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Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?

DigiTrad:
BARRETTS PRIVATEERS
GARNETT'S HOMEMADE BEER
MICKEY'S MOUSKETEERS


Related threads:
Lyr Req: 3 minute LaMarca Ring of the Niebelungs (50)
(origins) Origins: Barrett's Privateers (Stan Rogers) (63)
Lyr Req: Barrett's Privateers (Stan Rogers) (3)
Lyr Req: Barrett's Privateers (Parody by Ian Robb) (17)
Lyr Req/ADD: Mickey's Mousketeers (parody) (7)


GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 28 Jan 18 - 08:03 PM
meself 28 Jan 18 - 08:45 PM
GUEST 29 Jan 18 - 10:11 AM
Rapparee 29 Jan 18 - 10:21 AM
GUEST,Morris-ey 29 Jan 18 - 11:33 AM
Backwoodsman 29 Jan 18 - 11:35 AM
meself 29 Jan 18 - 11:55 AM
GUEST,Morris-ey 29 Jan 18 - 12:08 PM
robomatic 29 Jan 18 - 12:31 PM
Bat Goddess 29 Jan 18 - 01:17 PM
Jeri 29 Jan 18 - 01:28 PM
Bat Goddess 29 Jan 18 - 02:09 PM
Bat Goddess 29 Jan 18 - 03:17 PM
michaelr 29 Jan 18 - 03:17 PM
meself 29 Jan 18 - 03:33 PM
Bat Goddess 29 Jan 18 - 04:15 PM
GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 29 Jan 18 - 07:53 PM
GUEST 29 Jan 18 - 07:55 PM
Joe Offer 30 Jan 18 - 12:10 AM
Severn 30 Jan 18 - 09:22 AM
GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 30 Jan 18 - 09:44 AM
robomatic 30 Jan 18 - 10:10 AM
GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 30 Jan 18 - 02:45 PM
GUEST,DonMeixner 30 Jan 18 - 06:05 PM
GUEST,DonMeixner 30 Jan 18 - 06:07 PM
GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 30 Jan 18 - 09:39 PM
Jack Campin 31 Jan 18 - 03:38 AM
GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 31 Jan 18 - 08:00 AM
DebC 01 Feb 18 - 10:38 PM
Dave the Gnome 02 Feb 18 - 03:08 AM
Howard Jones 02 Feb 18 - 04:21 AM
Joe Offer 02 Feb 18 - 04:29 AM
GUEST 02 Feb 18 - 04:34 AM
Phil Cooper 02 Feb 18 - 06:40 AM
GUEST,henryp 02 Feb 18 - 06:51 AM
meself 02 Feb 18 - 10:20 AM
GUEST,Kristoffer Ross 02 Feb 18 - 11:53 AM
DebC 02 Feb 18 - 02:54 PM
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Subject: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 28 Jan 18 - 08:03 PM

Hey, there!
    I've been browsing the forum for some time, but this is my first posting, so I apologize if this has been discussed before.
    My Ballad group, The Men o' War Balladeers, just released our first studio album, on which we recorded Stan Rogers' "Barrett's Privateers". Most of you probably know it. The Refrain:
"God Damn them all! I was told we'd cruise the sea for American gold, we'd fire no guns..."
    My question: how should I note this as I'm sending the album to radio programs (In this case, Fiona Ritchie's Thistle and Shamrock)? We're in upstate New York, USA, but I'll also probably be sending to a few Canadian stations too.
Many thanks,
    Kristoffer


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: meself
Date: 28 Jan 18 - 08:45 PM

If no one comes up with a better idea, I would suggest just adding a note to Fiona Ritchie reminding her that there is a "Goddamn" in the chorus. No doubt she is familiar with the song.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 10:11 AM

.... and the problem is ?


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Rapparee
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 10:21 AM

Don't worry about it. It's not like you're doing "Bastard King of England" or "The Good Ship Venus."


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Morris-ey
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 11:33 AM

This must be an USA issue. How would God damn them all be an issue when every rap song has words such as nigger and fuck in almost every verse?


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 11:35 AM

Much ado about nothing.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: meself
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 11:55 AM

Actually - there hasn't been an awful lot of ado, has there?


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Morris-ey
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 12:08 PM

At least 5 people now know of the Balladeers new CD....


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: robomatic
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 12:31 PM

I think a note with the full chorus should be appended. 'Damn' has very little negative import, but put the 'G' word in front of it and there will be people who perhaps didn't know they were sensitive who feel a couple nerve cells prick up (sorry about that word 'prick').
When I read the thread title I had no idea what you meant by 'explicit' but I think your attention to this does you credit.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 01:17 PM

No folk show that I know of ever had any concerns about playing Stan's recording of his song back in the 1980s. "God damn" was never an issue.

But do you have permission to have recorded it and have you obtained a license?

That would be the more concerning issue -- the song is under copyright.

Linn


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Jeri
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 01:28 PM

Religious folks can object to "God damn", especially if they've never heard the song before and don't know it's coming. People who know the song are aware of when to stick their fingers in their ears.

