BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: C. Ham
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 05:23 PM

It still seems strange how the Israeli bombing has been presented as a reponse to Hezbollah's Katyusha rockets when the rockets only started getting unleashed after Israel had started to bomb Lebanon. Well, it doesn't actually seem strange that this is how it has been presented, but it does seem strange how many people seem to have bought that version of events.

And if the Mudcat friends of Hezbollah keep repeating that propaganda lie, perhaps they too will begin to believe it.

Hezbollah has been firing Katyusha rockets into Israel, off and on, over the six years since Israel ended its occupation there.

As part of the deal that led to Israel's withdrawl in 2000, the Lebanese Government pledged to disarm Hezbollah. Instead, the Lebanese Government stood by and allowed Iran and Syria to rearm Hezbollah and allowed Hezbollah to operate a guerrilla militia in Lebanon.

When Hezbollah crossed the border into Israel and committed kidnapping and murder, it was the straw that broke the camel's back after six years of Katyushas.


The following message just arrived from a friend in Israel.
---

Shalom,

I am writing this note on Monday afternoon. Yesterday was
the unfortunate incident in Kfar Kana.

I am feeling a little calmer now. You should have seen me
last night and this morning. It has to do with the bombing
in Kfar Kara and the 48 hour "no air strike" truce we agreed
to and Condoleeza's last press conference.

It's like we Israelis are stuck in some Greek tragedy or
some movie that has a sad ending with the hero dying. And no
matter how many times you see it, the ending is always the
same. It seems no matter who Israel is acting/fighting with
on the stage, we always end up being the bad guy and the
crowd hating our guts. The true villain walks off with the
girl and the money. The play is cut short before we get to
finish the job we set out to do. I mean haven't we been in
this situation before, in 1996 in Lebanon. In 2002 in Jenin
(the "massacre")?

Have you seen the air force clips that were aired last
night? I will ask Benay, my wife, to attach them to the
bottom of this mail.
They show how the Hizbolla shoot rockets from behind
civilian apartment buildings and then, my friends, you watch
as the truck carrying the rocket launcher drives into a car
park under a house! How the heck does anyone expect us to
clear out these rockets without bombing the house??? The
local Lebanese population was warned by Israel to leave the
area three days in advance. Some locals stayed because the
couldn't afford to leave. I read that Lebanese taxis charge
$1000 to go to Beirut. So someone please explain to me why
these locals didn't hide in a building where there were no
rockets or any ammo dumps?

This morning the reporter on Sky News asked our former
foreign minister why the Israeli army didn't go house to
house in Kfar Kana and confirm, room by room, just who is in
that room and then determine if that person is a civilian or
a combatant. For god's sake! Give me a break! Kiryat Shemona
was shot with 100 (one hundred) rockets in less than 1 hour
yesterday. Did the Hizbollah go room by room looking for
civilians? If they had the chance, yes they would. They
would find the kids and make sure they shot each one. I know
it. You know it . We just lived through it. It was called
suicide bombers.

Afula Hospital (Emek Medical Center) prepares for War.
Anyone who has toured with me knows I love maps. But I
probably have never pointed out or mentioned Afula. It is a
small town dead in the center of the Jezreel Valley. It's
famous for "Golani Falafel" and until "Golani Falafel" is
publicly traded on NASDAQ, most of you will never hear of
Afula.

Last week Afula hospital was targeted by Hizbollah long
range missiles. How do I know it was "targeted"? 5 rockets
of the 5 shot landed near Afula hospital. Take a look at one
of the attached photos. There are no army bases or sensitive
facilities in Afula. Hizbollah targeted the Afula hospital.
Should you be surprised that Hizbolla targeted a hospital?
Well, they've already targeted Rambam hospital in Haifa and
hit the hospitals in Nahariya and Tsfat. So they
intentionally target our hospitals and the world expects us
to go room by room looking for civilians in Lebanon. But we
covered this topic in the first part of this mail.


Benay [Jeff's wife] volunteers in the ER of Afula hospital.
She has prepared 300 files for a mass-wounded situation. The
ER is in the basement of the hospital and it is built as one
huge bomb and chemical warfare shelter. Funny how there
isn't a single hospital in the Arab world that would even
consider the necessity to build a hospital in a bomb
shelter. Why? Because they know we would never target a
hospital.

