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BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?

Related threads:
BS: Plastic Paddy slur (174)
Lyr/Tune Req: Plastic Paddy (Eric Bogle) (1)


Petr 16 Jun 00 - 08:08 PM
Alice 16 Jun 00 - 08:11 PM
GUEST,art 16 Jun 00 - 08:19 PM
GUEST,Bill H 16 Jun 00 - 08:28 PM
McGrath of Harlow 16 Jun 00 - 08:41 PM
GUEST,mary g 16 Jun 00 - 11:40 PM
Rollo 16 Jun 00 - 11:59 PM
Sorcha 17 Jun 00 - 12:01 AM
GUEST,Mrr-at-Mom's 17 Jun 00 - 12:05 AM
GUEST,Banjo Johnny 17 Jun 00 - 12:37 AM
Ron Olesko 17 Jun 00 - 12:39 AM
GUEST,Banjo Johnny 17 Jun 00 - 01:34 AM
The Shambles 17 Jun 00 - 05:12 AM
Sailor Dan 17 Jun 00 - 05:34 AM
InOBU 17 Jun 00 - 08:06 AM
Ron Olesko 17 Jun 00 - 04:56 PM
McGrath of Harlow 17 Jun 00 - 07:56 PM
GUEST,Antóin 17 Jun 00 - 08:33 PM
Brendy 17 Jun 00 - 08:35 PM
Irish sergeant 17 Jun 00 - 08:38 PM
bflat 17 Jun 00 - 08:50 PM
McGrath of Harlow 17 Jun 00 - 08:59 PM
bflat 17 Jun 00 - 09:15 PM
Malcolm Douglas 17 Jun 00 - 09:27 PM
Bluebeard 17 Jun 00 - 10:18 PM
McGrath of Harlow 18 Jun 00 - 04:58 AM
AllisonA(Animaterra) 18 Jun 00 - 06:35 AM
The Shambles 18 Jun 00 - 06:53 AM
InOBU 18 Jun 00 - 07:34 AM
bflat 18 Jun 00 - 03:53 PM
McGrath of Harlow 18 Jun 00 - 05:44 PM
GUEST,Nick 19 Jun 00 - 08:52 AM
Liz the Squeak 19 Jun 00 - 09:27 AM
Kim C 19 Jun 00 - 09:50 AM
SDShad 19 Jun 00 - 10:16 AM
barrygeo 19 Jun 00 - 11:01 AM
radriano 19 Jun 00 - 12:37 PM
paddymac 19 Jun 00 - 02:28 PM
Irish sergeant 19 Jun 00 - 09:23 PM
Irish Rover 20 Jun 00 - 04:56 PM
Brakn 20 Jun 00 - 08:47 PM
Racer 21 Jun 00 - 04:19 AM
barrygeo 21 Jun 00 - 04:49 AM

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Subject: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Petr
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:08 PM

This was a question asked of me last night at a session in Vancouver (by an Irishman). It makes me think of that recent thread on can whites play the blues?. Im not Irish but Ive been playing trad Irish fiddle music for several years now and really love it. I have given this some thought since people ask me where Im from and the occasional Irish person telling me which sessions to go to in Ireland and which ones to avoid as they are "full of fecking foreigners" (ignoring the fact that Im one of them) . Of course I followed another Irish musicians advice - which was 'f*ck em, just go and have a good time". But Im curious as to what other peoples response is to this topic, namely those who play some other cultures trad music. (I have my own which is Czech, and I play it as well) It would seem to me that if one is to stick to ones tradition - what are we to say about Van Morrison or for that matter Big Tom (Irish country music star) etc. Petr.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Alice
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:11 PM

I'm teflon - negativity slides right off.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,art
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:19 PM

play and be happy


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,Bill H
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:28 PM

Check out Eric Bogle's Song---PLASTIC PADDY. About a bar and the singing and all the Aer Lingus posters all around. Quite funny---and not offensive. In my never so humble opinion. If my opinion were humble it would be no opionion at all.

I fyou should see him in a concert ask him to sing it. You are certainly entitled to some laughter.

