BS: Caliphate

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 10:38 AM

I have not said any of those things.
I just asked why you endlessly and only criticise Israel while ignoring greater evil all around.
Even on threads not about Israel, like this one.

So, why do you do it?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 07:52 AM

Jim, this thread is about the Caliphate, so why post attacks on Israel while remaining silent about the horrific atrocities committed by the Caliphate?

Convince us it is not simply because there are no Jews in the Caliphate.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Teribus
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 07:18 AM

Stop fighting, stop threatening Israel with annihilation and there will be peaceful co-existence and prosperity for all in the region.

Give it a go:

1: Egypt tried it and found that it worked
2: Jordan tried it and found that it worked
3: To a certain extent Mahmoud Abbas has tried it and has found in general terms that it works.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 06:55 AM

"Why have you never pasted a single one Jim?"
Booboo has posted enough to rest most of us the rest of our lives.
You crowd have deliberately set out to make Muslims the enemy while at the same time reffusing to accept or respond t s ingle criticism of isreal
You take sides - we say they are as bad as one another - doesn't get mor complicated than that.
You put up onlu Isreali criticism - making Israeli atrocities "Jewish" makes you an anti-Semite
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 05:54 AM

The Irish Times has published many reports about IS atrocities.
Why have you never pasted a single one Jim?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 05:52 AM

supporting, actually or with your silence.

No one is supporting any atrocity, but explain why on a thread about IS you only post criticism of Israelis' behaviour while ignoring the far worse atrocities of the Caliphate.

No Jews no views?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 05:39 AM

Some of the atrocities you people appear to be supporting, actually or with your silence.
Jim Carroll

From this Morning's Irish Times
GAZA FAMILY DEVASTATED BY SERIES OF ATTACKS
Lara Marlowe
in Beit Hanoun, Gaza Strip

Decomposing bodies remain unburied in rubble of destroyed building
Israeli ground troops, surviving family members claim, sequesered eight members of the Wahdan family, ranging in age from an 18-month-old girl to a 70-year-old grandfather, then dynamited their house in Beit Hanoun, killing all inside.
Four members of the same family were subsequently killed when Israeli drones fired three rockets at the house where they took refuge in Jabaliya camp. The dead included Sanioura Wahdan (20). Her three small boys were sleeping beside her and were among 30 relatives wounded in the second attack. The boys' father, Ali, has been sent to Egypt for medical care and may not survive. His left leg was amputated and he has a severe head wound.
Eighteen-month-old Mohamed has burn and suture scars on his face and abdomen and cries constantly. His brothers Omar (3) and Mussab (5) were also badly wounded. Mussab refuses to speak or engage with other people. The entire family are descendants of Zaki Wahdan, who was killed along with his wife, a daughter-in-law, four grandchildren and a great grand-daughter when Zaki's house was blown up on July 27th.
DRIVEN OUT
Wahdan was four when his family were driven out of Wadi Hanin, near Ramla, in the newly formed state of Israel. He had 10 sons and more than 100 grandchildren. The extended family lived with or near their patriarch, as is the custom among Palestinians. The men were construction and agricultural workers and beekeepers. They have no affiliation with Hamas.
Zaki Wahdan's home was less than 1km from Israel. From the rubble of his house, one can see the Israeli town of Sderot, which has often been targeted by Hamas rockets. "In the 2012 war, we saw soldiers on the dunes over there," says Ayman Wahdan. "They never shot at us. We don't understand why they attacked us this time."
On July 20th, Israeli special forces entered Beit Hanoun. More than 40 children and grandchildren had already fled Zaki Wahdan's four-storey building to seek safety in schools and in Jabaliya. Of the 15 who remained, the soldiers took seven men at gunpoint to the Erez crossing point, where they were questioned for three days about Hamas and why they had stayed in the house. Then they were given laissez passer documents and warned not to return to Beit Hanoun, so they joined other family members in Jabaliya.
During the night of July 26th-27th, Mohamed Wahdan (20) received a call from his sister Zeinab, who had stayed in the Beit Hanoun house. Mohamed was one of the seven men taken to Israel.
"Zeinab said: 'There is something strange going on. We are frightened,'" Mohamed recalls. "She said: 'The Israelis put us all in one room and said we would be safe if we didn't go out. They said don't open the door for anyone. I think they put dynamite in the house.'"
ONLY LIMBS FOUND
When Mohamed Wahdan re¬turned to Beit Hanoun, he found seven charred legs in the rubble. He knew immediately which brother or sister they belonged to. He recognised one leg to be that of his grandmother, Soaad. The limbs were bur¬ied in a single grave in Beit Lahi-ya cemetery.
From the pile of rubble comes a smell of decomposing flesh. The family last week appealed to a leading Hamas official and to the head of the municipality to send a bulldozer so they can retrieve the rest of the bodies, to no avail.
The Consolidated Contractors Company estimates that the war left 2.5 million tonnes of rubble. But there are only two bulldozers in the entire Gaza Strip, says the economist Hamed Jad. "There were four before the war, but the Israelis bombed two," Jad explains.
Mohamed Wahdan lost two grandparents, his mother, four siblings and a niece in the house. His father, Hatem, who had been taken to Israel with Mohamed and five others, was killed in the August 3rd rocket attack that killed four more Wahdans in Jabaliya.
Khadija Wahdan (29) recounts the Jabaliya attack: "We were sleeping in two rooms. I was in the one where the rock¬ets exploded. I was surrounded by dead bodies. I called their names and they didn't answer. I ran outside with my face burning and my hair on fire. There was a cement block on my moth¬er's head..."
Mohamed Wahdan chain-smokes and shows little emotion. "I come here every day to talk to my family and to look for their things," he says, standing in the rubble. "I know they are below me when I'm here, and I tell them to rest in peace."