Yesterday the hospital decided to empty out its top floors
and bring all the patients down to the lower levels. Lets
think what this entails. Cancel all unnecessary operations.
Kick out any patient you can. Double up on bed space in the
lower floors and have the staff and patients live and work
in 1/3 of the space they are used to. Wards are now
intermingled. Patient beds are doubled up. Have I mentioned
about privacy, sanitation, confusion...

Here's a quote from the instruction sheet given by the
hospital's director to the various wards:
- Dept. heads will do their utmost to lower the number of
patients in their departments.
- Social Services will encourage patients to go home.
- The operating rooms will perform only cancer and emergency
operations.

But how does the head of the hospital end her directive?
And here's the part that keeps me going:
"In this war we will be tested as a society, as an
organization (hospital) and as individuals.
Working together, in full cooperation, we will complete the
very complicated task before us:
- to clear the wards
- work in very tight surroundings
- give the best service that we can
- be prepared for a mass-wounded situation."

So what's the part that keeps me going, that makes me proud
of being an Israeli and a Jew? It's the fact that Afula
Hospital, that same hospital being targeted by Hizballah, is
used by Arabs and Jews. It is staffed by Arabs and Jews. 17%
of its Department Heads are Arabs, proportionate to their
percentage in the total population. The Moslems and
Christians and Druze and Circasians all work together and
treat all their patients equally... and guess what? That
won't change no matter how many rockets Hizbollah drops on
the Afula Hospital. That's what makes us different from our
enemies. That's what's makes me proud.

So you see, we are the good guys. And we have to win.

We're all in this together,

Jeff

Go to http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/ and click on the right column
1) IDF Video: Hizbullah missile fire from within the village
of Kafr Qana
2) IDF Video: Hizbullah use of civilian shields

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: freda underhill
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 05:22 PM

that quote from the Koran is a myth. as are other quotes about receiving unlimited virgins in heaven.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 04:53 PM

They do seem to fire these rockets from the darnedest places - such as the roof of a UN observation post, from tower blocks in the middle of Beirut, from the cellars of residential blocs...

It still seems strange how the Israeli bombing has been presented as a reponse to Hezbollah's Katyusha rockets when the rockets only started getting unleashed after Israel had started to bomb Lebanon. Well, it doesn't actually seem strange that this is how it has been presented, but it does seem strange how many people seem to have bought that version of events.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,hari kiri
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 04:17 PM

And is it the Qu'ran which says:

"Hide behind your women and children when you fire on the enemy"

??

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,hari
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 02:52 PM

Leave the area you say Bobad...how the hell were all those people ,thousands of them,supposed to leave the area when the roads,bridges,towns,villages and car convoys were being attacked with bombs and missiles.

What happened was an appalling act of savagery! Were they supposed to flee north to Tyre or Beirut ...both cities have come under sustained fire as have many other towns in th country.

No! This is the way that Israel has planned its invasion.It was supposed to be about the return of the captured soldiers but there fate must be very uncertain now after the slaughter of the innocents in Qana.
Israel has waged total war and has set the Lebanon back by decades.....more enemies have been created even the christian communities are sending young men to join Hizbollah to get revenge for the destruction of their country.
hari
ps
the bible says an eye for an eye
it doesn't say 50 dead children for 3 captured soldiers

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: bobad
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 02:33 PM

"A statement issued today by the IDF said that responsibility for the Qana attack "rests with the Hezbollah" because it has used the area to launch "hundreds of missiles" into Israel. It added: "Residents in this region and specifically the residents of Qana were warned several days in advance to leave the village."

On July 27, Israeli Justice Minister Haim Ramon said that Israel had given civilians ample time to leave southern Lebanon, and that anyone remaining could be considered a supporter of Hezbollah. "All those now in south Lebanon are terrorists who are related in some way to Hezbollah," he said, according to the BBC."

