burnett-Rutherford version added at the end, but which the Carters did not use, was:

Upon my grave you'll plant a rosie,
Below my tomb a turtle dove,
To show the world I died to save him,
But I could not win in love.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 03 May 05 - 03:48 PM

The Carter Family sang two close versions- "Bury Me Beneath the Willow," and "Bury Me Under the Weeping Willow." Neither is in the DT. Words under the first title in the DT are an abbreviated version; by (?)Guthrie or (?)Houston? Not the lyrics given by Sandburg, pp. 314-315 ("O Bury Me Beneath the Willow"), but a version of the same song.

There are steam-dozen songs about females buried beneath the willow.

The song in Belden, collected in 1909, is a version of the same song, but some other citations, could be to different songs with the same theme of burial beneath a willow.

Looking through 19th c. song sheet collections, among the females planted beneath the willow are Annie, Kate, Ella Lea (Lee), Cora Lee, Nell, Mary, Carrie Lea, and several anon. On the male side are mariners, soldiers, anon. etc.
Stephen Collins Foster wrote one of the most popular; "Under the Willow She's Sleeping."

Finding the one, true, 19th c. antecedent will not be easy.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: open mike
Date: 03 May 05 - 05:39 PM

steam-dozen? how many is that?


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 03 May 05 - 06:18 PM

Wal, dash my buttons! Never heerd that?

A lot.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: GUEST,Charley Noble
Date: 04 May 05 - 07:58 AM

This one was an old family favorite of ours, probably from the Carter Family singing. I'll see if I can track it back further.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble


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Subject: Lyr Add: BURY ME UNDER THE WEEPING WILLOW (Carter)
From: Q
Date: 05 May 05 - 12:18 AM

Lyr. Add: Bury Me Beneath the Willow
Carter Family

My heart is sad and I'm in sorrow
For the only one I love
When will I see him, no, no, never
Till I meet him in heaven above.

Then bury me beneath the willow
Beneath the weeping willow tree
Where he may know where I am sleeping
And perhaps he will weep for me.
[Instrumental break]

He told me that he dearly loved me
How could I believe him untrue
Until an angel softly whispered
He has proven untrue to you.

Then bury me beneath the willow
Beneath the weeping willow tree
Where he may know where I am sleeping
And perhaps he will weep for me.
[Instrumental beak]

Tomorrow was their wedding day
But alas, oh, where can he be
He's gone, he's gone to wed another
And he no longer cares for me.

Then bury me beneath the willow
Beneath the weeping willow tree
Where he may know where I am sleeping
And perhaps he will weep for me.

Oh, them tattle-tale angels!. I haven't listened to the recording(s) recently; I don't think they are all the same.

Carter Part One

Lyr. Add: Bury Me Under the Weeping Willow (II)
The Carter Family

My heart is sad and I'm in sorrow
For the only one I love
When shall I see him? Oh, no, never
Till I meet him in heaven above.

Chorus:
Oh, bury me under the weeping willow
Yes, under the weeping willow tree
So he may know where I am sleeping
And perhaps he will weep for me.

They told me that he did not love me.
I could not believe it was true
Until an angel softly whispered
He is proving untrue to you.

Chorus:
[Instrumental break]

Tomorrow was our wedding day
But, O Lord, oh, where is he?
He's gone to seek him another bride
And he cares no more for me.

Chorus:
[Instrumental break]

Oh, bury me under the violets blue
To prove my love to him
Tell him that I would die to save him
For his love I never could win.

Chorus

Carter I


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: GUEST,Jacki
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 10:07 AM

The song I'm thinking about starts out:
"Oh I am sad my heart is breaking/ And I long for the only boy I love/ When will he come when will I see him? Oh nevermore again.
So let me lie and ease my sorrow / And sleep beneath the willow tree/ Some day he'll hear that I am sleeping / and then then let him think of me..." Anyone know that version?


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Charley Noble
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 09:52 PM

The first verse morphed in my family to:

My heart's in trouble,
I'm in sorrow,
Grieving for the one I love;
He's gone, he's gone to court another,
Will we meet in Heaven above?

Cheerily,
Charley Noble


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Kaleea
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 09:56 PM

I found this info. I'll dig deeper & see what I can find.

