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BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics

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Steve Latimer 13 Jul 01 - 11:24 AM
MMario 13 Jul 01 - 11:29 AM
sian, west wales 13 Jul 01 - 11:34 AM
Mrrzy 13 Jul 01 - 11:35 AM
Grab 13 Jul 01 - 11:52 AM
Rick Fielding 13 Jul 01 - 11:55 AM
Bill D 13 Jul 01 - 11:59 AM
katlaughing 13 Jul 01 - 12:03 PM
sophocleese 13 Jul 01 - 12:03 PM
GUEST,JohnB 13 Jul 01 - 12:25 PM
GeorgeH 13 Jul 01 - 01:12 PM
Mrrzy 13 Jul 01 - 01:18 PM
Whistle Stop 13 Jul 01 - 01:21 PM
John J 13 Jul 01 - 01:24 PM
Steve Latimer 13 Jul 01 - 02:28 PM
Mrrzy 13 Jul 01 - 02:30 PM
Linda Kelly 13 Jul 01 - 02:30 PM
Steve Latimer 13 Jul 01 - 03:24 PM
DougR 13 Jul 01 - 03:40 PM
Big Tim 13 Jul 01 - 03:50 PM
The Shambles 13 Jul 01 - 05:06 PM
Ebbie 13 Jul 01 - 05:09 PM
DougR 13 Jul 01 - 05:25 PM
thosp 13 Jul 01 - 05:26 PM
katlaughing 13 Jul 01 - 05:29 PM
DougR 14 Jul 01 - 12:31 AM
GUEST,Bob G 14 Jul 01 - 01:56 AM
JennieG 15 Jul 01 - 01:24 AM
Banjer 15 Jul 01 - 03:34 AM
Fiolar 15 Jul 01 - 06:36 AM
Little Hawk 15 Jul 01 - 11:03 AM

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Subject: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:24 AM

It was just announced that Beijing was awarded the 2008 Summer Games. I am a Canadian who hoped (but really didn't expect) that Toronto would get them. Politics, Politics, Politics. I don't think Mayor Mel helped too much either.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: MMario
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:29 AM

man, I really was hoping for Toronto


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: sian, west wales
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:34 AM

I was kinda hoping for TO too. I also remember the horror stories from Beijing when the World Congress of Women was held there a few years back. Draconian security, severe press restrictions, etc. The world media didn't worry about it too much at the time because, well - after all - it was only women. But this time? Yer messin' with our sports, boys!

Be interesting to see if the Olympics really does have the positive effects on the population as everyone is claiming.

But I still would have liked to see it in T'rana.

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:35 AM

Man, I was hoping for NOT Beijing. All that smog, the poor athletes! But thanks for the news, I'd been awaiting this.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Grab
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:52 AM

Interestingly, I heard on the radio yesterday that China was promising that reporters could go _anywhere_ and report on _anything_. Now that would be interesting to test...

Graham.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:55 AM

Well, I for one am thrilled that we didn't get it in Toronto. Six years of massive construction delays downtown, for something that most folks wouldn't be able to afford tickets to. But I should have been hung for being a heretic years ago.

I really doubt that our little dork Mayor's gaffe had much to do with the result. Certainly not as much as Juan (I was NOT a Nazi) Antonio Samarach's lobbying for the Nobel Prize affected it. His supporters will immediately start trumpeting how he "brought East and West together".

T'was fun watching the build up though. Let the race to develop REALLY undetectable steriods begin.

Rick


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 11:59 AM

this is either a collosal blunder or an opening wedge into a closed society...time will tell


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 12:03 PM

it should be boycotted in support of Tibet


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: sophocleese
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 12:03 PM

I'm with Rick on this one. Not that I think Bejing is a great choice but I always did have more sympathy with the Bread not Circuses people in Toronto.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 12:25 PM

Count me in with Rick and Sophocleese. How much money was actually spent by these jerks NOT getting the Olympics ? Could we have done anything more useful with that money. YES!. JohnB


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: GeorgeH
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 01:12 PM

Don't know about the Toronto case (but I'm relieved we weren't "playing for it" . . ) but it's a pretty sad decision . . Have the Olympic committee leaned nothing since Nurenberg??

Baghdad in 2012, no doubt . . .

G.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 01:18 PM

I'm surprised I'm the only person who's commented on the actual environmental effects of some of the worst air in any industrialized area on the athletes. I would have all countries boycott on that basis. Remember, the Olympics are supposed to transcend politics. I was against the boycott we had last time for political reasons, and am against boycotting because of human rights, or Tibet, or anything that isn't about The Games. But the smog - I wouldn't send MY child to those Games. If they were Olympic athletes, that is...