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/HRW/f367bb39f880a02ab281d7155dc08b44.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,seth
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 02:22 PM

Human Rights Watce seem to have trained observers in both Israel and the Lebanon.Itis they who have said that the Israeli attack on Qana is a war crime.

HRW has said that the air attack was an indiscriminate attack on innocent women and children which is illegal under international law.You seem to treat this as a flippant matter but the violent deaths of dozens of innocent children is a horrible crime...and is sure to have repercussions for all concerned.
seth

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 12:43 PM

Seth, They use women and children to shield their equipment and bases. What is it about these "Martyrs To the Cause" you don't understand? They also hide next to UN bases, who they know will repair roads for them and chat on their radios in plain language describing all the Israeli military movements in their area. How convenient for them. Now when some get killed you have the audacity to call the Israeli's murderers. The Palestinian children are indoctrinated to die for the cause and are used every day, the Israelis don't do that to theirs.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,seth
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 10:33 AM

Human Rights Watch,the human rights organisation based in New York ,has stated today that the Israeli attack on Qana was an "indiscriminate " attack on civilian targets and thus a war crime.Dozens of children were killed in the bombing.
Will those responsible be brought to the war crimes tribunal?

Seth

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 08:38 AM

Juicy Brucie, you need to go and check what I said about the UN post. It didn't take long to find the facts about the dates on the internet.

A war by Israel against Hamas and/or Hezbollah may well be justifiable. One against the Lebanese and the Lebanon is not. Probably one against the Palestinian Authority and on all inhabitants of the Gaza Strip is not (depends to some extent on links between PA and jihad)

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 08:22 AM

Check the news - in fact the air strikes by Israel have continued to take place. Just because something gets announced to smooth things over in the media doesn't mean it actually happens.

But then misinformation is the name of the game here. The blitz on Lebanon is presented as having been a response to a wave of Hezbullah rockets, but that just wasn't the way it happened. In fact it was the other way round.

What triggered things off was a cross-border Hezbullah raid on June 12th in which two Israeli soldiers were captured and three killed. Five more Israeli soldiers were killed in the course of a counter-raid across the Labanese border.

The Israeli response the next day was to bomb Lebanon's International Airport in Beirut, and to carry out air strikes which killed about 40 Lebanese, including 10 members of one family and seven members of another. In reprisal Hezbollah fired rockets that killed two Israeli civilians.

And it went on from there, with each side escalating their attacks.

Aiming weaponry at civilian targets is clearly an atrocity and a war crime, and deserves the label "terrorism". But that applies whoever does it. And carrying out attacks against a ruthless and well armed enemy is stupid and irresponsible. But that applies to both sides as well.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: freda underhill
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 08:08 AM

bobad, the guest of 07:16 PM has cut and paste frtom this site..
israel strategy page

freda

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,ed
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 03:23 AM

My slogan for next week's march in London would be

Stop Blair supporting Bush's wars!!

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,redhorse at work
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 03:06 AM

and when one poster is losing the argument, he accuses the others of "communism". McCarthy lives!

nick

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,seth
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 01:42 AM

I have been struck while reading the above postings about how many of those who have written in support of the Israeli armed forces are quite abusive to those who are opposed to the invasion of the Lebanon.

Seth

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,SARAH
Date: 31 Jul 06 - 01:37 AM

I thought Israel withdrew from the Lebanon last time because it kept losing so many men in small scale firefights and ambushes and through mines that a withdrawal became inevitable.Weren't they followed by the quick collapse of their south Lebanese army allies??

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: bobad
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 07:33 PM

That is a very insightful post, guest, I only wish you would let us know who is behind it.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 07:16 PM

The religious zealots in Iran believe the world would be a better place if everyone were Moslem, of the Shia variety (which predominates in Iran and Lebanon, but not with 90 percent of Moslems, who prefer the Sunni, or other minor sects.) Iran also believes that Israel must be destroyed, and Iranian leaders have not been shy about repeating this again and again in public. Hizbollah leaders repeat this demand. This basic Hizbollah goal, the destruction of Israel, makes negotiations with Israel difficult. Israel has apparently decided to forget about negotiations, and instead, take Hizbollah apart piece by piece.

