BS: Stupid people and dogs

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,Peace
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 05:03 PM

Had a full-size collie defend me from a bear when I was two. Between Queenie and my uncle who came out with an axe, they drove the bear off. Queenie was like that. I recall nothing about it.

Years later a small dog growled at my daughter who was about 1 1/2 at the time. I took her outside and had my .22. We were taking a trip to the dump. A neighbour (I was teaching on a reserve at the time) saw me and said, "My dad would love to have a small dog." I gave her the dog.

I do NOT allow animals second chances when they misbehave near children. AND, other than an ol' German Shepherd I owned--more like she owned me--I would never allow any animal to be alone with a child. Period.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 01:24 PM

Yeah, it is. I wonder how many people take it literally, though? ;-) I get email all the time telling me how I can enlarge mine (for a fee).

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: bobad
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 07:40 AM

LH, I think the "small willie" stuff is a metaphor for self image, that's the way I've always seen it anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Big Andy
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 07:33 AM

The same thing happened around Wakefield a year or two back, and the teenage parents were out around town within the week pub crawling as normal. Some people cant be trusted to look after kids, and there's so many of the above people that if the social services took there kids of them the bill for looking after the kids would bankrupt the country. Sorry but i cant see this been the last.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: catspaw49
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 07:07 AM

Its already been stated in different ways, but dogs do not think like humans. There is probably nothing more important to remember when training or playing or in any way interacting with a dog. Sure, we give them the full range of human emotions and like to "talk" and think for them (Does the good boy want a donut?) but dogs aren't wired the same way we are.

Play and games that seem harmless are often teaching the dog a behavior that can be dangerous later.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Anne Lister
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 04:20 AM

The baby was attacked by two dogs, one a Staffordshire and one a Jack Russell. The baby was being cared for at the time by the grandmother, and the dogs were, according to neighbours, very friendly normally. I'm not sure the term "idiot" applies here - but clearly people need to realise that they should never leave a baby or small child alone with a dog for all the reasons mentioned above.

The story hit home here as it happened just a few miles away but also because a day or so earlier I'd been working on a song with a group of children about the famous folk tale of Bedd Gelert, in which a dog is killed on suspicion of eating a baby when in fact it had been defending the child from a wolf.

Anne

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 04:08 AM

"It's my opinion that people who get Rotweillers and Pit Bulls are trying to compensate for a small willy."

Not exactly, Kendall. I think what they are trying to compensate for is a small self-image. If they have a small self-image, however, then they may well also imagine that they have "a small willie", but the size of their willie is simply not a relevant factor! ;-) It never is, in my opinion...all of this concern about the relative size of male genitalia is just utter nonsense.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,jOhn
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 02:35 AM

a 3 month baby was eaten by a dog this week, i have nowt against dogs (used to have one meself), but surely its time to stop idiots keeping them.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Wolfhound person
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 11:10 AM

Dogs are pack animals. This one was temporarily deprived of its pack - the grandparents -who might well have pack control of it when present. It was faced, unguided, with another pack of relative strangers, some of whom,(having myself seen small children with large dogs) probably displayed inappropriate reactions, like staring into the dogs' eyes.

Staring is a challenge, whether to Canis Lupus or its subspecies domesticus. Rottweilers were not bred as lapdogs: some of them are unpredictable at the best of times. Its reactions were going to be more extreme than a soft mouthed breed. So it did exactly what a wolf would do - it defended its territory by attacking the weakest member of the "opposing" pack, in this case.

I am very sorry for the family involved, but I'm afraid I cannot be surprised. They need educating before taking on another "pet". Dogs cannot be trusted with any small human they do not know, nor any child under 4 even if part of the family, until the child can understand some of the necessary rules of relating to a dog. Nor when separated from their bonded pack.

Happy New Year from me, my alpha male, my wolfhound cross and my border collie. Both of the dogs are rescues that we have made a pack.

Paws

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Donuel
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 10:15 AM

Dogs are thought to be less intelligent than their 99.9% ancestor the Wolf since dogs are a bit less self proficient. Are Wolves by nature not mean? I am sure they are nice to some but not so nice when hungry.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Donuel
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 09:56 AM

There is a guy up the street and walks 2 80 lb dogs. He often engages people on the sidewalk while the dogs ensnare the passerby in the leashes. Its funny the first time.

I asked another guy if he needed some plastic bags for his dog's waste. No reponse...except for 6 months afterwards little bags of dog poop were tossed on our driveway and yard. I guess that showed me not to remind this fellow of anything.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Bobert
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 08:44 AM

Dogs by nature aren't either stupid or mean...

People???