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 04:46 AM

At a recent Oireachtas (Irish parliament) special committee meeting attended by the Israeli Ambassador to Ireland, it was revealed that it has been proposed that that those who are protesting at the 'Gazan adventure' should not only all be treated as Anti-Semites, but their sexual orientation should be made public where necessary - gay Senator David Norris, a leading opponent of Israeli terrorism, reacted as would be expected!
The Ambassador assured the committee that the photograph of the statue of Molly Malone with her wheelbarrow, dressed in a burkah, has now been removed from the Embassy's website.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Teribus
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 04:14 AM

Keith A of Hertford's post of Date: 07 Sep 14 - 12:40 PM

Makes a point and asks as valid question, which none of the "usual suspects" has answered - but that is about par for the course.

Israel expanding? Yet no comments about Jordan's expansion into the West Bank and East Jerusalem, or Egypt's into Gaza that resulted in "Palestinians" being shut up in refugee camps for decades and purposely kept in poverty to be used as political pawns, those refugee camps being located on "Palestinian" Land - no explanation or answer given for that little anomaly either although I have asked repeatedly.

Israel took in over 820,000 refugees and integrated them into the fabric of their country - Now why couldn't their Arab neighbours do the same for the Arab refugees?

Stop fighting, stop threatening Israel with annihilation and there will be peaceful co-existence and prosperity for all in the region - since 1848 the Arab side of the equation has NEVER given peace a chance.

Now as far as the Caliphate goes:

1: Anyone here in this community amazed by the millions of Muslims flooding to join the Caliph in his Islamic Paradise?

2: What has happened since the US has decided to provide Iraqi and Kurdish forces with air support?

3: What do think will happen to IS/ISIL/ISIS once the new Iraqi Government, their Arab neighbours and the full weight of US air power gets going to combat and challenge the "Caliphate"?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Sep 14 - 04:09 AM

My argument is that it shows bias that you only and always criticise Israel while ignoring the worse behaviour of its immediate neighbours.
Why do you do that?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 04:32 PM

Not to mention the unfortunate echo.

If you have no argument, play the holocaust card.

Sick bastards.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 01:25 PM

"No Jews no views? "

Exactly!

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 01:07 PM

Fuck me. He even repeats it. Have you no sense of shame?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 12:40 PM

Israel has been shrinking, not expanding since 1972!
How is it a threat to anyone's peace?


Egypt next door.
Like Israel supported by US taxes.
Guilty of apartheid against Bedouin, persecution of minorities and execution of political prisoners.
Also settling Bedouin land in Sinai and blockading Gaza.

