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BS: Obama is a socialist
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 18 Oct 08 - 09:57 PM From: CarolC Date: 18 Oct 08 - 09:54 PM It is known and documented fact that the US has been interfering in other countries' democracies for decades, getting rid of leaders who aren't willing to do our bidding, even democratically elected ones, and installing puppets who are. The government of this country has been trying to get rid of Chavez for years. Duh!!! Want a list? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 18 Oct 08 - 10:07 PM Listen, one might be tempted to think that they are preaching to someone who is an innocent on these matters, but they are not. They are, as I have said before, making a very large assumption. A perusal of my posting history would show exactly what I know and what I don't know. So quit badgering me, ok? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 18 Oct 08 - 11:35 PM Like you were to me?? Like I said in an earlier post, on another thread, There is a double standard. Truce? You don't nag and argue with me about every letter and period I type, and I don't 'badger'(as you say) you. How 'bout it?? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 18 Oct 08 - 11:39 PM I'll definitely continue to refute things that I think are incorrect. But on the subject of how the world is run, there's no point in preaching to the choir. We are not in disagreement about that. We are only in disagreement about whether or not getting Obama elected will make any difference. I think there is a possibility that it could, so I am following my conscience and debunking any BS I see being posted about him. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 01:12 AM Well Well Well. Who paid for Obama's Harvard Ejucaition? Pause. Don't see no volinteers out thar so here goes. An influential, radical black Muslim with close ties to the Saudi royal family and an outspoken opponent of Israel helped finance Obama's law school education. Obama's benefactor at the young age of 25 is Dr. Khalid Abdullah Tariq al-Mansour a/k/a Donald Warden. Here are some facts you should know about al-Mansour according to a investigative report: * "He is well known within the black community as a lawyer, an orthodox Muslim, a black nationalist, an author, an international deal-maker, an educator, and an outspoken enemy of Israel." * In a 1995 book, "The Lost Books of Africa Rediscovered," he alleged that the United States was plotting genocide against black Americans. * He was the mentor of Black Panther Party founder Huey Newton and his cohort, Bobby Seale. * Al-Mansour's more recent videotaped speeches focus on Muslim themes, and abound with anti-Semitic theories and anti-Israel vitriol. * At the same time he was raising money for Obama's education he was representing top members of the Saudi Royal family seeking to do business and exert influence in the United States. * He advises Prince Alwaleed bin Talal in his U.S. investments. Prince Talal is most famous for offering $10 million to the City of New York following 9/11, a contribution turned down by Mayor Rudy Giuliani because the Prince said American policies were to blame for the terrorist attacks. Prince Alwaleed has made tens of millions in contributions to Muslim-American charities, some of whose leaders have been charged by our government with terrorism-related ties. Prince Alwaleed also donates millions to Harvard for Islamic studies. Newmax sought a response from the Obama campaign about the financial assistance Obama received from al-Mansour, but the campaign refused to respond. This disclosure came in a very unlikely fashion. Percy Sutton, a prominent African-American businessman, was being interviewed when he described how he first came to know Obama. "I was introduced to (Obama) by a friend who was raising money for him," Sutton told NY1 city hall reporter Dominic Carter. "The friend's name is Dr. Khalid al-Mansour, from Texas," Yelling: The campaign refused to respond? Dnag! Now theres is tha change we need fer shore. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Alice Date: 19 Oct 08 - 01:23 AM Folklore? Tales Tall And Otherwise (thread name game) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: artbrooks Date: 19 Oct 08 - 01:24 AM Occam's Razor says that the simple explanation is usually the most accurate one...this is otherwise known as "keep it simple, stupid". Obama borrowed money, like most college students, and paid it back when he was able. According to Michelle Obama, as reported by FOX: "when she and her husband left law school, the monthly payments on their school loan debt was more than their monthly mortgage payment. She said they only got out of that debt when Barack Obama wrote his two books, "The Audacity of Hope" and "Dreams from My Father." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Janie Date: 19 Oct 08 - 01:26 AM Sawzaw, Suggest you vet your sources. (And I wish others, supporters of either candidate, would do the same.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 01:45 AM The only place that story shows up is blogs and forums and none of them provide any documentation whatever. I guess we can put that one in the stinky circular file where it belongs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 02:02 AM LOL Right wing reactionaries need to learn to get their stories straight. There's another fictional hate-mongering smear campaign going around that says Obama's education was paid for by Tony Rezko. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 02:44 AM Obama: I am not freinds with Bill Ayres. He is just another guy in the neighborhood. "The notion that me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when I was 8 years old, somehow reflects on me and my values doesn't make much sense." But: Sen. Obama wrote a blurb for a 1997 Ayres book on the penal system. The book jacket mentioned Ayres' terrorist activities. "Obama's review of Ayers' book says, "A searing and timely account of the juvenile court system, and the courageous individuals who rescue hope from despair Michelle Obama chaired a panel for Ayers, and invited her husband to share the stage, to promote a program and a book by Ayers, to lower sentences and change court attitudes, toward juvenile offenders. Ayers was an ex-officio board member and he and Obama worked closely, for years, between the Wood Fund and the CAC, to fund Ayers' pet projects, including Ayers' own Small School Project. Ayers' got lots of money for his own ideology. For 5 years Obama distributed over $100M with Ayers' help. The two of them decided who got funds and who didn't. They favored a heavily ethnic agenda, and when all the money was gone, they closed down. Annenberg's own report shows that NOTHING was achieved in the school - and indeed the money only went to external partners, to which schools had to try to attach themselves. Ayers: Everything was absolutely ideal on the day I bombed the Pentagon. The sky was blue. The birds were singing. And the bastards were finally going to get what was coming to them. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 08 - 02:50 AM Well, Sawzaw, they did ask for sources!!....Doesn't mean they'll believe or accept it. But now that a pretty good source and proof was posted, watch them STILL be boneheaded, and act like they didn't see it...only what they selectively see and hear. That being said, still doesn't make McCain any better, either. As I've said before, as far as being president, they both would suck! Folks, we're in deep shit! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:03 AM Vet what? Obama's campaign refused to respond. Seems like they would quash this rumor real quick if it is only a rumor. Why won't the Obama campaign release his thesis and Obama's college transcript like a normal presidential campaign? There must be something in it to hide frrom the public. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:07 AM Hey Sawzaw..by the way...I personally want to thank you for posting what you posted.....Thank you! Warmest regards, GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:07 AM LOLOL The smell of desperation is getting quite pungent. Writing a blurb about a book doesn't indicate anything. The book could very well be as Obama described it. Here's a press release about the panel discussion. Pretty radical stuff... http://www-news.uchicago.edu/releases/97/971104.juvenile.justice.shtml The only place the rest of it shows up is on one blog, and in the comments section of the same blog. Neither of them provide any documentation other than the press release for the panel discussion. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:08 AM The only source we have even for the idea that Obama's campaign refused to respond is from the same blogs. There's no evidence that Obama's campaign has ever even been asked about it in the first place. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:10 AM Nice try, though. LOLOLOL |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:23 AM ..and thank you, CarolC. What do you think happened to the parenting in this country, that would cause 'children' to pick up guns, and become 'predators'?..as your post indicates. Why do you think, at this time in our history, has this become so prevalent?...(in 25 words or less) T.V.?, Movies?,....or children left alone to be raised by their 'street peers'?.....I think we 'discussed' this problem before, remember?? And, I am not 'badgering' you, with this post. Rather, trying to point out, and underline, again, that NO ONE can replace the bonding between parents and children, while the BOTH parents run out from the home, to pursue careers, at the expense of their much needed presence, in the home, when they have younger children..... Thank you, once again, for your post! Regards, GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:33 AM My own personal opinion is that the United States has been designated by the globalists to be the breeding pool for the warrior class of the New World Order, and for that reason, the cultural milieu that is being promoted through television, film, and especially video games is promoting a culture of violence, especially among the young. That, and financial constraints cause many households to have no parent in the home for many hours of the day (mostly because the parents are working, often times at multiple jobs, just to get by), so that the major influences on those young people are the popular culture that is being promoted by the corporate media, which I have already described as being one that promotes a culture of violence. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:40 AM By the way, since I notice that press release is being selectively quoted, here's the rest of it. I don't agree with the use of terminology like predator in talking about children. I agree that we should call a child a child... 'A panel at the University of Chicago debates the merits of the juvenile justice system Children who kill are called "super predators," "people with no conscience," "feral pre-social beings"–and "adults." William Ayers, author of A Kind and Just Parent: The Children of Juvenile Court(Beacon Press, 1997), says "We should call a child a child. A 13-year-old who picks up a gun isn't suddenly an adult. We have to ask other questions: How did he get the gun? Where did it come from?" Ayers, who spent a year observing the Cook County Temporary Juvenile Detention Center in Chicago, is one of four panelists who will speak on juvenile justice at 6 p.m. Thursday, Nov. 20, in the C-Shop of the Reynolds Club, 5706 S. University Ave. The panel, which marks the 100th anniversary of the juvenile justice system in the United States, is part of the Community Service Center's monthly discussion series on issues affecting the city of Chicago. The event is free and open to the public. Ayers will be joined by Illinois State Sen. Barack Obama, Senior Lecturer in the University of Chicago Law School, who is working to block proposed legislation that would throw more juvenile offenders into the adult system; Randolph Stone, Director of the Mandel Legal Aid Clinic at the University of Chicago; Alex Correa, a reformed juvenile offender who spent 7 years in Cook County Temporary Detention Center; Frank Tobin, a former priest and teacher in the Detention Center who helped Correa; and Willy Baldwin, who grew up in public housing and is currently a teacher in the Detention Center. The juvenile justice system was founded by Chicago reformer Jane Addams, who advocated the establishment of a separate court system for children which would act like a "kind and just parent" for children in crisis. One hundred years later, the system is "overcrowded, under-funded, over-centralized and racist," Ayers said. Michelle Obama, Associate Dean of Student Services and Director of the University of Chicago Community Service Center, hopes bringing issues like this to campus will open a dialogue between members of the University community and the broader community. "We know that issues like juvenile justice impact each of us who live in the city of Chicago. This panel gives community members and students a chance to hear about the juvenile justice system not only on a theoretical level, but from the people who have experienced it."' |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 08 - 03:57 AM Fair to respond??....The problem started in the late 60's and early 70's...and yes, it began with a political agenda, to financially 'feed' the major corporations, and government, by increasing the tax base. The rest, I have posted before.....David Rockefeller, rightfully claims, to be one of the chief promoters of this agenda... At this juncture, I'll stop, and ask you, or anyone, should I continue? This subject, is very close to me, and I have an extreme working knowledge of it, having been in the field for decades, having written court reports, and a book on it. Wanna' go for it??? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 04:02 AM I don't particularly care one way or another, myself, but maybe if it's going to be done, a separate thread might be appropriate. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 08 - 04:18 AM Oh, It's directly related, but if you don't care, I understand...but then YOU were the one who wanted FACTS, not opinions. Nonetheless, thank you for your post, responding to Sawzaw. I thought the 'LOLOLOL' was a bit inappropriate, myself. Sorta looked as if,...never mind. Hey, anytime you want some golden info on this subject, let me know. I don't know, as I said before, if you'd accept it..but it is accurate! Regards, GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: artbrooks Date: 19 Oct 08 - 10:14 AM factcheck.org has discussed the oh-so-deep relationship between Obama and Ayers, and concluded that there is more there than Obama has previously stated, but still not much. Oh course, FactCheck is also funded by that radical leftist organization, the Annenberg Foundation... United States has been designated by the globalists to be the breeding pool for the warrior class of the New World Order? Thanks for a morning giggle. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 10:22 AM No problem. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 10:27 AM Man, this is so friggin wierd. You can't make this stuff up: Percy Sutton knew Al-Mansour well, since the two men had been business partners and served on several corporate boards together.As Sutton remembered, Al-Mansour was raising money for Obama's education and seeking recommendations for him to attend Harvard Law School."I was introduced to (Obama) by a friend who was raising money for him," Sutton told NY1 city hall reporter Dominic Carter. "The friend's name is Dr. Khalid al-Mansour, from Texas."Obama spokesman Ben LaBolt told Newsmax that Sutton's account was "bogus" and a "fabrication that has been retracted" by a spokesman for the Sutton family. He referred Newsmax to a pro-Obama blog published on Politico.com by reporter Ben Smith. In a September 3 blog entry, Smith wrote that "a spokesman for Sutton's family, Kevin