Israeli troops have been fighting Hizbollah gunmen for over a quarter of a century. You have many Israeli infantrymen fighting in Lebanon now, who got practical advice from their fathers, who had battled Hizbollah back in the 1980s. Israel knows how to defeat Hizbollah, as they have been doing it for decades. But until the recent Hizbollah raids across the border, Israel has avoided going after Hizbollah on a large scale. This was an attempt to keep things quiet on the Lebanese border, and give the Lebanese a chance to settle the problem with Hizbollah peacefully. That seemed more likely, after a popular (and largely peaceful) Lebanese uprising last year that forced Syria to pull its troops out of Lebanon.

Since the 1980s, Syria had a force of over 30,000 soldiers in Lebanon. Originally sent in a peacekeepers during the 1975-90 Lebanese civil war, the Syrian force soon became guardians of Hizbollahs growing empire in southern Lebanon, and protector of Syrian economic interests (many of them criminal, like drug smuggling) in Lebanon. Without those 30,000 Syrian troops, Hizbollah, and the Lebanese Shia (about 35 percent of the population) were more vulnerable than they had been in over two decades. Intense negotiations commenced. No one wanted a resumption of the civil war, but all Lebanese were concerned about this state-within-a-state that Hizbollah had created in southern Lebanon. The UN was concerned as well. As part of the deal, when Israel pulled out, Hizbollah was to disarm and a force of 2,500 UN peace observers (UNIFIL) would watch over a new era of peace in the south. For the last seven years, Hizbollah has refused to abide by that deal, and most Lebanese were tired of the delays. Increasing the attacks against Israel seemed like a good idea, as it made Hizbollah seem more useful, if Israel did not strike back. The rest of the Lebanese political parties were not making threats, yet, about Hizbollahs refusal to disband and let southern Lebanon become part of Lebanon once more. Hizbollah wanted to make their autonomy in southern Lebanon permanent, but was unsure of how to do it. Hizbollah stumbled into war with Israel while seeking a solution to its problems with the rest of Lebanon.

Getting accurate news about the fighting in southern Lebanon is complicated by the fact that Hizbollah, the Lebanese and most of the media are more concerned about producing propaganda and excitement, than in reporting facts. Hizbollah knows, from long experience, that they cannot defeat Israel. But Hizbollah knows that it can spin the media. The Israeli withdrawal from south Lebanon in 2000 was a peace offering that was, in typical Hizbollah fashion, simultaneously spurned and exploited. The same techniques are being used during the current war.

But now Israel is determined to cripple Hizbollah, a move that will lead to the organization either dying, or fading into insignificance. Hizbollah had made lots of enemies in the last 25 years, many of them in the Lebanese Shia community. If Hizbollah losses most of its economic and military assets, that will make it weak enough for other Lebanese groups to overwhelm it militarily and politically. This appears to be the Israeli plan, and the way things work in the Middle East, it appears to be working. Support for Hizbollah from the Arab world has been muted, compared to similar situations in the past. Even Iran is not happy with Hizbollahs actions, and has pointedly not sent any new weapons. Naturally, the Sunni Arab world is down on Hizbollah (and its explicit goal of replacing Sunni Islam with the Shia variety). While Lebanese politicians have been vocal in their support for Hizbollah, there has been no rush to provide any material support.

Israel has destroyed most of Hizbollah's economic assets, and is now going after the military ones. There are thousands of bunkers, fortified buildings and tunnel complexes in southern Lebanon that Hizbollah can use to fight from. Israeli troops may have to battle through all of them to cripple Hizbollahs military strength. Israel has done this successfully against the Palestinians for years. This will not be reported very accurately in the media because that would be boring. Israeli tactics are methodical and, well, not very dramatic. The mass media needs excitement, and when they can't find it, they invent it. Think back to the many battles Israel has had with the Palestinians, or the reporting on the American three week march on Baghdad in 2003, and remember what the pundits were saying, compared to what was actually happening. The mass media depends on most people not retaining any memories like that, and being willing to accept breathless, and inaccurate, reports of the current wars.