Lots of views posted about Israel, almost none about Egypt.
No Jews no views?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 10:26 AM

Perhaps you are right M, but I would hate to think that anyone on this forum was anti-Semitic or racist.

I do know that there are many liberals and a handful of "liberals" here, many of the liberals are regarded as racists by the "liberals", who are themselves Fascists!

If that seems convoluted, I apologise, but constructing a sensible society is a complicated business. :0)

Likewise Regards...A

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 10:00 AM

Tell you what Keith. Using your logic, its got fuck all to do with jews.

We all hate you because you are a fucking christian so oppose anything and everything you say or stand for eh?

If you want to be paranoid, at least do it in style, sick fucker.

Michael just said that not hating others makes you antisemitic. At least he has the excuse of going senile..

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 09:51 AM

But it is precisely because they are 'liberals', Ake, that they are not really cognisant of — cannot face up to the reality of — their true motivations. I say again: it is, so, antisemitism, at that.

They think it isn't, but it is.

YOU think it isn't, but it is.

Regards

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 08:57 AM

"So, why do you always attack Israel but never, say, Egypt."
Two reasons.
The two greatest threats to world peace today are from Islamist extremism and from Israeli expansionism, Israel's nuclear capability making her the greater threat.
They are both inexorably linked because they have their groundings in religion.
Egypt doesn't even come into the running at the present time.
Had the West and particularly the U.N. handled the Arab Spring differently, Egypt might just have put its own house in order - ISIS would certainly never have gained a toe-hold in Syria.
"Greg, I criticised China a lot on the thread I started about Syria."
While at the same time proposing that Assad be supplied with weapons and equipment to suppress any attempts at democratisation in Syria.

"rather a desperate attempt by "liberals" to claim some political credibility"
Liberal definition - a person with liberal views - obviously still a problem with Ake, despite former protestations that he had nothing against them.
Jim Carroll

MEDICAL PERSONNEL CLAIM ISRAEL TESTED NEW WEAPONS DURING ATTACKS ON GAZA
Lara Marlowe in Gaza   Irish Times Sept 6th.
Doctors describe injuries inconsistent with previously used ammunition
Doctors and an ambulance officer believe Israel tested new weapons during its July 8th - August 26th assault on the Gaza Strip.
Ambulance officer Ibrahim Abu Kas of the Palestinian Red Crescent Society has worked through the last three wars between Israel and Hamas. "In this war, I saw things I never could have imagined," he says. "The five children from the al-Jaal family in Zeitoun were the strangest thing I ever saw in my life."
The room where three girls and two boys were sleeping was hit by an Israeli tank shell while their mother, father and grand¬mother sat in another room. "Their bodies were hot. Their hair and skin were black liked charred wood. When their parents arrived at the hospital, they didn't recognise them," Abu Kas continues. "But there had been no fire, only white smoke."
'Third-degree burns'
Abu Kas's account corroborates what Dr Sobhi Skaik, chief surgeon and medical di¬rector at Shifa hospital and a member of the Royal College of Surgeons in Edinburgh, told me earlier: "We saw third-degree burns that cannot be explained; neither flame burns nor chemical burns. It was as if the patient became mummified, and most of them died. Their skin blackened and their tissue became tough and solid. I saw dozens of patients like this in the intensive care unit, from the Ajour and Hijazi families, among others."
Abu Kas worked 24 hours on/24 hours off for the first 40 days of the war, then round the clock, with brief naps in the Red Crescent office for the last 10 days. "I saw more than a dozen bodies that looked normal, with no marks or wounds. But when we touched them they were slip¬pery. If you tried to pick them up, the flesh fell off like jelly. We had to roll them in blankets."
Doctors at Shifa hospital heard rumours of chemical weapons or gas. "I saw a man whose limbs were jerking and he could not breathe before he died, but he had no wounds," Abu Kas recounts. Earlier, he had picked up people who were suffocating but survived.
Also early in the conflict, Abu Kas found a man sitting frozen in a chair, dead, but with no apparent wounds. When Israeli ground troops began pulling out, his ambulance followed in their wake. He discovered the bodies of five Palestinian fighters, seemingly frozen like the man in the chair, at least two of whom still clutched guns. Each had a small bullet hole in the forehead. "I think they were already dead when they were shot point blank," Abu Kas continues.
"The Israelis listen to our communications, and they must have known we were talking about chemicals or gas. I think they shot the dead fighters to hide how they died."
In the previous war, Israel was criticised for extensive use of white phosphorous, which causes horrific burn wounds. Dr Skaik saw 90 per cent of the 4,500 wounded brought to Shifa, Gaza's biggest public hospital. He did not find white phosphorous wounds in this war, though two eyewitnesses told me they saw the characteristic white jellyfish-like clouds over Shujaiya. Two sources confirmed the use of flechettes, tiny darts fired in anti-person¬nel tank shells, which cut their victims into mincemeat.
Whatever new weapons Israel may have used, "The worst illegal weapons are the siege, which is illegal collective punishment, the disproportionate use of force and the lack of discrimination between civilian and military targets," says the Norwegian doctor Mads Gilbert, who worked at Shifa during the war.
An emergency worker at Shifa called al-Yazdi found the bodies of his father and mother in the back of an ambulance.
"One day, I didn't carry a single living body - only dead people for 24 hours," says Abu Kas. "In previous wars, we could treat most of the wounded," says Dr Skaik. "This time, the number and magnitude of wounds was far greater. One third were dead on arrival."
Hospitals closed
More than a dozen ambulances were destroyed - "51 per cent of all major clinics and hospitals were damaged, and 27 per cent remain closed because of damage or lack of personnel," says Anders Thomsen ofthe UN Population Fund.
Abu Kas lists four places where the Israelis returned and attacked civilians and rescue workers who rushed to the site of a bombing. "The pilots can see my wristwatch from the cockpit, so they can certainly see the ambulances, fire engines and police cars," he says.
At about 5.30pm on July 30th, Abu Kas's ambulance was called to Shujaiya, one of the worst hit areas. "There were two bodies lying on the ground, and civilians brought me a girl with a head wound. It didn't look too bad, so I put her in the ambulance and went into a building where there were severely wounded people."
During a nightmarish hour of Israeli tank fire, Abu Kas was wounded in the hand and leg and the Palestinian news photographer Rami Rayan was killed beside the ambulance.
The girl was on Abu Kas's mind as he administered first aid to the wounded. By the time he returned, the ambulance had been hit and the wounded child's brains were spilling out. "I carried her body to another ambulance," Abu Kas says. He is crying. "I think about her all the time. If I die, it doesn't matter, because I've lived 35 years. But she was only 12-years-old."