Bill H


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 08:41 PM

There's a great song by Enda Kenny, like Eric Bogle a first generation Australian, except he came from Ireland.

It's "I won't sing the Wild Rover" and it's about people who go out from Ireland and turn their back on Australia, and play at being in "Ireland Over Here". A different type of plastic paddy.

He's a great singer and songwriter, Enda - and at the same time, he's 100 per cent Australian, and 100 per cent Irish. And it's the same 100 per cent.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,mary g
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 11:40 PM

play whatever music you like as long as you are respectful. I find the term "plastic paddy" disrespectful. The worst word is "wannabe". I can't think of a way it could be used in a respectful manner and many ways it can be used to totally not just insult but really harm people...the concept is fine..but those words are not respectful...like calling people "oreos", "bananas" etc...people are doing the best they can, most of them, and if what they are doing doesn't hurt anyone I say let them be, enjoy your music and water will seek its own level musically.

mg


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Rollo
Date: 16 Jun 00 - 11:59 PM

Should I be reduced to my own folks' folk music I'd be very unhappy. Northern German Folklore was nearly extinguished by that devastating "Bajuwarian beer tent volksmusik" style. What they do here nowadays is either old dances and their tunes preserved and shown in tradition societies or some "volksmusik" crap blended with some coastal elements like seagulls in the stage decoration. But our own rich song and dance culture sung is dead.

So thank god for the hamburg irish pubs and the fun we're having there.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Sorcha
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 12:01 AM

Aren't there many of us who are 3rd, 4th, or 5th generation Irish, who have just discovered our "Irishness"? And are not most us obsessed with our Irishness? Does that not make us Plastic Paddies? I think probabaly I am, and it does not offend me. I am not one of the ones who stayed, and starved, and slaved for the Occupation Lords, if I had, I am sure I would have died.
Neither could I have personally, have traveled the Oregon(or any other) Trail--I would have been one of those who expired early, and had a wooden grave marker, now rotted to dust. So, what do we do about this? Forget? No, I don't think so.
We remember in pride, those of us who were allowed to survive, and those of us who survived because of the sacrifices of our ancestors, and so, we are (WHATEVER). Read here, Irish, Rom, Native American, Viking, whatever.So, here is a Toast to all our forbears,no matter where from, for having the fortitude to get us all where we are today, whether we are plastic or not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,Mrr-at-Mom's
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 12:05 AM

When I was in Ireland, I kind of chameleoned into the accent by osmosis, and was soon asked if I were a Plastic Biddy. I had never heard the term, and it was explained to me that a plastic paddy(male)/biddy(female) was an Irish person who had gone abroad and was now back, having probably lost their brogue to some extent (since after being in Ireland for a while they stopped asking me and just assumed I was local). I took it as more descriptive than insulting...


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,Banjo Johnny
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 12:37 AM

This guy that asked you that question, what a jerk. There is always someone who thinks he can build himself up by tearing someone else down. It don't work that way. Just ignore them and play. Talent transcends heckling. Johnny in OKC


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Ron Olesko
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 12:39 AM

Do you have to be from Jamaica to appreciate Bob Marley? Should classical music be loved only by the German people who gave us so many wonderful composers? Should only people from Minnesota listen to Dylan?

I am a Polish-American who absolutely loves Irish music and culture. Somewhere in my family history there are Irish roots. Does anyone know of an O'lesko clan? Please let me know!! :) I raise my pint of Guinness in admiration and thanks!!