What makes war unpredictable is the fact that, while genius may have its limits, stupidity doesn't. Hizbollah is basically stupid. They are part of a movement dedicated to taking over the world. Israel just wants to survive. Hizbollah is part of an Arab military tradition that takes pride in a long string of defeats because that means eventually the enemy will get tired of beating on us and go away. This is how they turned the 2000 Israeli withdrawal from southern Lebanon (actually a peace offering) into a great military victory for Hizbollah. Another example of stupidity without limits.

When the dust has settled on this war in Lebanon, the remnants of Hizbollah will be busy rearranging the facts in order to produce another victory. But Hizbollah will no longer be the force it once was, and Lebanese soldiers and police will once more be patrolling southern Lebanon, rolling past the wreckage of Hizbollah bunkers and military facilities. The hundreds of buildings and bridges destroyed by Israeli bombs will be a reminder to the Lebanese of what happens when you allow part of your country to he hijacked by a bunch of religious maniacs. The majority of Lebanese were never happy about Hizbollah, but lacked the courage to do anything about it. Israel's not going away, but Hizbollah is. It's members can easily go back to being Lebanese, or get killed by an Israeli smart bomb, or sniper. Israelis have no such options, and have no choice but to fight and win. That makes a big difference on the battlefield. You can look it up.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Peace
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 06:00 PM

JUST OUT:

"Israel suspends south Lebanon strikes
From correspondents in Jerusalem
July 31, 2006
ISRAEL today suspended air strikes in southern Lebanon for 48 hours while it investigates the Qana bombings, US State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said.
"Israel has agreed to a 48-hour suspension of aerial activity in south Lebanon," Mr Ereli told reporters after talks between US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and top Israeli officials.

Israel would also coordinate with the United Nations on a 24-hour period of "safe passage" for civilians that wish to leave the area, Mr Ereli said.

Dozens of Lebanese women and children died in an Israeli strike on Qana, sparking renewed international calls for an immediate ceasefire."

Now, DONNIE and the rest of you, let's see if your asshole friends in Hezbollah suspend their rocket attacks.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Peace
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 05:58 PM

IOF?

Do all you guys and gals attend the same institution?

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,donnie
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 05:50 PM

GAZA:FREE FIRE ZONE!
Gaza is one vast free fire zone for the Israeli Occupation Forces.Collective Punishment of Palestinians in Gaza is the name of the game and Israel is going all out to win.

Most of the victims are children....so not a great deal of difference between the killings in Gaza and the killings in the Lebanon.

The IOF has blown up apartment blocks,houses,whole neighbourhoods,civic buildings and a power station.
It has destroyed electrical transmittors,powerlines, bridges and mobile phone masts.

It has killed old ladies, toddlers and teenagers.It has used toxic weapons according to Gaza doctors.Snipers have fired from rooftops and civilians have been used as shields.

Hundreds have been killed,many odf whom are children and many more injured.
The calorific count for Gazan children is very low and they are half starved.A senior UN official says Gaza is in the middle of a humanitarian crisis....and it has been caused by Israel which wants to pound the Palestinians into the dust!
DONNIE

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Peace
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 05:24 PM

""It was Monday night, about 10:30 in the evening," said the officer from the Palestinian security forces who lived in the house with his two wives and 19 children.

"I received a call with the number of the caller hidden. I thought it was a prank by one of my mates. I asked, 'Are you joking?' and got the reply, 'The Israeli army doesn't make jokes.' Then the caller hung up."

So Mr. Mamluk rounded up his children and took them to his brother's house before alerting his neighbours, who then set up barriers on the road outside to stop cars or pedestrians entering the area.

"They hit 25 minutes later," he said. "I'd expected an Apache [attack helicopter] but not an F-16 fighter jet."

Israeli aircraft have dropped thousands of flyers on the Gaza Strip in recent weeks, warning people all sites and buildings where weapons or military equipment are stored will be bombed."

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,gren
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 05:19 PM

blessed are the peacemakers

Amir Fester is the first person to refuse his military call up during the current invasion of the Lebanon. He has been sentenced to a month's imprisonment in a military jail.

May his name be blessed as a peacemaker in these days of war and days of slaughter.

gren

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,si..Stop The War
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 05:12 PM

Although the two US cargo planes carrying smart bombs were diverted from Scotland to the RAF airbase in Mildenhall,Suffolk.....the base itself [Mildenhall ] is completely run by the US military.