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: akenaton
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 06:25 AM

I think you are wrong on that particular point M.

I don't think anti-Semitism is the driving force of all of the unrealistic posters, rather a desperate attempt by "liberals" to claim some political credibility.

Israeli retaliation has been disproportionate, their policy of expansion is blunt and cruel, the "Palestinian problem" is never properly addressed.
Of course as has been explained by yourself and Keith, there is rabid hypocrisy at work by so called liberals on this forum, but it is a last line of ideological defence rather than anti-Semitism.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 05:16 AM

Ain't that the truth! I carry the opposite of a brief for many current Israeli goings-on: the great disappointment of my life, as I never tire of saying. But this obsession with Israel even on threads like this where it is irrelevant or at most marginal, little as its expressers might like to acknowledge the fact, is nothing but antisemitism, pure & simple. As that character in Shaw's play would have put it so succinctly: they think it isn't, but it is.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Sep 14 - 04:41 AM

Israel is raised on many dedicated threads and also on unrelated threads by you people.
There are no dedicated threads about Egypt and you people never criticise it on threads where its behaviour could be raised.

Greg, I criticised China a lot on the thread I started about Syria.

The things Egypt does would have you hammering the keys if Jews did it.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 08:24 PM

Syria's military kills 35 civilians in Raqqa as Damascus launches airstrikes against Islamic State held areas: http://aje.me/1lO6Yqf

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 06:05 PM

Egypt, or Timbukto for that matter.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 05:32 PM

Odd that on threads about Israeli atrocities, decent people appear to be berated for mentioning Israel rather than, say, Egypt.

What silly pork sausages we are....

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 05:29 PM

Oh and FKWT: here, Educate Yourself

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 05:24 PM

Where are your posts attacking China, FKWT?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Bill D
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 04:17 PM

"It all depends on whose ox is being gored"
---------------------------------
"Daddy, he hit me first"

carry on....