Wardally" said that Sutton had been mistaken when he made those comments about Obama and Khalid Al-Mansour. Smith suggested the retraction "put the [Obama/Al-Mansour] story to rest for good."Wardally told Smith that the "information Mr. Percy Sutton imported [sic] on March 25 in a NY1 News interview regarding his connection to Barack Obama is inaccurate. As best as our family and the Chairman's closest friends can tell, Mr. Sutton, now 86 years of age, misspoke in describing certain details and events in that television interview."Asked which parts of Percy Sutton's statements were a "fabrication," LaBolt said "all of it. Al Mansour doesn't know Obama. And Sutton's spokesman retracted the story. The letter [to Harvard, which Percy Sutton says he wrote on behalf of Obama], the 'payments for loans' — all of it, not true," he added. Newsmax contacted the Sutton family and they categorically denied Wardally's claims to Smith and the Politico.com. So there was no retraction of Sutton's original interview, during which he revealed that Khalid Al-Mansour was "raising money" for Obama and had asked Sutton to write a letter of recommendation for Obama to help him get accepted at Harvard Law School. Sutton's personal assistant told Newsmax that neither Mr. Sutton or his family had ever heard of Kevin Wardally."Who is this person?" asked Sutton's assistant, Karen Malone. When told that he portrayed himself as a "spokesman" for the family, Malone told Newsmax, "Well, he's not."According to a 2006 New York magazine profile, Wardally is part of a "New New Guard" in Harlem politics that has been challenging the "lions" of the old guard, Charles Rangel and Percy Sutton. That makes him an unlikely candidate to speak on behalf of Sutton. Sutton maintains an office at the Manhattan headquarters of the firm he founded, Inner City Broadcasting Corporation. ICBC owns New York radio stations WBLS and WLIB. Sutton's son Pierre ("Pepe") runs ICBC along with his daughter, Keisha Sutton-James. Malone told Newsmax that she had consulted with Sutton's family members at the station and confirmed that no one knew Kevin Wardally or had authorized him to speak on behalf of the family. For someone claiming to be a "spokesman" for the Sutton family, who was authorized to call Percy Sutton a liar, Wardally even got Percy Sutton's age wrong. Sutton is not 86, as Wardally said, but close to 88. He was born on Nov. 24, 1920. Wardally responded to a several Newsmax phone messages and emails with a terse one-line comment, maintaining his statement that Percy Sutton "misspoke" in the television interview. "I believe the statement speaks for itself and the Sutton Family and I have nothing further to say on the topic," he wrote in an email. Asked to explain why it was that no one at Inner City Broadcasting Corp. knew of him or accepted him as a family spokesman. Wardally responded later that he had been retained by a nephew of the elder Sutton, who "is in our office almost every week." Wardally works for Bill Lynch Associations, a Harlem political consulting firm. The nephew, Chuck Sutton, no longer works with the elder Sutton at Inner City Broadcasting, but for a high-tech start-up called Synematics. "Percy Sutton doesn't go out idly on television saying things he doesn't mean," a well-connected black entrepreneur who knows Sutton told Newsmax. Ben LaBolt's claim that "Al Mansour doesn't know Obama" was contradicted by Al Mansour himself in an extended interview with Newsmax. Comparing the revelation of his ties to Obama to the controversy surrounding Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Al Mansour said that he was determined to keep a low profile to avoid embarrassing Obama. "In respect to Mr. Obama, I have told him, because so many people are running after him… I was determined that I was never going to be in that situation," he told Newsmax. Al Mansour said he was deliberately avoiding any contact with the candidate. "I'm not involved in any way in celebrity sweepstakes," he said. "I wish him well, anything I can do if he lets me know, I'll let him know what I think I can do or can't. But I don't collect autographs. I wish him the best, and hope he can win the election."He repeatedly declined to comment on the Percy Sutton allegations, either to confirm or to deny them. "Any statement that I make would only further the activity which is not in the interest of Barack, not in the interest of Percy, not in the interest of anyone," Al Mansour said. Sen. Obama has refused to instruct Harvard Law School to release any information about his time there as a student, or about his student loans. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Amos Date: 19 Oct 08 - 10:44 AM "Voters may differ in how they see Ayers, or how they see Obama's interactions with him. We're making no judgment calls on those matters. What we object to are the McCain-Palin campaign's attempts to sway voters – in ads and on the stump – with false and misleading statements about the relationship, which was never very close." Factcheck link from artbrooks upthrread. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 10:52 AM And yet, apparently someone (Percy Sutton), did make it up... 