Nuff said...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: john f weldon
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 08:32 AM

The words: "gee he's never bitten anyone else before" are commonplace in my life.
I must look particularly yummy.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: kendall
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 08:11 AM

We do tend to forget that Rover is an animal because we think of him as one of the family. Under the right circumstances, any dog will bite. The thing with Pit Bulls is, when they do bite, they will not let go unless encouraged to do so by a baseball bat between its ears, or a bullet through its brain.

I have been bitten once in my life, that was by a friend's miniature Poodle. I have little use for little dogs.I call them yapping nippers.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 06:14 AM

While there may be question marks over the breed (and it's not an animal I'd choose), to be honest from what I've read about this particular tragedy, I'm far from convinced I would have foreseen what was to happen.

Re. Kennel club and bred dogs: I like our mongrel, thanks

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 04:42 AM

Insurance companies will of course sieze any opportunity to avoid payment, but the verb to "lay" is transitive.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 31 Dec 07 - 01:01 AM

Many insurance companies here will not insure your house if you have a Pit Bull.

In Texas it is illegal to write breed-specific legislation (state law trumps municipal laws). And so far the insurance companies seem to be laying low about not insuring owners of specific breeds. But I don't advertise that I have either of my dogs. And when the insurance company roof adjustor was here to look at my roof in early November I made sure both dogs were out of sight.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 07:47 PM

My reaction was to feel sad for everyone involved. I've got no need and no right to do anything more than that, and I don't think any of us have.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Sorcha
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 07:36 PM

I'm staying out of this one. Everything I'd have said has already been said.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 07:09 PM

But you need to deduct the difference in human brain power

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: bobad
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 07:08 PM

Yeah right Midchuck, like how many times has a cat saved Timmy when he's fallen in the well?

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Midchuck
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 06:36 PM

We have no dog.

Four cats.

By my computation, that gives us 20 times the total pet IQ points of a one-dog family. And I DON'T mean to say that cats are really smart.

Peter.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 05:51 PM

Just the first two words will have done - Stupid People. All animals can be killers. And I include cows, sheep, hamsters and bees when it comes to contact with babies! It is up to people to ensure youngsters are not put in danger.

One thing I would say. It may be right to put the animal down for various reasons but I very much doubt that it is ever the animals fault.

Dave.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: katlaughing
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 04:39 PM

I had a veterinarian friend tell me that young, crawling children are seen as prey by dogs, at least until they start to walk. We have always had to watch our McNab border collie around our grandson as he would grumble at him, esp. if he got too close to his face. We had a velcro, 2 strap muzzle we put on him when he'd been esp. grumpy and he was very ashamed when he wore it. He has not had to wear it in many years. He LISTENS very well, plus our grandson is now four and understands more about how to be careful around ANY dog and they get on well now.

I get more concerned about the "pack" at my daughter's house, 3 female boxers under the age of 2 and a very sweet OLD pit bull female known as Nanny Dizzy. For the most part they do well, but a couple of times the pack mentality as kicked in and the two alpha females asserted themselves. Steps have been taken to prevent it every happening again. They all have crates, they get extra exercise on a treadmill of all things (!) and eat in separate areas, plus my daughter and her partner are very vigilant.

I agree with SRS and Dan and others. It is not right to generalise about any breed; the people who have them are responsible for how they act/react.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: john f weldon
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 04:24 PM

On a lighter note....

I had a neighbour who owned an imbecilic Pit Bull, who couldn't even walk down a flight of stairs without tripping and falling down. He had an "I Love My Pit Bull" tee-shirt, too.

One day he went on vacation and asked me to walk the beast once a day. I'm too nice. Every day I took the thing out and endured the angry glares of passersby, as it lunged against its leash in a fury against all living things. I wanted to yell "Not mine! Not mine!", but who would have believed me?

The beast was lonely, of course, and when I got it home it would attempt to prevent me leaving by force! The only way to get out was to toss a piece of meat into the kitchen, and when the creature ran for that, I ran for the front door. I'd slam the door behind me, just in time to hear the thing crash head-first into the door behind me.

I have had two very lovely Guinea Pigs as pets, which are affectionate, docile, and have never bitten anyone. On the other hand, they're useless at scaring burglars.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Bert
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 04:06 PM

We had a pair of Airedales once. They are a breed which was bred to kill small animals. They were both really good with children, but were watched around young ones. The dog really loved babies and smaller dogs and puppies. The bitch was a bit of a bully and had to be watched around people who were scared of dogs. Oh and Airedales will nip with their front teeth as a sign of affection, they don't realise how painful it is.

We also had a German Shepherd one time who was really savage with smaller dogs. We couldn't train her to be nice to them and we couldn't run the risk of passing her on to somebody else just in case she behaved that way to a child, so we had to put her down.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: SINSULL
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 02:36 PM

A few years back, a huge St. Bernard turned on and killed a young boy in NYC. The dog had been the family pet for years and was completely gentles and safe with the children.
An autopy found a ball point pen jammed in the dog's ear.