By the way - the word brogue. In the interests of political correctness, you may want to re-think before you use it. It is my understanding that brogue is a Gaelic word for shoe. The English would mock the Irish saying that they talk like they have a brogue in their mouth.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,Banjo Johnny
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 01:34 AM

Or if you need a snappy comeback, try this. AMERICAN BY BIRTH, IRISH BY THE GRACE OF GOD! Okay to substitute Scottish, Polish, Bolivian etc. Doesn't mean much, but it usually gets a cheer. At least it stuns their little pea brain long enough for you to start another song, thus demonstrating where the true talent resides. Johnny In OKC.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: The Shambles
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 05:12 AM

A Bumbling Englishman. A link to the Mudcat Song Book.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Sailor Dan
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 05:34 AM

Ron O'Lesko

Is that Brogue or do you mean "brogan". In NYC I always heard a shoe called a brogan.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: InOBU
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 08:06 AM

Well, lets see... I was having a discussion with a member of my band, a truely wonderful flute player, who is not thrilled with the ballad tradition. I said, ballads are the soul of our nation, and he answered that he was not of the nation, though he was joking, I told him that playing the music as well as he does, he is part of the nation, and to make the music more than a comodity, he had to understand our shared consciosness, our soul as expressed in our ballad tradition, well that is it from me
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Ron Olesko
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 04:56 PM

Sailor Dan - I am sure you are correct with brogan, and it was shortened to brogue in the expression. I am far from an expert on the Irish language, but that is the explanation given to me for the term "brogue".


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 07:56 PM

"Should I be reduced to my own folks' folk music I'd be very unhappy. Northern German Folklore was nearly extinguished by that devastating "Bajuwarian beer tent volksmusik" style. What they do here nowadays is either old dances and their tunes preserved and shown in tradition societies or some "volksmusik" crap blended with some coastal elements like seagulls in the stage decoration. But our own rich song and dance culture sung is dead. So thank god for the hamburg irish pubs and the fun we're having there."

God, but that's a defeatist attitude, Rollo. There's crap music in every place. I'd guarantee you could find Irish music as bad as anything you've got in Germany.

"But our own rich song and dance culture sung is dead." So bring it back to life, and bring in some of the qualities you like in the Hamburg Irish pubs. You'll get up the nose of some of the people who've run your own traditions into the ground, but that sort of thing can be fun too.

One of the reason Irish music is so great is because people have brought back stuff from abroad and fitted it in. Like bouzoukis. If everyone over there is just playing Irish music, that kind of possibility would be closed off.

As forvtghecPlastiuc Paddy thing - from what I've seen, there are two sorts of people who come back to Ireland, or come into Irish circles abroad.

There are those who respect the country and want to understand how it works, and how it's changing. And if they're into music, they learn to appreciate it, and maybe to play it. And they can be as good as any and better than most, and noone with any sense is going to refer to them as "Plastic Paddies". And it doesn't matter what kind of race or nation they are. (The biggest cheers at the Fleadh Ceoil in Clonmel the last time I went were for a Korean singing Slievenamon, and for a couple of lads from Spain busking and playing the Galician pipes.)

And there are those who breeze in, in lurid green outfits, loaded down with tourist trash, likely made in Taiwan or somewhere, and act like they're doing everyone a favour by patronising them. And the only song they know is The Wild Rover, and they talk about the IRA as if it was a football team. And that's the kind of person whoever coined the term Plastic Paddy was thinking about.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,Antóin
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 08:33 PM

God bless all the "Plastic Paddies" in the USA and elsewhere. At least they're all seeking something different even if they do get led astray into the cul-de-sac of "Wild Rover" type repertoires. But here's an idea for maybe another thread; does anybody have a description of the many Irish in Ireland (the majority) who conscientiously and deliberately try and copy all things American in music, food and clothes fashions?. There used to be a term, no longer much in vogue, "Seonínism" to describe the Irish who tried to ape everything English. I think there is a need of a special term to describe our present day pseudo-Yanks of the Emerald Isle.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Brendy
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 08:35 PM

'Eejits' was always a good one.

B.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 08:38 PM

Just because some of us are two, three and more generations removed from our European "Motherlands" in no way invalidates our cultural identity! God save us all if we get wired into playing one type of music! "Plastic Paddy" seems rather offensive to me. I don't take much offense at things except possibly racial stereotyping. If they want to call me a plastic paddy, they are free to but I will likely tell them to bugger off. I can be rude, crude and socially unacceptable too. As to friend Rollo. Keep digging! I know the Prussian and Northern German culture must still have vestiges of music left not buried in Bavarian gemutlikeit. One example "Die gedenkin sind frie" (Ideas are free my German is rather rusty so the spelling may be off.) The song dates to the Napoleonic wars and was a pointed jab at French forces. Goodf luck and good hunting, reguards, Neil


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: bflat
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 08:50 PM

My brother took his fine surname which happens to be Polish and changed it to an Irish surname. He likes to pass himself off in this manner. Now that is a Plastic Paddy! Don't get the wrong idea I love him.