'Barack Obama's campaign is flatly denying a story told by former Manhattan Borough President Percy Sutton, who cast an ex-Black Panther turned Muslim businessman and lecturer as a key Obama mentor but whose story seems off in at least one key detail. Sutton's story, told in what NY1 said was a March 25 interview, has been lighting up the conservative blogs for the last week. Sutton, now in his late 80s and mostly off the public stage, told NY1's Dominic Carter that he was asked to write a letter of recommendation to Harvard Law School on Obama's behalf by a man named Khalid al-Mansour of Texas, "the principle adviser to one of the world's richest men" who was also "raising money for [Obama]." Obama spokesman Ben LaBolt told Politico that "Obama did not know and does not know Khalid al-Mansour." LaBolt said Obama doesn't have a relationship with Sutton and that "to our knowledge, no such letter was written." Obama was in Chicago, not New York, when he applied to Harvard. The person to whom Sutton was apparently referring, al-Mansour, is a former Black Panther and an adviser to Saudi royalty who has produced, as Amanda Carpenter noted, some YouTube clips that would light up cable television if he's actually been close to Obama. He's also been quoted backing the Palestinian side in the Middle East conflict, though he has not been quoted supporting violence there. NewsMax's Kenneth Timmerman reported yesterday that he spoke to al-Mansour, who wouldn't comment on Sutton's story. "Any statement that I made would only further this activity which is not in the interest of Barack," al-Mansour is quoted as saying. Sutton's story is particularly difficult to follow at one point: that al-Mansour was "raising money" for Obama. Obama attended Harvard with the help of student loans, as the Sun-Times' Lynn Sweet reported in detail at one point, writing that he had $42,753 in debt. I left messages for al-Mansour and for Sutton, but haven't heard back. Sutton, an eminence in Harlem politics, has not been well lately, people who know him said; I also left a message for his son. Sutton supported Hillary Clinton in the Democratic primary and was quoted saying of Obama at the time, "We don't know the other person in this election — we've never met him." UPDATE: I spoke to Mansour Thursday evening, who said he'd avoided directly contradicting the story out of respect for Sutton, "a dear friend, his health is not good." But pressed, he denied all the details of Sutton's story. "The scenario as it related to me did not happen," he said. "I'm sure he's written a letter [to someone else] and he got it confused somehow," he said of Sutton, adding that he'd never asked Sutton to write a letter to any university supporting anyone's admission. Mansour said he admires Obama, but first heard of him when a relative sent him a copy of Obama's 2004 convention speech. "I've never met him," he said.' http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/Obama_camp_denies_Sutton_story.html It's really not that hard to look this stuff up before making a fool out of oneself by posting garbage. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 11:00 AM More about Obama / Al Mansour: Newsmax contacted the Dean of Students, the Director of Student Financial Services, the Registrar, and the Bursar of Harvard Law School. None would provide any specific information on Barack Obama's time at Harvard, except for his dates of attendance (1988-1991) or his year of graduation, 1991. A spokesman for the law school, Michael Armini, said it was Harvard policy not to divulge information on alumni without their approval. "There are lots of reporters nosing around the library," he acknowledged. So far, none had turned up any new information.Law professors Lawrence Tribe and Charles Ogletree have both said publicly that they were "impressed" by Obama when he was a student.Sources close to the Sutton family told Newsmax that Percy Sutton wrote a letter of recommendation for Obama to Ogletree at Khalid Al-Mansour's request, but Ogletree declined to answer Newsmax questions about this. Harvard Law School spokesman Michael Armini said that Harvard was "very generous" with financial aid, but only on the basis on need. The Obama campaign told Newsmax that Obama self-financed his three years at Harvard Law School with loans, and did not receive any scholarship from Harvard Law School. LaBolt denied that Obama received any financial assistance from Harvard or from outside parties. "No - he paid his way through by taking out loans," he said in an email to Newsmax. At the time, Harvard cost around $25,000 a year, or $75,000 for the three years that Obama attended. And as president of the Harvard Law Review, he received no stipend from the school, Harvard spokesman Mike Armini said."That is considered a volunteer position," Armini said. "There is no salary or grant associated with it."So if the figures cited by the Obama campaign for the Senator's student loans are accurate, that means that Obama came up with more than $32,000 over three years from sources other than loans to pay for tuition, room and board. Where did he find the money? Did it come from friends of Khalid Al Mansour? And why would a radical Muslim activist with ties to the Saudi royal family be raising money for Barack Obama? That's the question the Obama campaign still won't answer. Michelle Obama speaking at a campaign event in Haverford, Pa, in April of this year, Michelle Obama claimed that her husband had "just paid off his loan debt" for his Harvard Law School education. In an appearance in Zanesville, Ohio, in February