Bury Me Beneath the Willow
DESCRIPTION: The singer has been abandoned by (her) lover. Tomorrow was to be their wedding day, but now he is off with another girl. The singer asks her friends to "bury me beneath the willow... And when he knows that I am sleeping, maybe then he'll think of me."
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1909 (Belden)
KEYWORDS: separation infidelity love death
FOUND IN: US(Ap,MW,SE,So)
REFERENCES (9 citations):
Belden, pp. 482-483, "Under the Willow Tree" (2 texts)
Randolph 747, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (3 short texts, 3 tunes)
Randolph/Cohen, pp. 505-506, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (1 text, 1 tune -- Randolph's 747B)
BrownIII 267, "The Weeping Willow" (3 texts plus 4 excerpts and mention of 4 more)
Fuson, p. 126, "The Weeping Willow" (1 text)
Sandburg, pp. 314-315, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (1 text, 1 tune)
Abrahams/Foss, p. 58, "(Bury Me Beneath the Willow)" (1 text)
Silber-FSWB, p. 178, "Bury Me Beneath The Willow" (1 text)
DT, BURYWLLW*
Roud #410
RECORDINGS:
Burnett & Rutherford, "Weeping Willow Tree" (Columbia 15113-D, 1926; on BurnRuth01)
Carter Family, "Bury Me Under the Weeping Willow" (Victor 21074, 1927; Bluebird B-6053, 1935)
Jim Cole & his Tennessee Mountaineers, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (Crown 3122, 1931)
Delmore Brothers, "Bury Me Under the Weeping Willow" (Bluebird B-7741, 1938)
Red Foley & the Andrews Sisters (!), "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (Decca 29222, 1947)
Kelly Harrell, "Beneath the Weeping Willow Tree" (Victor 20535, 1925; on KHarrell01)
Asa Martin, "Bury Me 'neath the Weeping Willow" (Royal [Canada] 91402, 1932)
Lester McFarland & Robert Gardner, "Weeping Willow Tree" (Brunswick 199, 1928; rec. 1927)
Monroe Brothers, "Weeping Willow Tree" (Bluebird B-7093, 1937)
Holland Puckett, "Weeping Willow Tree" (Champion 15334/Supertone 9243, 1928)
Riley Puckett, "Bury Me 'Neath the Willow Tree" (Bluebird B-6348, 1936)
Red Fox Chasers, "Weeping Willow Tree" (Supertone 9322, 1929)
Lookout Mountain Revelers, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (Paramount 3143, 1928)
Almeda Riddle, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (on LomaxCD1707)
Shelton & Fox, "Bury Me Beneath the Willow" (Decca 5184, 1936)
Ernest V. Stoneman, "Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow" (CYL: Edison [BA] 5187, n.d.) (Edison 51909, 1927)
Ernest Thompson, "Weeping Willow Tree" (Columbia 15001-D, 1924)
Henry Whitter, "The Weeping Willow Tree" (OKeh 40187, 1924) (OKeh 45046 [as "Go Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow"], 1926)
SAME TUNE:
Carter Family, "Answer to Weeping Willow" (Decca 5234, 1936)
File: R747


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 10:13 PM

It's usually considered polite to credit sources, particularly when other people have done the work. The above is copied from The Traditional Ballad Index.

A direct link to the entry: Bury Me Beneath the Willow. The entry will change in time, and may well survive longer as an active repository than the Mudcat; which is why I don't believe that copying-and-pasting such things here is the best option, unless the information is corrected, expanded and amplified.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Kaleea
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 10:19 PM

Ok, here's the rest of what I found:

During a 1970's interview, I asked Mother Maybelle Carter about the song, "Bury Me Beneath The Willow ."

She replied, " That was a song we had sang all our lives. We first heard the song at a family get-together and decided to learn it. We did learn the words and sang it at all our family parties and get-togethers. The song became quite popular so when we recorded for RCA Victor in 1927--we recorded "Bury Me Beneath The Willow " on our first recording session in Bristol , Tennessee . The original version of the song was written by Bradley Kincaid."




Bradley Kincaid

(from son, James Kincaid) "Bradley Kincaid was twice nominated to the Country Music Hall of Fame which was nice in that he had been retired for almost 40 years (lost to Johnny Cash and Roy Rogers)."