With regards to Linn's mention of copyright, I don't think you need a license or permission, but you have to credit the song and pay royalties. Rogers' songs are fiercely protected by family and lawyers.
But as you're professionals, you probably know all this, and it's not what you asked about. (Nobody has ever accused folks at Mudcat of trying to stick to the subject :)


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 02:09 PM

You need permission to record a copyrighted song.

"Is it legal to record a cover of someone else’s song?

When you record a cover version of someone else's song, you need to get a mechanical license authorizing you to reproduce their composition.

A “mechanical license” is the industry name for an agreement that gives you permission from a songwriter or publisher to record a song that you do not own the songwriting copyright for. The main situation in which a mechanical license would be necessary is if you want to write a cover song. But that’s not the only situation where you could need a mechanical license."

- From https://www.newmediarights.org/business_models/artist/it_legal_record_cover_someone_else%E2%80%99s_song

Linn


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 03:17 PM

Also
Guidelines for the Use of Music Under Copyright

There's plenty of information out there. You need permission to use copyrighted material for anything except personal use.

Especially if it's on a CD for intended airplay. Most radio stations won't touch it otherwise.

Linn


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: michaelr
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 03:17 PM

Permission is not required for a song that's been recorded before. But a mechanical license is.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: meself
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 03:33 PM

I imagine the Original Poster, every time he sees that there's a new post, hoping he'll get an answer to his question ... !


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 04:15 PM

Fiona Ritchie, I'm sure, is very familiar with the song and the chorus lyrics, so I doubt they'd need to be pointed out to her.

As I pointed out earlier, I've heard Stan Rogers' recording of the song on radio folk shows over the past, what? 35 years? I don't know of a instance where the exclamation was ever an issue.

More of an issue here is that it's a copyrighted song, not a traditional public domain song.

Linn


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 07:53 PM

Hi, Again, all!
    Thanks for all the responses! I'll try to address all the points brought up, so it's gonna be a long post.
    A) As was suggested, I'll enclose the chorus lyrics in my letter when I send it. I'm a non-fundamentalist religious person, but to tell the truth, I hadn't even considered "God Damn them all" offensive until just before we went on for a radio interview, and the kind host asked if there were any she shouldn't play off the CD for profanity reasons. Hence my original query. Thanks for all the input!
    B) I did purchase mechanical licenses. Being an annoying, over-researching homeschooler, I looked into copyright in great detail. My takeaway, as applies to the USA: To distribute a cover song, you need to secure a mechanical license, but, if the copyright owner has published the song beforehand, you don't need specific permission, AS LONG as you have a license that pays the composer/publisher the current royalty rate of 9.2 cents per manufactured copy per song (if your recording is under 5 minutes, rated per-minute if longer) This applies even if you're giving away your recordings. In addition, I'd requested permission from Ariel (Stan's widow), but never heard back.
    Because Stan' songs were copyrighted in Canada, some third party Licensing companies believe they require custom licensing and try to put extra on their fee, but I was able to find one that did standard rate.
    C) Please don't think I posted this to as free advertising for our album. I specifically didn't name the album or put in hyperlinks so as not to.
    Many thanks!
Kristoffer


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Jan 18 - 07:55 PM

From meself: "I imagine the Original Poster, every time he sees that there's a new post, hoping he'll get an answer to his question ... !"
:-) :-)
Actually, I was at work all day, so I saw all of them at once when I got home. Lots to read through!
Kristoffer


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 12:10 AM

And Kristoffer, letting us know about recordings you've made is part of the deal at Mudcat. Please give us information about the CD and how to get it. If it's folk, we want to know about it.
Over-marketing is another matter, but giving us the facts about a new recording is helpful.

-Joe Offer, Music Editor, The Mudcat Cafe-


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Severn
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 09:22 AM

What I always go by is context. If someone actually wishing that something or someone would indeed be condemned to Hell, then it's fine. People in battle or on sinking ships tend to feel that way a lot. If you just sling the word around just to hear yourself cuss and really wish somebody's fate to end up shoott, it's not. I was a guest co-host on a Folk show with a long time radio person and when she played a version of "Jack Hall The Chimney Sweep", I mentioned that I sing a version of "Sam Hall" that was a combination the best verses of all the meanest versions I've heard of what I consider the greatest "venting" song of all time, she askedme to sing it, even though I was just a substitute DJ. After I did, she said what I sang was perfectly alright to sing on a community station's airwaves. It was also fine with the regular host, who was streaming it from where she was visiting.


The chorus should be OK for the listening public and not just for "privateers only", but always check with the host for their preferences.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 09:44 AM

Thanks, Severn! I feel much the same way about it: I'd be cursing too, if "The main tuck carried off both me legs"
Joe Offer - Thanks for the clarification. If you wish to give a listen, the album is Rise with the Moon, available here, on CD Baby. We actually have 4 of Stan's songs on it, and a bunch of Traditional ones as well. Our Website and Facebook Page are linked below.
    Best,
Kristoffer Ross,
The Men o' War Balladeers
Our website is https://themenowarballadeers.wordpress.com/.
https://www.facebook.com/themenowarballadeers/


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: robomatic
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 10:10 AM

As someone who has sung this song on the trail to scare away bears and been privileged to join the chorus sung by a Canadian band on an actual Halifax Pier I've enjoyed the hell out of this thread (please pardon the 'H' word)!