Young children need to be watched around any animals.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,patty o'dawes
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 02:14 PM

Dogs are animals. Animals bite. Anybody who owns a dog who does not have the strength to unlock it's jaws - should it attack, should NOT have the dog. Simple.

Be it the slobberiest, cuddliest, wonderfulist canine in the world does not take into account the unexpected. I knew a couple with a weimeraner???? (the mink coloured beauties) - yes, it was fantastic with kids for eight years then bit their grandson, totally unprovoked.

The boy was stitched up, the dog was put down and the vet discovered it had early 'brain disease' - which could have led to the out of character behaviour.

Why do people want to own dogs that they couldn't control if the unexpected happened? But of course they are the type of people who can not imagine the unexpected happening. Figures.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: lady penelope
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 01:46 PM

I'm sorry. But the fault lies squarely with the parents. They went out leaving a teenager in charge of a seven year old and a baby, in a house that was not their home, with a strange dog.

The next in line for the bearing of fault is the grand parents. They bought a dog of a particular size and breed and did not treat the animal with the proper regard.

Personally I think this is a tragic demonstration of exactly how little thought these people had for their children. They bought a dog that is bred for strength through the body and jaws and thought it wouldn't be dangerous unless they wanted it to be. It's no different than leaving a loaded gun around the house.

The term 'pet' should never be used around dogs of any breed and many other animals that we share our homes with. It gives a false impression. All sorts of animals can easily cause harm if not treated with the proper respect. Even a rabbit can open an artery if you're not paying attention.

How long are people not going to be held responsible for killing their own children?

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: kendall
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 01:00 PM

Some years ago I saw the results of a survey that stated that the number one biter is the German Shepard. Last on that list was the Golden retriever

in the I.Q. dept. number one, the Border Collie, last the Afghan Hound.

Many insurance companies here will not insure your house if you have a Pit Bull.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: bobad
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:57 PM

I agree with SRS and Richard that it is the negligence of people to properly train and supervise their dogs that is the problem. Many people forget that dogs are animals and will often revert to animal behaviour in situations of unfamiliarity, such as being exposed to children if they have not been socialized to them. A dog who is not used to children and their often unpredictable movements does not perceive them as people and may feel that they are a threat and will react defensively. There are too many dog owners who are ignorant of the basic knowledge of animal behaviour and these people are irresponsible.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Emma B
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:55 PM

The Dangerous dogs Act was a classic piece of 'knee jerk' legislation; it was introduced after a series of attacks and has been widely criticised as 'rushed and ineffective'.

'The Kennel Club said it thought the dangerous dogs legislation was "poorly drafted" and not the solution.

Club secretary Caroline Kisko said: "It is the responsibility of parents, teachers and the government to educate dog owners and children with what to do and what not to do when they are in the company of a dog."'

from BBC news item yesterday

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:54 PM

What dog breeders have been advocating for years is, to me, the best way to go. Only allow licensed kennels to breed and/or sell dogs,. nobody else.
I have been involved with dogs all my life, both breeding and showing, and if we [my Mother and I] didn't like the cut of the jib of the person who wanted to purchase a puppy, then he/she didn't get to buy one.
Responsible breeders only sell to responsible people.
G.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Leadfingers
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:48 PM

I knew a guy who bred Rottwielers - He reckoned his were big softies , but ANY big dog can do a lot of damage with one bite ! The MP who is spouting that Rotts should be banned is talking rubbish ! The Dangerous Dogs Act is a Classic of Bad Law already .

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:40 PM

Generalizations about breeds of dogs are pointless. The people who set up the situation where the dog and the baby were left together were to blame. My vet told me, when I had an injured stray pit bull turn up and decided to keep her, that 70% of the reported dog bites are by Labrador retrievers. Bites, that doesn't list fatalities.

My dogs are dopey sweethearts, but don't walk up to the back gate or fence if I haven't already introduced them to you, because they'll make a big noisy fuss. Their job is to protect the yard and house. The yard is fenced and gated (locked gates) to prevent people from accidentally getting in. All meter readers and such have been accounted for (we had a transmitter put on the electric meter in back so they don't need to approach the yard, the only one of the batch who had to). If I've introduced you to the dogs be prepared for lots of slobbery kisses--they love company.

No breed of dog can be completely trusted in all situations, and you're foolish if you assume your dog is so completely safe that you can leave it in any situation and have it be a good citizen 100% of the time. Human supervision is required, especially in unusual circumstances.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:26 PM

Great Danes (well, the blondes, anyway) mostly kill by drowning people in slobbery kisses - or breathing at them, and their breath kills at 20 paces!