Birth Name: William Bradley Kincaid
Induction Year: 1971
Date of Birth: 7/13/1895
Place of Birth: Point Level, KY
Date of Death: 9/29/1989
Place of Death: Springfield, OH



Former Occupations:
waiter
worked in a wheel factory
rode corn planter
district secretary of the YMCA in Lebanon, KY (1922-1924)
Education:
Grade School--Back Creek School (finished 5th grade)
Grade School--Stony Point School (attended only 3 months out of each year)
High School--Berea Academy (from 1914-1916, 1918-1921)
College--YMCA College (later called George Williams College) (from 1924-1928; earned a degree in sociology)



Career Milestones:

1926-first radio appearance on WLS National Barn Dance Show with the YMCA Quartet


1927--first trip to rural areas of the border states to collect folk songs


1927--first recording session with Gennett Records (owned by the Starr Piano Company) in December


1928--first printing of first songbook "My Favorite Mountain Ballads" in April (sold about 110,000 copies)


1930--moved to station WLW Connecticut


1933--worked on station NBC in New York


1945--moved to Nashville


1945--performed on the Grand Ole Opry


1950--decided to retire


early 1950s--accepted return offer from WLW (Cincinnati)


1963--after being retired for 13 years from singing, recorded again for Bluebonnet Records in Ft. Worth, TX; recorded 162 songs in 5 days




I'd suggest you do a search on Bradley Kincaid. I believe there are several sites telling about him, his history & career as a Musician.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: katlaughing
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 10:51 PM

Not the same song, but you might be interested in this weeping willow DEATH SONG by Paul Laurence Dunbar.

kat


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Subject: Lyr Add: BENEATH THE WILLOW TREE (Wilburn Brothers
From: Q
Date: 25 Jul 05 - 11:41 PM

So many. The Trad. Ballad Index is not much help since it concentrates primarily on versions of only one of the willow songs.

The verse by Jacki resembles in part a version sung by the Wilburn Brothers, but not the same. With the line including 'the only boy I love,' I suspect that it is a country song as well.

Beneath the Willow Tree
(Wilburn Bros.)

My heart is sad and I am lonely
I'm lonesome for the one I love
When shall I see her, maybe never,
Until we meet in a heaven above.
Oh bury me beneath the willow
'Neath the weeping willow tree,
So she may know where I am sleeping
And perhaps she'll weep for me.

Tomorrow was to be our wedding
But oh, Lord, where can she be.
She's gone, I know, to wed another,
She no longer cares for me.
Oh bury me beneath the willow,
'Neath the weeping willow tree,
So she may know where I am sleeping
And perhaps she'll weep for me.

(Not sure if this is correct, so I won't give it a 'lyric add.' Recorded 1950s?

The Batchelors sang a version of one of the willow tree songs in 1964, "Beneath the Willow Tree." I doubt if anyone remembers them.

I think the best 'willow" song is "Aura Lee." 'As the blackbird in the spring, 'neath the willow tree,' etc. No dead people here. Elvis turned it into that horrible parody "Love Me Tender."


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Richie
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 01:34 PM

Does anyone have the Belden lyrics from 1909? I believe he collected two versions presumably from Missouri.

Anyone have Henry Whitter's lyrics or Ernest Thompson?

It seems strange that with a song so widely known and popular that no associated parlor song from the 1800s can be located. It's close in lyric and sentiment to these two Stephen Foster songs:

Bury Me in the Morning Mother
1863 Foster

Lay me down where the grass is green, mother,
Beneath the willow shade,
Where the murmuring winds will mourn, mother,
The wreck that death has made.

Chorus: Bury me in the morning,
And mourn not at my loss,
For I'll join the beautiful army
That carried the Saviour's cross.


Under the Willow Stephen foster
Stephen Foster, 1860

Under the willow she's laid with care,
Sang a lone mother while weeping,
Under the willow, with golden hair,
My little one's quietly sleeping.

Chorus: Fair, fair, and golden hair;
Sang a lone mother while weeping,
Fair, fair, and golden hair;
Under the willow she's sleeping.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Richie


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 01:42 PM

Weeping willows often grow near water courses cos the roots need lots of water. If this is the case burying someone there would actually contaminate the water. Not sure you would have planning permission to do this nowadays.

I quote...The burial site must:

* Be at least 250 metres away from any well, borehole or spring that supplies water for human consumption or is to be used in farm dairies;
* Be at least 30 metres from any other spring or water course
At least 10 metres from any field drain (draining to a water course);
* Have at least one metre of subsoil below the bottom of the burial cavity, allowing a hole deep enough for at least one metre of soil to cover the burial;
* When the burial cavity is first dug, the bottom of the hole must be free of standing water.