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 01:21 PM

I wouldn't count on the Olympics being a force for positive change in China. It sure didn't work that way in Berlin, or Mexico City, or Moscow, or really anywhere that I can think of. The Olympics is a big photo op for the host country, and a short-term money-making enterprise for the host city (that often turns into a money-losing proposition once everyone has gone home and the bills come due). Cheating (drugging) is routine, the officials are crooked, and the "spectacle" is as phony as any Disney production. I sure wouldn't want it coming to my town.

Wow... what a downer! Feel free to call on me any time you need someone to cheer you up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: John J
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 01:24 PM

I was in Nepal the back end of last year, there are many camps of Tibetan refugees who have escaped the Chinese. They really want to tell their stories, many of which were heartbreaking. Lovely people. I can't support the award of the Olympics to such an oppressive regime. The chinese a nice people too. Shame about the politicians and those in power.

Money talks in the end. It was only to be expected.

John :-(


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 02:28 PM

Whistle Stop,

How about the Winter Games in Sarajevo?

I think the Olympics would have been great for the Toronto economy. It woul have produced many jobs, which although things are still pretty strong here they are slowing down and experts predict will continue to do so. I think that although Toronto is starting to become recognized as a world Class city by North Americans, it has a long way to go to be recognized worlwide and The Olympics would have helped. The infrastructure necessary to house the Olympics would only help to ease some of the housing problems that already exist in Toronto.

I also realize it's pretty easy to say all of this living 45 minutes away. Rick's concerns are real, I just think that the positives would have outweighed the negatives.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 02:30 PM

Now if only we could get the media to cover it as a SPORTING event, MAN the coverage sucked big green donkey body parts these last few times...


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 02:30 PM

Just about sums up the Olympic Movement doesn't it - as a smokescreen for big business desperate to get a foothold into another market no matter what cost. More people have been executed in China in the last three months than anywhere else in the world in the last three years.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Steve Latimer
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 03:24 PM

Maybe Mayor Mel messed up more than we thought he did. This from www.canoe.ca

Lastman controversy hung over Toronto's presentation MOSCOW (CP) -- Toronto's Mayor Mel Lastman wasn't on stage, but he was still front and centre Friday in Toronto's final pitch for the 2008 Olympic Games.

Toronto's 45-minute presentation began with a traditional native welcome and ended with African delegates granting forgiveness to the city's mayor.

Two aboriginal singers and a dancer opened the show, a mix of live performances, music and video aimed at winning the 2008 Summer Games over Beijing, Paris, Istanbul and Osaka, Japan.

The one thing missing from the live show before International Olympic Committee members was Lastman, who spoke in a pre-recorded message shot in Toronto.

But Lastman and racist comments he recently made about Africa loomed large over the display.

At the end of the presentation, an African IOC member asked why the mayor was missing from the stage and sought an explanation for his recent comments.

"Something just struck me and that is the mayor of Toronto made a comment," said Alpha Ibrahim Diallo of Guinea. "Something that was an infringement of the Olympic values."

Prime Minister Jean Chretien responded by reminding the IOC that Toronto is one of the most multicultural cities in the world.

"The mayor made a mistake," he said. "Canada has demonstrated and it will demonstrate that it is the most tolerant country in the world."

The matter was put aside when Judge Keba Mbaye, an IOC member from Senegal, accepted the apology on behalf of all African countries.

"I consider, and I think I can say on behalf of all my African brothers . . . that the incident is now closed. It is over with."

Lastman has scarcely been seen with the bid since he arrived in Moscow and sat in the audience during Toronto's presentation, then walked through the media centre with Canadian Olympic wrestler Daniel Igali, who was dressed in a flowing light blue babariga -- native Nigerian clothing.

The mayor refused to answer questions as he walked to an empty bus waiting for him outside.

John Bitove, head of the Toronto bid, said afterward that he expected the question, the apology was accepted and the matter is closed.

Toronto's bid was the only one to face difficult questions about human rights.

Beijing's bid team wasn't asked a single question about the liberty of its citizens, despite its dismal record on human rights. Instead, IOC delegates asked the Beijing bid technical questions about pollution, doping standards and transportation.

Besides Toronto, the bidding cities stuck to a similar script as they made their presentations.

All of them showed videos boosting the merits of their bids and made promises to guarantee that all facilities would be ready on time, with financial backing from their respective governments to ensure they are completed.