I was however a bit alarmed at Tenterden Folk Festival this summer by some people with a very big flash (by UK standards) camper van with two Airedales (or were they Giant Schnauzers, or Bouvier des Flandres - the old memory, you know - I think they were Airedales: one of the big wire-haired breeds anyway). I am pretty good with dogs and in my attempts to introduce myself (owners watching) they did nip harder than I would have let a dog of my own nip. Not damaging at that stage, but a potential warning.

Sometimes they were left out of the van on long leads, but mostly they were shut in all day while the owners folked. Clearly there as "guard dogs". Some people seem to set their dogs up to become potentially iffy.   

There are plenty of men and a few women too who think it is clever to have a "hard" dog and positively encourage their dogs to be aggressive to other dogs.

There remains a fighting dog cult in the underclass, too. Places in Essex are specialising in breeding so-called "Bulljacks" - oversized Jack Russels crossed with Staffs or Bull Terriers. Small, fast, agile at ground level, with jaws like a mechanical digger.

It's people that are the problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:23 PM

j0hn the dog belonged to the Grandparents, not the parents, and the children were at the grandparents house for a Christmas visit.
Not that it makes this ghastly episode any the less stupid, but just for the sake of accuracy.
G.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Dan Keding
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:20 PM

Neighbors,

Sad indeed when a person trains a dog to be mean or through cruel treatment it becomes vicious. Those people should suffer the consequences of their actions. Big dogs however like a Rottweiler or an Irish Wolfhound or a German Shepherd are not the cause of these tragic accidents. I have had many dogs and usually the bigger they were the gentler they were and the more careful around children. Dogs are a lot like people, they behave the way they have been treated and the way they have been shown by those around them.

Actually I think the breeds of dogs that are most likely to bite (not kill) are smaller breeds.

Dan

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Emma B
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:16 PM

My friend has a very large German Shepherd guide dog who has been trained to be very tolerant of small children, they can just as easily be trained to be guard dogs as seems possible in this case.

The combination of a strange dog and very young children is not a good one!
I think the owners were remiss in leaving the children alone without adequate guidance, but it is a terrible hard lesson to learn.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,jOhn
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:12 PM

From Emmas link=Police say nobody is to blame for this tragedy, its just one of them things etc"

Complete bullshit, kids parents are to blame for buying a 10 stone rottweiler when they have a 6 month old baby, fucving idiots.

Baby was 1 year old, when killed,bbc news say they owned dog 6 months, herefore, they they got dog when baby was 6 months old, idiots.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Bert
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:05 PM

You're right kendall, there are many large breeds that are docile and good with chidren. We had a labrador when we were kids and she was a darling.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Emma B
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:04 PM

A terrible tragedy!

Apparently the children were visiting their grandparents who owned the dog and had been left with a 16 year old girl looking after the 1 year old boy and a 7 year old girl.
It was the little girl who carried the baby out into the yard to 'pet' the dog while the 16 year old was out of the room.

story here

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,jOhn
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:02 PM

Sarge-Dog is alrrady dead, police shot it to protect the public, good idea methinks, how could they rehome a dog that had already killed a baby? who would want it?

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: kendall
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 11:55 AM

It's my opinion that people who get Rotweillers and Pit Bulls are trying to compensate for a small willy.
Now, I've known a few dogs of those breeds, and they were sweethearts. I wonder how many German Shepherds have committed homicide?
My dog is a Labrador retriever, he weighs 91 pounds, and he is one big yellowbellied,chickenshit poofter.

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 11:50 AM

The truly sad thing about this is not only did an innocent child die but likely, the dog will be killed as well all due to stupidity. Neil

Subject: RE: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 11:48 AM

j0hn mate, I couldn't agree with you more. So many of the people who have these big dogs think it is macho, and they use them as a substitute for a personality.
Poor wee boy, what a sad way to die.
Giok

Subject: BS: Stupid people and dogs
From: GUEST,jOhn
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 11:42 AM

A 1 year old baby was killed yesterday in Yorkshire, by a 10 stone Rottweiler, see bbc news website for details,
yesterday a newborn baby was killed by a rottweiler in Australia,
why do people buy big dogs, when they have little kids, and who needs a 10 stone dog?

are they fuvking stupid?

even little animals, hamster, kitten etc, can hurt a child, bite, scratch etc.

to see ultimate in stupidity, look at youtube site, see video=boy kicks dog".

If you are drug addict [dangeros drugs, like heroin etc], social workers can take baby off you, and give it to some people who will look after it properly.
maybe they should do this to peple with big dogs?

or tell them get rid of dog, or we take baby away.