Don't you just wonder why the human race isn't extinct!


ok.. i'll get my coat.

Sal


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 02:45 PM

Lyr. Add: UNDER THE WILLOW TREE (Belden A)

My heart is broken, I am in sorrow
For the only one I love.
I ne'er shall see his face again
Unless we meet in heaven above.

Chorus:
Then bury me beneath the willow,
Beneath the weeping willow tree,
And when he knows that I am sleeping
Then perhaps he'll come and weep for me.

They told me that he did not love me;
But how could I believe them true
Until an angel came and whispered,
'He will prove untrue'?

Tomorrow was to be my wedding day;
But gone! oh, gone! oh, where is he?
He's gone to wed another bride
And all alone he has left me.

MS Ballad book of Ada Belle Cowden, Boone Co., Belden version A, p. 483, H. M. Belden, Ballads and Songs Collected by the Missouri Folk-Lore Society.

Version B will follow in next post.

Belden had a third version, but it is Foster's 'Under the willow she's laid with care,' with one line changed.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 02:54 PM

Lyr. Add: UNDER THE WILLOW TREE (Belden B)

My heart is broken, I am sorry,
Over the one that I love.
I know that I shall never see her
Unless we meet in heaven above.

Chorus:
Bury me beneath the willow,
Beneath the weeping willow tree,
And when she knows that I am sleeping
Perhaps she'll sometimes think of me.

Once she told me that she loved me;
How could I think her untrue
Until an angel whispered softly,
'Oh, she does not care for you'?

Tomorrow is our wedding day.
Where, oh, where is she?
She's gone to love another fellow.
Oh, she does not care for me.

Secured in 1909. Role of sexes reversed.
Version B, H. M. Belden, Ballads and Songs Collected by the Missouri Folk-Lore Society, p. 483.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Amos
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 02:59 PM

Those dang angels are always messing up human relationships!! I swan.


A


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Subject: Lyr. Add: The Willow Tree (19th c. English)
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 03:26 PM

Lyr. Add: THE WILLOW TREE

1
Oh! take me to your arms, my love,
For keen the wind doth blow;
Oh! take me to your arms, my love,
For bitter is my woe!
2
My love has wealth and beauty-
The rich attend her door;
My love has wealth and beauty,
And I, alas, am poor!
The ribband fair, that bound her hair,
Is all that's left to me;
While here I lie, alone to die,
Beneath the willow tree!
3
I once had gold and silver
I thought them without end;
I once had gold and silver,
And I thought I had a friend.
My wealth is lost- my friend is false-
My love he stole from me;
And here I lie, in misery,
Beneath the willow tree!

Ballads Catalogue 2806 c 18(337), Bodleian Ballads, c. 1815-1855, J. Pollock, North Shields.

The Bodleian has some 24 sheets with this song, some variant, dated fron c. 1913-1855 or so. It must have been popular.
This sheet has a parody, "The Apple Tree," which follows.


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Subject: Lyr. Add: The Apple Tree (parody, the Willow Tree)
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 03:42 PM

Lyr. Add: THE APPLE TREE: parody)
Parody on "The Willow Tree"

1
Oh! take me to your arms, my love,
For bright the moon doth shine;
Oh! take me to your arms, my love,
Or I'll take you to mine!
She left her bed, popp'd out her head,
"Begone! you rogue," says she;
Come down, says I, or here I'll lie,
Beneath this apple tree.
2
My love had wealth and beauty,
But soon her cash run shy;
My love had wealth and beauty,
But she had lost one eye.
Her foot, so fair, trip down the stair!
Her auburn locks so red;
Then in I crept, where Judy slept,
Beneath her tester bed.
3
Next morn I woke quite early,
And sat me up on end;
Next morn I woke quite early,
And sought to seek my friend:
My wife was gone- my friend was flown-
My love, he stole her snug;
So down I lay, in bed all day,
Beneath the worsted rug.

Ballads Cat. 2806 c 18(337), with "The Willow Tree," J. Pollock, North Shields, c. 1815-1855. Bodleian Collection.