The Paris bid attempted to show what would happen on a typical day in the city during the Games, emphasizing landmarks like the Eiffel Tower that would serve as backdrops for an Olympics in the City of Light.

French soccer star Zinedine Zidane, the world's most expensive player at $103 million Cdn, accompanied the bid, but had no role in the presentation, other than to pose for photographs with the bid presenters when they were finished.

While the IOC wasn't asking questions about China's human rights abuses, Toronto and Paris stressed their democratic foundations.

"Canada, a land of freedom and generosity . . . a beacon of peace that attracts people from around the world," said Chretien.

Paris Mayor Bertrand Delanoe said France is "the country that gave the world human rights."

Toronto's presentation was part show business and part technical detail, featuring Chretien, Ontario Premier Mike Harris and an array of Canadian Olympians, including rower Marnie McBean, sprinter Donovan Bailey and cyclist Curt Harnett.

Vanessa Morgan, age nine, got the room clapping to Toronto's official bid song, Expect the World, belting out the tune to loud applause from the IOC.

The presentation started with Grand Chief Larry Sault of the Association of Iroquois and Allied Indians giving his blessing to the bid on behalf of Aboriginal Peoples.

"I would like to welcome all nations to our great land, Canada, in 2008," said Sault, who goes by the native name Strong Eagle.

He was the last to leave the stage, giving Juan Antonio Samaranch, the president of the IOC, a staff with the Olympic rings included in its design.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: DougR
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 03:40 PM

I think it was a dumb political decision. No one wanted to make China mad. Kat's right on this one.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Big Tim
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 03:50 PM

After the political boycotts (started by the Americans) in Moscow (1980) and in LA (1984)(Soviet retaliation) I'm surprised anyone interested in SPORT can take the charade seriously any more. Well at least the Moscow boycott let Allan Wells win a gold for Scotland (sorry the UK!).


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: The Shambles
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 05:06 PM

I see they are to introduce a new event for the China games, tank wrestling.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Ebbie
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 05:09 PM

I don't suppose many people agree with me but I would like to see the Olympics permanently based in Greece.

Ebbie


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: DougR
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 05:25 PM

That would suit me fine, Ebbie.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: thosp
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 05:26 PM

i'm with IckleDorritt -- it'business-business and more business drooling over the chinese market,that the decision was based on

Shambles -- lol

Ebbie - that's a thought pursueing

peace (Y) thosp


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Jul 01 - 05:29 PM

ebbie, that's the best suggestion I've heard yet. I don't even like to watch them anymore as they aren't about amatuer althetes as much as about commericalism, as others have noted.

DougeR...nice to share the same side with you on this one.:-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: DougR
Date: 14 Jul 01 - 12:31 AM

kat: Smaaaaaaaack! I always agree with you when you are right! **BG**

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: GUEST,Bob G
Date: 14 Jul 01 - 01:56 AM

I like Chinese I like Chinese We'll send our athletes overseas Who did Mel insult in the I.O.C.

(with apologies to Monty Python.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: JennieG
Date: 15 Jul 01 - 01:24 AM

Well I live in Sydney which had the last Olympics - and Himself and I spent the whole Olympic 3 weeks in New Zealand rather than stay here (although I believe it wasn't as bad as people were expecting). The promised jobs don't seem to be there; my as-yet-to-be-conceived grandchildren will be still paying for the stadium. After all it's the opening ceremony that people really want to see - never mind the sport.
Cheers
JennieG


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Banjer
Date: 15 Jul 01 - 03:34 AM

I intend to let every major sponsor of the Olympics know that I will do all I can to NOT use their products and or services as much as possible. There are many alternate providors that can probably fill my needs without furtheer lining the pockets of those who would support the Olympics in such a setting. The companies that will gain my support are those that will pull their sponsorship for these Olympics.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Fiolar
Date: 15 Jul 01 - 06:36 AM

China in 2008? - politics, my dear people, politics. As for Greece permanently getting the Games,- agree, provided Athens which is one of the most polluted cities in Europe cleans itself up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Beijing Gets 2008 Olympics
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Jul 01 - 11:03 AM

I also agree with Ebbie. The Olympics should be held in Greece at a permanent location.

My general reaction to the Olympics as they exist now is a great big YAWN, and a general feeling of disgust.

I am rather relieved that Toronto didn't get it.

- LH


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This Thread Is Closed.


Mudcat time: 28 November 6:23 AM EST

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