she bemoaned the fact that many American families were strapped with student loan payments for years after graduation."The only reason we're not in that position is that Barack wrote two best-selling books," she said. The first of those best-sellers netted the couple $1.2 million in royalties in 2005. In response to Newsmax questions about the Obama's college loans, a campaign spokesman cited a report in The Chicago Sun claiming that Obama borrowed $42,753 to pay for Harvard Law School, and "tens of thousands" more to pay for undergraduate studies at Columbia.The same report said that Michelle Obama borrowed $40,762 to pay for her years at Harvard Law School.But a Newsmax review of Senator Obama's financial disclosures found no trace of any outstanding college loans, going back to 2000.As a United States Senate candidate, Barack Obama was required to file a financial disclosure form in 2004 detailing his assets, income, consulting contracts, and liabilities. Obama listed "zero" under liabilities in 2004 and in all subsequent U.S. Senate financial disclosure forms.Under the Senate ethics rules, he is required to disclose any loan, including credit card debt, of $10,000 or more. The only exception to the reporting requirement is mortgage debt on a principal residence.The Senate reports also directly contradict Michelle Obama's claim that the couple had "only just" paid off their student loans after receiving book royalties paid out in 2005 and 2006 â€" well after her husband had been ensconced in the Senate.Apparently, Michelle Obama misspoke, according to the version provided by the Obama campaign. Campaign spokesman Ben LaBolt now tells Newsmax that the loans Sen. Obama took out to pay for Harvard Law School "were repaid in full while he was a candidate for the U.S. Senate [in 2004], and under the rules, the modest outstanding balance he repaid was not reportable as a liability on his personal financial disclosure reports."The Senator repaid the loans on "the expectation of a significant increase in family income" as a result of the paperback edition of his 1995 book, Dreams of My Father, LaBolt said.Obama acknowledges that sales of the hard cover edition of the book were "underwhelming." But in the spring of 2004,when Obama won the Democrat U.S. Senate primary in Illinois, Rachel Klayman, an editor at Crown Publishers in New York, read an article about Obama and became interested in his memoir, only to discover that Crown now owned the rights. She asked Obama to write a new forward, and Crown then decided to re-issue Dreams as a paperback in July 2004, just as Obama made his historic speech to the Democrat National Convention.The paperback eventually sold over one million copies, which under the standard industry royalty for trade paperbacks of 7.5%, earned him $1.2 million. However, Obama didn't report income from the book until 2005, so it's unclear how he was able to repay his student loans in 2004. Responding to attacks from the Hillary Clinton campaign during the primaries, Obama released seven years of tax returns on March 25 of this year. The returns, dating back to 2000, indicate that the couple paid no interest on their student loans. The interest from such loans would have been deductible on their joint income tax returns. For 2000 through 2004, taxpayers declared student loan interest as a deduction on line 24 of federal form 1040. After 2004, the deduction can be taken on Line 33.But the Obamas never declared a dime of interest in student loans on their return, most likely because they simply earned too much money to be able to take the deduction under the IRS rules. Obama spokesman Ben LaBolt had no answer as to why the Obamas' failed to declare the loans, stating the obvious that "because interest on the loans was not deducted, it would not appear on the Obamas' personal return." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 11:15 AM "And yet, apparently someone (Percy Sutton)[personal opinion], did make it up.." ApparentlyWardally is making things up. Newsmax contacted the Sutton family and they categorically denied Wardally's claims to Smith and the Politico.com. So there was no retraction of Sutton's original interview, during which he revealed that Khalid Al-Mansour was "raising money" for Obama and had asked Sutton to write a letter of recommendation for Obama to help him get accepted at Harvard Law School. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 11:21 AM UPDATE: I spoke to Mansour Thursday evening, who said he'd avoided directly contradicting the story out of respect for Sutton, "a dear friend, his health is not good." But pressed, he denied all the details of Sutton's story. "The scenario as it related to me did not happen," he said. "I'm sure he's written a letter [to someone else] and he got it confused somehow," he said of Sutton, adding that he'd never asked Sutton to write a letter to any university supporting anyone's admission. Mansour said he admires Obama, but first heard of him when a relative sent him a copy of Obama's 2004 convention speech. "I've never met him," he said.' |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 11:23 AM Canada Free Press: During the early years of radical left-wing community organizing efforts, William Ayers and his father Thomas came into cooperative contact with the Black Panther's and Black Panther behind the scenes mentor Donald Warden, known