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Subject: Lyr. Add: The Willow Tree (2)
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:14 PM

Lyr. Add: THE WILLOW TREE

1
Don't you remember the vows so tender,
You fondly pledged to me,
When the stars & moon so sweetly shone
'Twas under the willow tree.
You vow'd you'd ne'er deceive me,
And fondly I believed thee,
When the moon shone so sweetly,
Over the willow tree.
2
Why did you say my lips(1) were red
And made the scarlet pale,
And why did I, poor silly maid,
Believe the flattering tale.
I thought you ne'er deceived me,
So fondly I believed thee,
When you vow'd so sweetly,
You'd love no other but me.
3
Did you but know the silent tear
I've fondly shed for thee,
I never close my languid eyes
Unless to dream of thee,
And of joys that are departed,
I think quite broken-hearted,
And your wordd when last we parted
I love no other but thee.
4
Would I could tear you from my heart,
But that will never be,
Till I lie in the silent grave
Under some willow tree.
Then should you this way wander
You'd heave a sigh and ponder,
In her cold grave lies yonder,
The girl that died for me.

Harding B11 (3284), c. 1813-1838, J. Catnach, London, Bodleian Collection.

(1)
Why did you say my cheeks were red,
Yet make those cheeks look pale,
etc.
Firth b25(434), Bodleian Collection, J. Harkness, Preston, c. 1840-1866


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 04:27 PM

"The Willow Tree," version beginning 'O take me in your arms, love, was printed by J. Evans, London, c. 1780-1812; Firth B25(210) and other copies.

The parody, "The Apple Tree," also may go back to the late 18th c.; a copy printed by J. Pitts, London, c. 1802-1819, is in the Bodleian Collection, Harding B16(199b).


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 05:06 PM

Sheet music at American Memory has sheet music for "Beneath the Willow Tree," "Words by Thomas Dibdin, Music by J. B. Herbert," 1884, Balmer and Weber, St. Louis.
It is the version beginning 'Oh! take me to your arms my love,/ For keen the wind doth blow,...' (See version from the Bodleian, posted 24Sept08, 0326PM), but with changes.

I have the book by T. Dibdin, "Songs by Charles Dibdin, with a Memoir," 1875, which compiles the songs by Thomas and C. Dibdin Jr. as well as Charles Dibdin; "The Weeping Willow" song is not included, so I don't think it is a song by any of the Dibdins.

I left out the last four lines of the first verse of the version posted 24Sept08, 0326PM. Here is the verse:

THE WILLOW TREE

1
O take me to your arms, love,
For keen the wind does blow,
O take me to your arms, love,
For bitter is my woe;
She hears me not, she cares not,
Nor will she list to me,
Whilst here I lie alone to die,
Beneath the willow tree.

Sorry, mayhap a clone can correct my mistake.


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Subject: Lyr Add: BENEATH THE WILLOW TREE (Dibdin, Herbert)
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 06:03 PM

Lyr. Add: BENEATH THE WILLOW TREE
"Words Thomas Dibdin" Music Dr. J. B. Herbert

1
Oh! take me to your arms my love,
For keen the wind doth blow,
Oh! take me to your arms my love,
For bitter is my woe.
She hears me not, she cares not,
Nor will she list to me.
She hears me not, she cares not,
Nor will she list to me.
And here I lie in misery,
Beneath the willow, the willow tree.
2
I once had gold and silver,
I thought them without end,
I once had gold and silver,
I thought I had a friend;
My wealth is lost, my friend is false,
My love is stolen from me,
My wealth is lost, my friend is false,
My love is stolen from me,
And here I lie in misery,
Beneath the willow, the willow tree.

Nothing new, but one of the printings in the U. S. I doubt the words are by Thomas Dibdin. Sheet music, 4/4, for bass solo; 1884, Balmer & Weber, St. Louis

The Lester Levy Collection has sheet music, no date, "Words by T. Dibdin, music by John Braham," G. E. Blake, Philadelphia, as sung by Mr. Webster, 3/4 time; the lyrics are identical to the song sheet posted previously, Bodleian Coll., Ballads Cat. 2806 c18(337), 24Sept08, 0326PM., which was dated c. 1815-1855 (and duplicated in other song sheets).


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Richie
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 06:08 PM

Wow Q,

Thanks for the Belden versions.

This version below (The Willow Tree) and your versions from the Bodleian are all similar but not the right song. Maybe they eventually evolved from an earlier similar source but the verses in Belden and from the Appalchians are distinct.

The real question is how did the same verses exsist in Missouri and in the remote parts of the southern mountains without being evolved from a single source song?

Collected by Randolph July 16, 1928: The Willow Tree
Mrs. Emma Chambliss from Anderson, MO.