The RAF title is a fig leaf for domestic consumption.

Either way Blair is up to his neck in the gore and even his worm like cabinet seem to be turning over the slaughter in the Lebanon and Britain's grubby role as number two to the chief gangster.

Si..Stop The War

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,james
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 05:05 PM

Go to the Indymedia UK website for the photostory on Qana .

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 04:04 PM

Mackenzie and Dallaire both Canadian Generals who found out first hand how the UN is such a bunch of stupid corrupt bastards

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: bobad
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 02:52 PM

Excerpt from C.Ham's post:

"MacKenzie also said that, given the amount of firepower going into Lebanon, the "death toll is unbelievably low ... The targets are being selected pretty darn closely." This does not make civilian deaths palatable. But it helps dispel the notion that Israel's campaign against Hezbollah is sloppy."

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: C. Ham
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 02:48 PM

Excellent op-ed piece from the Boston Globe

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: C. Ham
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 02:41 PM

Good op-ed from the Toronto Star

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,albert
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 02:34 PM

No the jihadis hate those neocons,oilbosses and torturers who have exploited their regions for decades.

They are the ones who have supported the local tyrants with arms and money ....
They are the ones who have grabbed the oilfields

They are the ones who have set up the military bases .

They are the ones who have ruthlessly exploited the Palestinians and made Palestine a running sore for millions across the Middle East.

There is an arc of terror but it runs from Tel Aviv through Downing St to Washington.
albert

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: C. Ham
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 02:27 PM

Excellent op-ed piece from the Washington Post

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 02:07 PM

They are Islamic radicals who hate you to Yo Albert Thats the fucking problem with the middle east these dickheads will kill everyone who stands in their way. Convert or die infidel dogs

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,albert
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 01:30 PM

Funny,but I seem to remember that when Bush,Blair,the neocons and the Israelis were pushing for the invasion of Iraq it was the anti war movement around the world which spoke consistently and clearly against the lies,the distortions and the reasons for the invasion.

It is the same anti war movement which is loudly protesting at th slaughter of the innocent in the Lebanon and Gaza and the West Bank.

Bush,Olmert and Blair are up to their necks in blood .They are wading in the stuff.

You must be rabid to suggest I am celebrating the deaths in Palestine ,Israel or Lebanon!

I have spent the past few years being actively opposed to the slaughter,the bombings and the invasions.

I look to the men with the guns and the power to take the decisions ...and there they are
Yo Blair!
Yo Olmert!
Yo Bush!
...............................................................albert

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: robomatic
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 12:49 PM

As I expected, there are those who are HAPPY to post about this tragedy of civilian deaths under attack.

Did they post when an 'insurgent' (terrorist) car bombing killed 54 civilians in Baghdad? Was this not targeted mass-murder?

Did they post when Arab militia raided African towns in Darfur men on horseback targeting one-on-one shooting farmers and raping their wives and daughters.

Do they post when hundreds of Hezbollah fired missiles hit Israeli towns and villages killing Jews, Muslims, and Christians alike?

No, they choose to post inflammatory and often inaccurate messages only when their enemy (Israel) kills their friends (terrorists) or their friends' victims.

It is a tragedy that could have been averted by the Lebanese taking responsibility for their own territory, but Hezbollah not initiating the conflict, and by the return of the captured Israelis.

As to the specifics of how this came to be, the first casualty in warfare is the truth, and the truth will come out eventually, but many of the posters above, particularly Guest, albert at the moment, have no interest in the truth, just in celebrating death.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,hugo
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 12:35 PM

Tens of thousands of Lebanese ,christian and muslim ,took to the ruined streets of Beirut today to demand an end to the bombing and slaughter of civilians, and a withdrawal of Israeli forces from heir country.
hugo

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: bobad
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 11:54 AM

Israel into a regional heavyweight power.

Israel now has one of the most technologically advanced armed forces in the world

Israel is now a heavily militarised society.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,WALT
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 11:36 AM

Israel has received billions of dollars worth of military aid from the USA and also substantial amounts of military aid from the UK and other countries.