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 02:45 PM

Robomatic,
    "I enjoyed the hell out of myself playing on this album, as I do most of the time that I work out with Stan and Garnet..."
-David Alan Eadie, Bass, liner notes in "Between the Breaks...Live!"
    Best wishes,
Kristoffer


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,DonMeixner
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 06:05 PM

Kristoffer,

First of all, where in Upstate New York. There are those that view Beacon or Croton-on-Harmon to be upstate. I am between Syracuse and Auburn.

Anytime I have felt it necessary to censor Barrett's Privateers I have just sung "Ah, Damn them all."

Don Meixner


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,DonMeixner
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 06:07 PM

Ah!Found it. Yes, you are in upstate NY.

D


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 30 Jan 18 - 09:39 PM

Yes, Don, quite upstate! (Cambridge, NY, about 200mi from NYC). We're just west of VT. New York seems way too big, sometimes - Eire (Rep. of Ireland, not a typo of Erie) is a nice, manageable size for me.
Best,
    Kristoffer


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 31 Jan 18 - 03:38 AM

The warning listeners really need about that song is how much of their life they're not going to get back. It's far too goddamn long and literal.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 31 Jan 18 - 08:00 AM

Jack Campin: Well, our recording is 4m 11s, and it's actually one of the shorter songs on the album :-) Arthur MacBride, anyone?
    Kristoffer


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: DebC
Date: 01 Feb 18 - 10:38 PM

You should put a sticker on the front of the package that says FCC Language warning with the track #. All it takes is one complaint from a "concerned listener" to the FCC complaint line and that radio station could be fined to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars.

There are a still a few folk DJs who won't play any songs that might have the seven words. Even so, on my last solo recording, I did have a song that had damn and hell and I put a sticker on the front anyway.

There has certainly ben a relaxation of standards on certain words, but it is the courteous thing to do to warn the DJs and they appreciate it.

Deb


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 03:08 AM

If you look at the words in context it is not using the phrase 'Goddamn or Goddamned'. It is a request for God to damn them all. A completely different kettle of fish and a fate that fundamentalists would happily wish on people who were not of their faith.

You are over thinking and over worrying Kristoffer. It's like worrying that 'Anyone for coffee' contains an expletive :-)

DtG


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Howard Jones
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 04:21 AM

From the other side of the pond, this all sounds extraordinary. The BBC's guidelines on strong language are mainly concerned with sexual words but include this:

words or names associated with religion, such as Jesus Christ, may cause offence to some, but they are unlikely to cause widespread offence according to generally accepted standards. Again, we should still take care to avoid indiscriminate use.

They go on to say that context of the use is a factor.

I think it is very doubtful whether a British broadcaster would give this more than a moment's consideration. However we are a much less religious society.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 04:29 AM

Gee, with "explicit lyrics" in the thread title and 30 messages posted, I came here hoping to find something really juicy.

Can't somebody write us a bawdy version of "Barrett's Privateers"? Abby Sale must have one, dontchathink?

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 04:34 AM

"God damn" is "explicit" ? In the country that gave the world rap music ?


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: Phil Cooper
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 06:40 AM

Stan did a concert back in the Chicago suburbs about a year before he died at Fermilab, which had a folk concert series back then. He was on a bill with the Red Clay Ramblers. He closed his set with Barrett's Privateers. After the show someone in the audience, indeed, said they found as born again Christians that the phrase Goddamn them all was offensive. Stan thanked them for their honesty and said what he found offensive was the notion of a the whole universe bowing in homage to some grand pubba ruler. Then he walked off.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,henryp
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 06:51 AM

Don't worry about it.

It's a dramatic piece. It's the voice of the character, not the singer.


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: meself
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 10:20 AM

Stan was never known for his tact, was he?


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: GUEST,Kristoffer Ross
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 11:53 AM

Thanks you, All, particularly to DebC (quoted below)! This is exactly the answer I needed.
    Best, Kristoffer
DebC Said: "You should put a sticker on the front of the package that says FCC Language warning with the track #. All it takes is one complaint from a "concerned listener" to the FCC complaint line and that radio station could be fined to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars.

There are a still a few folk DJs who won't play any songs that might have the seven words. Even so, on my last solo recording, I did have a song that had damn and hell and I put a sticker on the front anyway.

There has certainly ben a relaxation of standards on certain words, but it is the courteous thing to do to warn the DJs and they appreciate it.

Deb"


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Subject: RE: Barrett's Privateers- Explicit Lyrics?
From: DebC
Date: 02 Feb 18 - 02:54 PM

Kristoffer Ross: you might subscribe to the FOLKDJ-L discussion list. This kind of information is always there and discussion of FCC language comes up every so often. The website is here

Debra Cowan (DebC)


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