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 02:27 PM

So, why do you always attack Israel but never, say, Egypt.
Greg, how can you deny that you do?
Where are your posts attacking Egypt?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 10:41 AM

"No jews, no views."

Just when you think he can't sink any lower....

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 10:34 AM

Civilians, including women, have been killed after Iraqui forces launched an offensive against IS in Kirkuk. Will we be hearing charges of genocide, indiscriminate killing and disproportionality? Will the UN launch an investigation into war crimes and human rights violations? I will be waiting.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 09:36 AM

That does not explain why you endlessly and only attack Israel while ignoring the far worse crimes of its neighbours.

Simple explanation FKWT: I don't.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 06 Sep 14 - 05:50 AM

So it is just the amount of aid?
That is why you endlessly attack Israel and ignore, for instance, Egypt who is guilty of blockading GAza plus all those other things I listed?!!

Why do you not just criticise the aid package?
Egypt is also kept afloat by US aid.

No.
That does not explain why you endlessly and only attack Israel while ignoring the far worse crimes of its neighbours.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 05 Sep 14 - 05:04 PM

BIG difference next door, FKWT - check the amount of aid each recieves and what sort.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Sep 14 - 04:37 AM

No different to Egypt next door.
like Israel supported by US taxes.
Guilty of apartheid against Bedouin, persecution of minorities and execution of political prisoners.
Also settling Bedouin land in Sinai.

lots of views posted about Israel, almost none about Egypt.
No Jews no views?

---

Everyone, please see this post, including moderator comment - Mod

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 04 Sep 14 - 12:46 PM

Perhaps Israel gets a mention because of the inferred shroud of respectability they drum up?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Sep 14 - 04:20 PM

There are many wrongs.
IS is about as evil an entity as anything in the world today.
The paradox is that Israel, much less evil if evil at all, is so much more attacked both in UN and here.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 03 Sep 14 - 09:04 AM

while what Israel is doing has got nothing to do with THIS thread.

Take it up with Boo, T-Bird. He's the one keeps dragging Israel into the conversation at every opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 03 Sep 14 - 04:49 AM

When your mind is so fucked up and twisted, and you can't see two wrongs...

IS being wrong doesn't make Israel right. They are both terrorising in order to inflict their way onto others. Civilised countries and The UN are condemning both.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Teribus
Date: 03 Sep 14 - 03:01 AM

"And what ISIS is or isn't doing has no bearing on what Israel is doing." - Greg F

But what ISIS is, or isn't, doing does have a massive bearing on the subject of this particular thread, while what Israel is doing has got nothing to do with THIS thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 09:53 PM

And what is Israel doing Greg?

Idiot.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 08:18 PM

And what is Israel doing Greg?

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 08:08 PM

Isn't it horrible what they're doing!

Sure is. And what ISIS is or isn't doing has no bearing on what Israel is doing.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 07:18 PM

So, no interest in the REAL ethnic cleansing being carried out by the IS, eh? But what about them Jews and the ethnic cleansing they're perpetrating, eh boys? Isn't it horrible what they're doing!

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 02:13 PM

Yo, Boo- you can't HANDLE the truth!

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Musket
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 12:51 PM

I don't know...

You have a pop at a sick bastard and the bloody moderators remove your post?

Best bit is, the moderators allow the sick stuff on the basis of free speech.

This is what happens I suppose when the site is moderated by foreigners. You just can't trust the buggers.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 11:23 AM

Awww......Greggie's got a little butt hurt from truth biting him on the ass.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 10:59 AM

despite the lack of a Jewish component to the report.

Idiot.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 10:49 AM

Well, I must revise my comment to "the previous post" as one has been removed due to the poster's ill mannered invective.

Another objective for the posting was to see if the report of ethnic cleansing by the IS would garner thousands of posts of condemnation despite the lack of a Jewish component to the report. So far it has, as expected, produced two ad hominem attacks from the usual suspects.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: bobad
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 10:27 AM

It's a hell of a lot more informative and relevant to the thread than the previous two posts, that's for sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Caliphate
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Sep 14 - 10:17 AM

And Bobad's contribution in that post is..?

Why, more horseshit, of course!