Now, I like the wit and talents of many Irish friends but I will say this with out equivocation there is not a group, in general, who are more racist and anti-jew; anti-protestant around. I live among the group....therfore I know.

I know I've tick someone off.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 08:59 PM

You're hanging round with the wrong set of Irish friends, bflat. If anyone's racist, anti-Jew, or anti-protestant, it doesn't matter how Irish they might be, or how witty and talented, you're better off without them. We all are.

Better a Plastic Paddy than a Fascist Paddy.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: bflat
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 09:15 PM

McGrath, I am puzzled by the behavior. One might think that years of English oppression might have developed a attitude of equality and tolerence. I'm in the midst of a community and man, I know of what I write.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 09:27 PM

Unfortunately, oppression tends not to make people more tolerant.  All too often, they simply develop a taste for oppressing others.

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Bluebeard
Date: 17 Jun 00 - 10:18 PM

Well now, I've just read through all the mailings on this and yes, I've been asked the same question. I look like an Irishman, I think like an Irishman but I sound like an Englishman. I was born and grew up in Manchester,(thank God it wasn't Birmingham or London !) Been playing music, much of it Irish, for 35 years and some people just don't get it. Play from your soul Petr: Being born in a stable doesn't make you a horse.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 04:58 AM

As Malcolm points out, people who've been oppressed can turn into oppressors. Check out Israel, Ruanda, Kosovo...

There are racist and sectarian Irish, and there are Irish who have died to fight racism and sectarianism.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 06:35 AM

As a 'merican with ancestry from the oppressed and the oppressors, (Irish/Scottish/English-with -a-drop-of-French) I would be hard put to stick to the single contry of my origin. Even as someone born in the US, I have indeed traveled all over this country, have no one locale to call my own, so what am I? A member of the planet, surely. And if we want to get technical, all of our ancestry originated in Africa. So play what you love, sing what you love, an it harm no one, do what you love!


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: The Shambles
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 06:53 AM

A song on the subject can be found in The Mudcat Songbook. Ireland To Me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: InOBU
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 07:34 AM

bflat!:
You speak of racisist Irish, and claim that you know of what you speak because you live among them. how often have I heard racists say they now about the community they hate because they live among them. That is the definition of racisim, group judgement. If you haven't met the right kind of people among us, I would direct you to my song about Amadou Diallo, popular among my Irish crowd, my song about the forced assimilation of Canadian Natives, my song about the murder of Czech Roma (Gypsies) all played my my Irish band. I would have you meet Irish like my friends uncle, a fellow named Nee, who fought against facsism in Spain when England and the US were making deels with Hitler, I would have you read the speaches of my dear friend Bernadette Devlin McCaulisky, who when given the key to New York, gave it to the Black Panthers. I realise more people play in D then bflat, and as such, you may be hanging out with a more unique crowd, but come on into the maistream a bit, we aren't as scary as we seem, as far as being anti protestant, well, I am an Anglo Irishman raised protestant, republican and I don't mean the part of Regan I mean the party of Connoly and Cathal Brugha - raised in the tradition that we fight, as Connaly said, not for rocks and clay but for the lives of workers. Oh my, enough from me, Brendy and Kevin, take over a while, I have to make breakfast for my Catholic wife...
All the best
Larry


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: bflat
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 03:53 PM

Larry, I like what you have to say. You've made a lot of excellent points. I offer an apology to you and those of your ilk who are not like the people I wrote about. I still stand on what I wrote, however. To this extent, I know of no other group among which I live who name call and sneer like those I describe. I also want to address your remark from which I inferred your suggestion that I may I hate the group I live among....not in my heart or vocabulary.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jun 00 - 05:44 PM

Well, you may not hate them as individuals, but you should hate the stuff they say. For a start, it's a betrayal of the country they would claim to identify with.