The mournful night wind sweepeth,
About the lovely spot.
Where by now Mary sleepeth
By all but me forgot.

Under the willow
She sleeps and dreams of me
Death made her bridal pillow
Beneath the Willow tree.

Richie


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 06:21 PM

Haven't thought much about the relationships of the versions so far, but I am beginning to think that somewhere is an American version that breaks with the English versions I have posted. Dunno!
I'll look for more American versions because the whole thing has me bothered!

Money and wealth and a false friend don't appear in the Belden-Carter etc. lyrics. And where did that angel come from?


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Richie
Date: 24 Sep 08 - 06:45 PM

I hope the angel came from Heaven above.

Keep looking- you might find the source song.

Richie


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 01:48 PM

The tale-bearing angel is only in American versions, which lack the money and false friend problems.

Wm. A. Owens, in "Texas Folk Songs," says "This song, known in almost every Texas community, is often sung by soprano and alto harmonizing in thirds." He says it no doubt is an old song, but has not been able to trace its history.

It occurs from Texas to Illinois and east to the Carolinas, with collections in Arkansas, Missouri, Tennessee, Kentucky. Included in Sandburg's "American Songbag," no locality cited.
It seems to be quite similar in all collections, thus must have come from a song book, sheet music, or widespread periodical.

Owens gives a musical score, 4/4.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Q
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 02:06 PM

Should have noted that the song is only in Owen's 1950 edition, Texas Folklore Society, but was dropped from the later edition along with other songs that did not seem to be 'folk'.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 03:13 PM

ref


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Fortunato
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:07 PM

Perhaps it is a side note, but, as Open Mike noted above, it may be that the Weeping Willow is in fact the motif on the gravestone and not a physical tree. For the Willow motif was extremely common in the 19th century, presented in a variety of styles, this symbol was of German origin and usually represents frief, sorrow or mourning for the earthly life.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Fortunato
Date: 25 Sep 08 - 05:09 PM

I must add that this sort of thread is what has kept me coming back to the Mudcat, hoping to see just this sort of communication and sharing of data.

thanks, Ritchie, Q,

regards,
chance


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 26 Sep 08 - 11:55 AM

Given Bradley Kincaid's 1895 birth date, it seems highly unlikely that he wrote "Bury Me Beneath the Willow," since he was only 14 when it appeared in Belden's collection, already in tradition.

But Mother Maybelle Carter could still be on to something. Kincaid may well have collected the song. To stoke his repertoire for his radio shows, Bradley would circulate in the mountains, particularly in his native Kentucky, looking for old songs. In doing so, he may have been among the earliest to find a version of it, to popularize it on the radio and publish it in one of his song folios. Thus he could have been the primary person to spread the song on early media.

Kincaid's folios are a valuable source of many early versions of traditional songs, along with some composed ones like Put My Little Shoes Away. Bury Me Beneath the Willow would thus have been a song he collected, not one he wrote. The folios in particular confused many people, who were used to thinking of songs in folios as being written by the singer unless specified otherwise.

That may be the source of Maybelle's remark. Bob


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Richie
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 01:31 AM


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Richie
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 01:35 AM

Hi Bob,

I agree with you, Kincaid didn't write the song. He may have copyrighted the song. But more likely he had a version that the Carter family learned.

Here's my painting of the song on my new blog:

http://richardmattesonsblog.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2008-10-02T08%3A22%3A00-07%3A00&max-results=7

Sorry for that last post.

Richie


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: GUEST,Jaze
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 10:15 AM

There was a clip on Youtube from the old Dolly Parton show of Dolly, Emmylou Harris and Linda Ronstadt doing a nice version of this song. Don't think they ever recorded it,though.


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Subject: RE: Origins: 'Bury Me Beneath the Weeping Willow'
From: Richie
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 01:16 PM

Here's the Carter Family:

http://honkingduck.com/78s/listen.php?s=20404A

You can hear it played by Tony Rice, Alison Krauss, David Grisman, JD Crowe, and Mark Schatz on UTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzA68Ohwke4

Richie


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Subject: RE: Origins: Bury Me Beneath the Willow
From: GUEST,Buddy
Date: 08 Dec 10 - 04:19 PM

When I learned it.It started(Make my Pillow Beneath the Willow). Maybe it was,Lay my Pillow. It doesn't matter it's still a good song.


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