This US military support,together with more general financial and economic and diplomatic support, has made Israel into a regional heavyweight power.....a power that is more than willing and able to inflict force on its neighbours in order for it to achieve its objectives.

Israel now has one of the most technologically advanced armed forces in the world.Arms exports from Israel long ago replaced oranges and grapes as the country's main export.Israel is now a heavily militarised society.

Without US aid Israel'e economy would be in a terrible mess and it would have had to have reached a settlement with its neighbours and the Plaestinians a long time ago.

As long as US aid lasts Israel will act as the arm of US imperialism in the Middle East enforcing its will over the control of oil and US .strategic interests.
No blood for oil!
walt
WALT

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: bobad
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 11:02 AM

Pray tell us guest "hugo", in the name of balance, who is the armourer and financier of Hamas and Hezbollah?

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,jan
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 11:00 AM

BOMBS OVER GAZA AND GLASGOW
The two US cargo planes carrying bombs to Israel were diverted from Scotland to RAF Mildenhall in Suffolk.

One has apparently now left that base for Israel.

The two planes were forced to divert from Prestwick because the Glasgow Stop The War Coalition had staged a protest in the airport terminus.
JAN

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,theresa.....from London to the Lebanon
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 10:49 AM

Trafalgar Square in London is full of people calling for an end to Israeli aggression in the Lebanon and Gaza.The square is awash with Palestinian flags and the cedar flag of the Lebanon.Dozens of writers,actors and musicians have been performing on stage and the mood of the crowd is angry at the latest news from the Lebanon.
theresa

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,hugo..now thrive the armourers
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 10:44 AM

NOW THRIVE THE ARMOURERS..
Two Air Atlas cargo planes laden with smart bombs for the Israeli military were diverted from Prestwick airport in Scotland today after hundreds of protestors gathered outside the terminus to ptotest at the US arming Israel with the help of Tony Blair.The planes were diverted to an unknown airport for refuelling.

TheUS is the armourer and main financier of the state of Israel .It supplies Israel with a range of the most modern warplanes and Apache helicopters and missiles for use against the Palestinian and Lebanese people.

HUGO

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,walt..
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 10:31 AM

MASS MURRDER IS A WAR CRIME!
54 civilians reported slain today at Qana, 37 of them were children. These kids must have already been terrified from the weeks of bombing and shelling.

One former UN worker put it well on television earlier today when he said the Israeli military were out of control and simply did not care who they hit with their bombs.

Only 10 years ago Qana was hit by Israeli shells and 104 civilians were killed when the shells hit a UN post packed with refugees.
WALT

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 09:46 AM

guest, apalled,

So, a wife calls her dead husband a liar, and you think it is news?

The email posted earlier from THAT UN observer mentions that the attacks were a "tactical neccesity" indicating that, in his opinion as a military observer, he would have done the same thing. Can you please give the military qualifications of both his wife, and Kofi Amman, neither of whom was there, but both of whom seem willing to make judgements as to what happened even before the investigation has been made?

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: C. Ham
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 09:33 AM

Whether or not one agrees with how one feels about the job being done by Secretary Rice, your leading with the "white rice" comment is despicable racism.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Azizi
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 08:53 AM

Correction:

The first sentence of my previous post should read "Imo, white rice is such a shitty dish."

The word 'white' refers to the color of the rice and not to a race of people.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Azizi
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 08:28 AM

Imo, White rice is such a shitty dish.

Do Condi and Bushie ever think about the literal meaning of their words?

oh, right, they haven't got a brain nor have they got a heart or courage or a soul. So they don't engage their brains before they open their mouths or else there'd be less crap that came out of that opening. But like Bush, Condi doesn't appear to care how what she says can be interpreted-just like she-and her hus-I mean her massa Bush don't seem to care about what their actions or lack of actions.

Check out these excerpts from this article:

Rice postpones trip to Beirut after attack


"We all recognize this kind of warfare is extremely difficult," said Rice, noting it comes in areas where civilians live. "It unfortunately has awful consequences sometimes." ...