today as Dr. Khalid al-Mansour, the name he took when he adopted the radical Wahabbi Muslim faith through friends in the Saudi Royal family. In a March 2008 TV interview, former Malcom X lawyer and Harlem burough president Percy Sutton named Khalid al-Mansour as the manchurian puppetmaster behind Barack Hussein Obama. He told of how al-Mansour was raising money for the education of Barack Obama, and asked Sutton to write a letter of recommendation to Harvard University on Obama's behalf. Politico blogger and Obama supporter Ben Smith immediately sought, received and printed a " family retraction" of Sutton's TV statements on the Politico blog. Newspapers across the country ready to run with the story of a manchurian candidate groomed by Saudi Royal family deal maker al-Mansour stopped dead in their tracks, biting on the Sutton retraction effectively manufactured by Smith in a rush to defend his candidate, Barack Obama. However, the alleged Sutton retraction, issued by former Hillary Clinton Harlem campaign chief Kevin Wardally, turned out to be fake. When questioned about the retraction by Newsmax investigative journalist Ken Timmerman, official Sutton family representatives answered, "that neither Mr. Sutton or his family had ever heard of Kevin Wardally." "Who is this person?" asked Sutton's assistant, Karen Malone. When told that he portrayed himself as a "spokesman" for the family, Malone told Newsmax, "Well, he's not." Wardally refused to retract his false retraction, stating to Newsmax that, "he had been retained by a nephew of the elder Sutton, who is in our office almost every week." Timmerman reports, "Wardally works for Bill Lynch Associations, a Harlem political consulting firm. The nephew, Chuck Sutton, no longer works with the elder Sutton at Inner City Broadcasting, but for a high-tech start-up called Synematics." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 11:26 AM Sutton may not be retracting anything, but Khalid al-Mansour said it never happened. And he ought to know. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Bobert Date: 19 Oct 08 - 11:52 AM Not to rai8n on this very insignificant sidebar which really has nothing to do with the elction but did anyone hear McCain speaking in Virginia yesterday??? Seems that "class warfare" is the latest campaign centerpiece with Joe the NonPlumber and now McCain is saying that, as if it is evil, that Obama wants to "redistribute" income... Not so funny thing is that he is telling this to folks who who don't hear "We're going to ask the upper 5% to pay more" but the ***codified*** "We're going to take *your* money and give it to Welfare Cadillac women..." Oh, the ol' Dixiecrats would love this version of John McCain... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:10 PM I also find it highly amusing that people are trying to scare voters by creating a fiction of Obama being tight with the Saudis in light of the extremely close relationship that the Bush family has had with the Saudis for years... http://dohiyimir.typepad.com/bush-abdulah.jpg |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:12 PM What the class warfare people neglect to tell us, of course, is that they have been busy "redistributing" the wealth for years. Only they've been moving it from the bottom to the top instead of the other way around. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:14 PM "You can't make this stuff up" (From: Sawzaw - PM Date: 19 Oct 08 - 10:27 AM) Yes you certainly can. It's an example of a kind of Internet Folklore. Sort of quasi-political Urban Legends. And nothing to do with this thread. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:17 PM "Khalid al-Mansour said it never happened. And he ought to know." Black Panther mentors always know everything and tell the truth don't they? In the 1960s, when he founded the African American Association in the San Francisco Bay area, he was known as Donald Warden. According to the Social Activism Project at the University of California at Berkley, Warden, a.k.a. Khalid al-Mansour, was the mentor of Black Panther Party founder Huey Newton and his cohort, Bobby Seale. CC chooses to believe a radical and political fixit man over the family of Percy Sutton. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Sawzaw Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:20 PM Robin Hood Funds ACORN A major donor ACORN and its affiliates is the Robin Hood Foundation. The foundation has given ACORN $821,000 consisting of a $456,000 grant in 2003 and a $365,000 grant in 2004. The Soros Fund Charitable Foundation gave the Robin Hood Foundation a $9,859,453 community development grant in 2000. The Robin Hood board includes Tom Brokaw of NBC News, Marian Wright Edelman, Hollywood movie mogul Harvey Weinstein, and actress Gwyneth Paltrow. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Stringsinger Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:29 PM Democratic Socialism is practiced in Sweden, Germany, Denmark, Norway and Canada although Harper is trying to destroy that. It's the view of the Founding Fathers of the Constitution. It's why Lincoln went to war with the South to preserve the Government. Ronald Reagan was out to destroy the US Government by denigrating it and deregulating all of it's offices. Since then, the Deregulation has brought us to the brink of economic Depression No. 2. Scary Palin's attempt at jingoism and stirring up hatred has increased the need for Democratic Socialism in the US to protect the exploited working people and those making less than 250,000 grand a year. Joe the Plumber is a fraud perpetrated by the McCainiacs to dismember our democracy by favoring the rich in this country. He is not a plumber, he does not make over 250,000 grand a year and his name really isn't Joe. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Bobert Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:34 PM Hmmmmmmmm??? If ACORN is so evil then why has John McCain not only been supportive of it but spoken at at least one ACORN gathering??? Me thinks that some folks supposed facts just don't add up to much... But John McCain's relationship with ACORN has nothing to do with this thread so maybe those here who have so much interest in talking about anything but the subject would like to start their own thread??? (They won't do that, Bobert, because their only goal is be as distractive as they can so they won't have to talk about the subject...) Well, then maybe the moderators could just move their posts to a new thread which I'de be perfectly willing to start entitled "Thread Distractions"??? (Now there's an idea, Boberdz... It'd prolly hit a couple hundred in no time at all...) B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:44 PM That's pretty funny. Percy Sutton was involved during that time in the Black liberation movement as well. He was Malcolm X's attorney. If we're going to say that we can't trust someone like al-Mansour because of his association with the Black Panther movement, we can't really position Sutton as some kind of paragon of honesty. And al-Mansour said that he and Sutton are good friends. So that means that Sutton pals around with Black Panther mentors. So why should we believe him any more than we believe al-Mansour? I mean, shit. People are saying we can't trust Obama because he served on the board of a charity with Bill Ayers. Sutton was Malcolm X's attorney My own opinion is that neither of these men's past associations makes them any more or less trustworthy than the other. But I think al-Mansour is in a better position to remember what he did and didn't do than a very old man who is ill, and may not be remembering things very well. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: artbrooks Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:51 PM I'm with Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Alice Date: 19 Oct 08 - 12:56 PM All the organizations that collect voter registrations ARE REQUIRED to turn in every application, whether someone wrote Mickey Mouse on it or whether it is a serious and truthful application. Acorn separated the applications into the obviously not legitimate aps, the questionable aps, and the legitimate aps. They turned them in to election offices with those separations. That's normal procedure. This has become a big issue only because the Republicans have to distract voters from the real campaign issue of the economy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 01:14 PM Not only distract voters, but also prevent them from voting. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 19 Oct 08 - 02:02 PM I assume there must be some people who are actually called Mickey Mouse. How do they manage when they try to vote in the USA? Famous names do crop up in other places. I've known two Michael Jackson, both of them, as it happens, children's entertainers. Not a good name to have if you are a children's entertainer. Then there was a young English reporter in the Chicago streets outside the 1968 Democratic Convention ("the World is Watching"), who got grabbed up by a cop and asked for his name. He said "Winston Churchill" and was promptly done over, as a hippy-loving Limey. In fact it was his name and he was Churchill's grandson. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: CarolC Date: 19 Oct 08 - 02:09 PM I just now saw the post that complains about people taking this thread off track. I don't understand. This thread was started as a part of the smear campaign against Barack Obama by the same person who has taken the thread off track. Two questions - why would anyone want to keep it on the subject of the original smear (if the one making the smear has moved on to another smear), and why would anyone not want to address the newer smears that the thread originator is now tossing around in the thread? This makes no sense to me. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: Alice Date: 19 Oct 08 - 02:14 PM Some crazy parent out there has probably named their kid Donald Duck, too. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 08 - 07:30 PM Jeez!..From all the posts, it sounds like you can NOT distinguish between fact and fiction...typical for politicos! You're all driving each other crazy..well, not too far to drive,......just a short putt! But then some people are more interested in their opinions, or just mouthing off, rather than exchanging useful information...maybe even the truth. ....Shut up GfS!..We have absolutely NO USE for TRUTH!!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Obama is a socialist From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 19 Oct 08 - 07:37 PM But then some people are more interested in their opinions, or just mouthing off, rather than exchanging useful information Yes indeed. |