You can tell them that it's thanks to people like them that there was ever any support for partition among ordinary poor protestants.

If it hadn't have been for that kind of sectarian rubbish, Ireland would probably have been free and united 150 years ago or more.

And as for other types of racism - even aside from the fact that it's evil nonsense, which is the real thing that matters, for Ireland to get trapped into racism would do untold damage to its ability to play a proud and valuable role in the world today.

They may say they're Irish, but if they are, they're Irish traitors. And there's always been some like that.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: GUEST,Nick
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 08:52 AM

It should be about listening, singing, and playing music you love and enjoy. Not letting some A-hole tell you what you're allowed to sing, play or listen to. Alex Campbell, the great Scottish folk singer, was told by many people that he had no business singing American Folk music and he thought that was rubbish--he'd sing what he liked.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 09:27 AM

Ye Gods,where would we be if we were all made to play the music of our own ancestry and nothing else.....?

Go to China, like the Chieftans did. They found the same rythmn patterns and even similar tunes. They made a record of it, and you can barely tell where one culture ends and the other begins. That is what music should be.

And for those travelling in Ireland - a friend did that some years ago, with a tape recorder. He managed to fill 90 mins of tape with music, of which he recognised one tune, Haste to the Wedding. There was general laughter and hilarity at the end of it from the musicians, and a strongly accented voice whispers into the mike - "ah, sure an' we put dat one in for da tourists!"

And I thought a plastic paddy/biddy was one who only pretended to be Irish, like all those theme pubs we get now, was I wrong? If so, them I'm a plastic human.....

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Kim C
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 09:50 AM

Well, my gggggrandmother was a Connoly, and there's Kellys in the family tree too, so I don't know what that makes me. But like I said before, Mister and I were Celtic before Celtic was cool, long before Riverdance, as I'm sure most of you were.

But I'm also sure that most of you are sincere about the kind of music you play/love/listen to, regardless of its country of origin, so that, to me, would make you "real." The word "plastic" denotes insincerity, possibly somebody who goes along with the crowd just to be liked. That ain't me and I doubt it's any of you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: SDShad
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 10:16 AM

I'm with Animaterra. If being too small a fraction of Irish or too far removed from it makes you "not Irish" or a plastic paddy, then not only am a not Irish ("orange" or "green"), I'm also not Scottish, English, Norwegian, German, French, Flemish, Swedish, Jewish, Dutch, Russian, or Native American. And that's just the last few centuries of ancestry. Take it back far enough, and we're all part just-about-everything, I suspect.

I have no ethnicity at all, apparently. Unless Minnesotan counts as an ethnic group, and there are probably those who say I've been away from the homeland for too long....

Shad O'Spawn (SDS, if you're nasty....)


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: barrygeo
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 11:01 AM

Plastic Paddy's are a unique sub culture within Irish society. For the most part they are to be found in their natural habitat in the southern part of Dublin city called D4. They can be found in lesser numbers in many parts of the world and are easily identified by their strange accent. A sure giveaway is if you hear the term 'royt' or if they describe the dublin light rail system as the 'Dort'. The strange dialect was designed to hide their true origins as Irish and to pretend the were part of some other culture perhaps British or American. For years they ridiculed Irish Culture as UnCool but since the rest of the world recognises the music and song of Ireland they grudgingly accept that it may after all be cool. Being a 'Real Paddy' is not about where your grandfather came from. Its an attitude to life. Their are no other qualifications. IMHO - Barry.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: radriano
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 12:37 PM

I have been playing Irish music since the early 70's. Both of my parents are Polish but I really enjoy Irish music so that is what I do. Over the years I have run into a lot of static from some Irish folk who think that if you are not Irish you are tolerated but you don't really count. I've met other Irish people who couldn't be more open and supportive.