"I am here ... in pretty political and dicey circumstances," she said. "I do believe that it is best to try to address these issues face-to-face and see what we can achieve."...

Rice said she was meeting with Israeli Defense Minister Amir Peretz when news of the attack came. "Once again, I was reiterating our strong concern about the impact of Israeli military operations on innocent civilians," she said.

She said she is working with all parties to try to stop the violence. "Too many innocent people — Lebanese and Israeli — have suffered. Too many people have lost their lives. Too many families are homeless. And too many children have been killed, injured or are living in fear for their lives." ...

"Emotions are understandably running high on all sides," she said...

-snip-

What?! It's understandable that emotions are running high on all sides. Who woulda thought it. [snark]

And quoting from that same article Condishoezza said:"

"I am here ... in pretty political and dicey circumstances," she said. "I do believe that it is best to try to address these issues face-to-face and see what we can achieve."

-snip-

Imo, this statement really takes the cake. Not for a red hot second would I have called this horrendous war "a dicey circustance". 'Complicated' Yes. 'Difficult' Yes. 'Dicey' No. That word seems to minimize the importance of it all. It also brings up images of a crap shoot. But all of this is nothing but the same oh crap, right?

And note how condo revealed her first concern is for the political ramifications of this "dicey circumstance". Come on now condi! These killings can't be "pretty" to you. Can they??!! Oh right, I forgot you hang out with the same folks that gave us the Iraqi shock & awe. I guess you can see how well that's working, right?

And what about this quote from condoliezza:

"too many people innocent people-Lebanese and Israeli-have sufferred" Well wouldn't you think that one is too many? Ditto for "too many families are homeless and too many children have been killed, injured, or are living in fear for their lives."

And I see that condi didn't mention the Canadians and people of other nationalities who have been killed or injured as a result of this horrendous war [but then all wars are horrendous, right?]

I mean wouldn't any right thinking person think that that "one" innocent person killed or injured or living in fear as a result of this horrendous war was one too many? Oh, excuse me. I forgot condi doesn't have a heart, or a brain, and she sure as heck aint got no soul.

And btw it also seems to me that Katherine Shrader, the writer of this article also needs to think about the literal meaning of her words before she writes them down for all the world to see:

Check out this example:
"The Qana attack comes at a damaging and difficult moment for Rice, who arrived in the Middle East for a second visit in a week and hoped to leave with progress that could lead to a decisive U.N. resolution to end the hostilities."

-snip-

Well, I for one, don't give a goldarned flying fart how damanging and difficult this 'moment' is for condi rice.

Imo, regardless of which side is at fault for starting this war {and I think both sides are at fault}, the Bush administration needs to work forcefully for an immediate ceasfire.

Imo, this shoulda happened from the getgo.

What will condi & bush do?
Unfortunately, we'll see.
Condi rice-
she's no role model
for me
[or imo- for anyone else who has a heart, and courage, and soul].


-Sistah Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 07:51 AM

Israel are to blame for this slaughter of innocents.
But Hezbolla must share the blame.
It was known that Israel would strike launch sites wherever placed.
The launchers are mobile. They choose to fire from population centres.
Their cause is helped by creating martyrs.
Let it all stop please.

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,frances
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 07:42 AM

the placard I would like to make for next saturday's anti war march in London will read

    STOP THE KILLING
    STOP THE HATE
ISRAEL IS THE TERROR STATE!

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: GUEST,albert
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 06:13 AM

Its obvious from the bombings and slaughter in the Lebanon and Gaza city that the Zionists and the Israeli Occupation Forces care very little what anyone thinks about the barbarism it is inflicting on civilians.
albert

Subject: RE: BS: Gaza Strip 28/9 June 2006
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Jul 06 - 04:37 AM

I want to nail a big lie about the UN post murder.

The von Kruedener email being quoted by the apologists for Isreal was sent on the 18th and so dealt with the situation on that day. The UN post was destroyed on the 25th. On the 25th the UN post had telephoned 6 times to protest that it was under fire and that the UN observers were likely to be killed. Result? No change but an accurately guided missile spot on the UN post. Good shot sir.

This was not collateral damage. This is someone deciding to get rid of thorn in his side.