I'm also a singer and I find that I treat songs very differently from tunes. I tend to not sing Irish rebel songs and I prefer not singing in a fake Irish accent. I don't sing rebel songs because they represent a close connection to politics. Since I'm not Irish myself and have not experienced what the rebel songs are about I feel uncomfortable doing them. I also fee that you need to be very careful of what group of people you are singing to.

My daughter (who is now fifteen) has been studying Irish step dancing since she was three and a half. She has been very successful with it but it has been my perception that in certain situations, say formal dance competitions, the kids with Irish names seem to win more often.

Getting back to instrumental music, though, especially when you consider that much of Irish music survived because of America, I am annoyed at those that indulge in musical bigotry.

radriano


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: paddymac
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 02:28 PM

Good and bad can usually both be found in individuals, as well as in communities, ethnicities, etc., etc. I recall reading a qoute attributed to Charlie Haughey, back before he fell from grace. A reporter asked him "What's an Irish name?", to which he replied "Anyone living in Ireland." The reply struck me as both echumenical (sp?) and realistic. Island peoples have always been subject to greater degrees of gene drift than their continental cousins, so it's a bit of a stretch for most people to claim their "pure" anything, no matter where they are or where they are from. If you research your roots far enough back, most of us turn out to be "pure Heinz 57".


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Irish sergeant
Date: 19 Jun 00 - 09:23 PM

My friend I don't know what Irish you have been living amongst so I'll not comment on your seeming generalization. You state you know of what you write and for those you live amongst, you likely do. So what are you going to do? Will you give into the temptation to further ignorance and suspicion in a world that has far too much of both commodities already, or will you rise above that? I stated a while back in another thread that Racism is a tool of the ignorant and I stand by that. I Quote Kevin Conroy in the movie "Gettysburg" "I will be judged by what I do not by who my father is" It is a very apt statement and it is one that I try to live by. I am proud of my heritage which is Scots, Irish, English and Swiss but I also recognize the shortcomings each have faced in their histories. I am not a Plastic Paddy, I am Neil MacMillan and I stand on my own merits. All I expect of others is that they recognize that. Enough ranting for tonight. HAve a great night All, best reguards, Neil


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Irish Rover
Date: 20 Jun 00 - 04:56 PM

I am a REAL PADDY! now bring your plastic butt over here and we'll play some real mexican music. Being from the North I played in a bar in Chicago, and this old Mick comes up to me in his cups and says your ponounceing the words all wrong! Isez where you from uld man he sez Dublin. I sez well there's the trouble you have an english accent, he hit me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Brakn
Date: 20 Jun 00 - 08:47 PM

Blood is thicker than accent.


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: Racer
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 04:19 AM

I just wonder where people get the idea that if one has only 1 Irish grandma than they are a quarter Irish. Genetics just simply doesn't work that way. If it did, you would be exactly half of your mother and half of your father.

We all take after a certain side of our family more than another. There's no escaping that. I'm a spitting image of my grandma, except for my eyes which I get from my father (and his father, and his father, and so on).

My last name is Speed, which is certainly English. I feel no kinship towards England. I do feel a strong kinship towards Ireland. I don't know why, maybe it's the music.

Irish music has crossed so many boundries. Someone mentioned earlier the Bouzouki, but neglected the Banjo. I heard somewhere that there are more Banjos per capita in Ireland then there are in America. Banjos are neither Irish nor American. If I'm not mistaken, they're African.

And potatos came from South America.

-Racer


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Subject: RE: BS: Are You a Real Paddy or a Plastic Paddy?
From: barrygeo
Date: 21 Jun 00 - 04:49 AM

Racer Many Irish left Ireland as economic migrants against their will. Their desire to return created a certain sentimentality towards the home place. This caused them to hold on to and to maintain there culture. My wife calls this 'cry in your beer syndrome.' Your english forefathers were probably left by choice and had less hankering after home imersing themselves in there new home. - Just a theory. Sir Walter Raleigh (I think) brought the potato to Ireland. I play both the banjo and bouzouki.


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Mudcat time: 22 October 12:06 PM EDT

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