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Collapse of the Folk Clubs
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 04 May 07 - 03:26 AM There goes that Villan again, making assumptions. He hasn't a clue who I am and what I do. How do you know he's not talking about somebody else entirely? Actually excerpts from my CV are scattered all over the place, quoted where relevant. Like working on the Folk Directory and visiting most venues in the land in one capacity or another. I simply tell it like it was/is having been there and done it. THEN some mouthy person with nothing better to do (named Guest 'wordy' or something of the sort) comes along shouting extracts from their limited experience as though that somehow contradicts and disproves what I have already said (like why the clubs collapsed). Who's attacking who and why ever are they bothering? PS Murdoch fired me, as did Greg Dyke and Robert Maxwell. That's probably divided my cred up or down among the lot of you. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Rasener Date: 04 May 07 - 02:55 AM Countess Richard is in actual fact extremely knowledgeable in English traditional music and its current endeavours, and a great supporter of youngsters entering the trad music scene. Unfortunately she can't stop herself attacking very nice mudcatters and making quite a few enemies as she goes along. There isn't any need for her attitude. Personally, I couldn't care less what each music venue does, that is their business, and if it attracts people who play and even more so younger people and a listening audience, then thats great. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST Date: 04 May 07 - 02:47 AM I often wonder why people resort to invective and name-calling when discussing a subject as pleasant and important as folk song - well no; I'm lying - I know why they do! It's so certain individuals can get around having to deal with problems more complicated than ordering a pint at the bar. Fundamental - (elemental, basic): - I suppose it is fairly fundamental to expect to find and evening of folk songs at a folk club - guilty to that one. Finger-in-ear - my favourite: The practice of cupping the hand over the ear in order to sing in tune is a world-wide one, centuries, probably millennia old. While I realise that the concept of singing in tune is pretty low down on the list of priorities at some clubs, I've always considered this one a compliment. All the others I've put down to lack of imagination, though it does occur to me that the real 'Folk Police' are the ones who say 'words mean what I want them to mean' (Orwell had that one pretty well covered in Nineteen-Eighty-Four). I was indexing tapes a few weeks ago, recordings made at some of the clubs I have been involved in. What struck me was the skill, energy and sheer enjoyment of some of the singers - the pleasure they appeared to take in singing well. These were not the payed guests, but the residents and the singers from the floor. I came to the conclusion that that is what has disappeared from most of the clubs I have visited over the last few years - the combination of skill, dedication and sheer pleasure of making a good song come alive. As for the material sung - if I had to choose between somebody singing a long unaccompanied ballad (no matter how many verses) competently, to one of the many onanists onanising their way through some self-penned, self-obsessed piece in a pseudo American accent - sorry, no contest. Sneering at unaccompanied singing only convinces me that the folk clubs have fallen into the hands of people who don't like folk song - that's what folk song is folks - take it or leave it. Difficult it may be sometimes (especially when the singer hasn't put in the work) - boring it ain't (when they have). Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,wordy Date: 03 May 07 - 09:45 PM My God, she's a journalist!! By her language it's gutter press. By her attitude it's Murdoch's. Is she The Sun's music assassin? When I think that this forum was once graced by the openhanded, unjudgemental and wonderful Rick Fielding it's so sad that the bitterness this woman spreads now permeates these postings. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Sandman Date: 03 May 07 - 06:30 PM 1960 Fees,well in 1976,Idid a gig for14 pounds,that is nowhere near my current fee,. your heart is in the right place but your over exaggeration destroys your argument,. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Sandman Date: 03 May 07 - 06:26 PM the world is not different now,thereis still a need for home grown music. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Sandman Date: 03 May 07 - 06:25 PM many people still enjoy folk clubs,proper folk clubs are part of a community,clubs like Swindon, Stockton,Nottingham Carrington,[Ican only talk from my own experience ]are part of the local community. Towersey village festival was [at the beginning],but most festivals are not now. Folkie is only embarrassing to you Countess.Iam proud to like folk music and have no problem with the name. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 03:40 PM Well there's the platitude of the week: the clubs that will die are the ones that won't change. The 'f*lk' club movement of the 1960s is well past its sell-by. Before that there were jazz and blues clubs in many of the same venues. They moved on and so has trad music, for reasons outlined in a number of posts above. At the risk of coining the cliché of the week, the world is different now. People have moved on to festivals, ceilidhs, sessions, singarounds and yes, the concert venue. The scene is vibrant but one thing that holds it back is the old-style f*lk club organiser who expects artists to turn up for 1960s fees. Haven't they looked at the price of fuel (and everything else)? These are the ones that need to get real pretty damn quick . . . or die. And for god's sake drop that outdated term 'f*lkie'. It's just so embarrassing. You mean a punter who listens to trad music? Say so. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Rasener Date: 03 May 07 - 03:13 PM Neither do I Dave, but I have been told categorically that all the so called folkies who play at my club are not folk. I get 40 to 60 people every other Friday and sometimes more. The club is healthy with a wide mixture of folk songs and new contemporary folk songs. Its all good stuff and just what the audience will listen to. Every time I ask people why they don't like folk clubs, is because their understanding is that its full of old men singing boring 30 verse unacompanied songs. I can't change that, but hopefully the people who come to my venue get to appreciate lots of divers songs, some that you think is folk and some that you don't think is folk. The clubs that will die are the ones that won't change, becuase the club will die as the members die. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Folkiedave Date: 03 May 07 - 03:01 PM Not at all Les, it may be that folk music via large numbers of clubs is dead - but there is loads of folk music around, of a much bigger and wider variety nowadays, much more than there ever was in the good old days of the "laissez-faire" days of folk clubs. I really don't see this doom and gloom at all, just because the "folk club" scene has shrunk. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 02:37 PM Eh? So I'm a fRoots forum member. You're not. And you still don't know me, although you did invite me once to drop into your venue if ever I was passing. So far, the train always has. And what a piece of flawed reasoning. Places called open mics/pay-to-play exist. What Dave said was that that may well be popular but they ain't f*lk. Indeed they are not. Trad music, however, is most certainly not dead, it never has been and never will be. It will survive a few teenagers singing their problematic dirges to each other, or whatever the next fad is. Some of them might even become interested in trad, others will not. No matter. It's not for everyone, but in my experience, young musicians develop a more lasting interest in stuff that's obscure and on which they need to work at. Not in the Smooth Ops coined 'accessible'. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Rasener Date: 03 May 07 - 02:14 PM >>It may be what people want, it may be popular, it may even be the future, but it ain't really folk music<< If that is the situation then folk is dead, becuase nobody will want to know in a few years time, if not already. Countess Richard has said "But you absolutely do not know me. " What a challenge - so here we go for starters Countess Richard AKA Diane Easby Cheers Les Worrall |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Folkiedave Date: 03 May 07 - 01:53 PM Never met her. No idea if she has ilk or not. I know she talks sense and with a sense of history. So laissez-faire music venues = 60's folk clubs? I can only assume the folk clubs you went to were very different to the dozens (yes dozens) I went to in the 60's. Read my thread about the two in Hull I wrote about. As it happens I went to both, but I was unusual. And I had a clear preference of the two. Open mike = folk clubs? I went to one, once. It was full of all the people who had succeeded in closing folk clubs by singing songs about their teenage diaries (as I characterise it), people love it - it gives them chance to sing in front of their mates. But someone with a guitar singing self-penned songs does not = folk music. There were that many people in the audience who wanted to perform that they got two songs each. Virtually everyone in the audience sang their own songs to all the other people in the audience. There were forty people in the audience and (I counted) 29 guitars. It may be what people want, it may be popular, it may even be the future, but it ain't really folk music. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 01:45 PM In common with this wordy person, no you don't. I've never met you. You apparently know one or two people who have met me in passing. Like Breezy and George the Greek. But you absolutely do not know me. So stop telling porkies. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Rasener Date: 03 May 07 - 01:33 PM >>that you know me<< I certainly do Countess Richard |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 01:27 PM Why are you suffering under this delusion that you know me, or that you might have met anyone who does? I don't consider myself a part of this nebulous f*lk world you're going on about, nor do I frequent open mic/acoustic café/pay-to-play type venues, as I am assuming you do. And I don't recognise this "laisez fair" (sic) - you possibly mean laissez-faire? - world of the 60s clubs because it never existed. Far more so than nowadays, the 'traditional' and 'contemporary' venues bristled at each other like Lutheran and Catholic churches from different sides of town. Not many punters attended both and when they did they kept quiet about it. Unusually, I did. I played in a band in one sort and sang in the other. True, there were those who 'disapproved' but, needless to say, I took no notice. So how exactly I prove that those you call 'fundamentalists' exist when I don't actually recognise them is a more than a bit of a loony notion. Though I am inclined to believe you when you state that you have become one. A nutter, that is. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Mikefule Date: 03 May 07 - 01:17 PM In an effort impress a few friends with how open and friendly the folk world is, I invited them to read this thread. Thankfully, that is not true. What is this about having apparently bitter personal arguments in a forum that is open to the entire world? |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,wordy Date: 03 May 07 - 12:34 PM Dave, fundamntalists are those people who eventually bring pain and misery to others by imposing their twisted will. ie certain religious leaders in the world, dictators, etc. The folk world has its share of these as the countess richly proves.Not to be confused with enthusiasts, who add to human happiness. Humanity would be better without fundies. But unfortunately, to beat them you have to become one of them and use their methodology and thinking. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,wordy Date: 03 May 07 - 12:30 PM Actually countess, you do have ilk. I meet them rarely, but unfortunately you're not as alone as you should be. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,wordy Date: 03 May 07 - 12:29 PM David! There is a rising number of music venues that wouldn't been seen dead calling themselves folk clubs but which carry on in many ways the laisez fair world of the 60's folk clubs. Young people are doing it for themselves! |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST Date: 03 May 07 - 12:03 PM Eeee..........she's a charmer. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Folkiedave Date: 03 May 07 - 11:51 AM Don't worry Davie, history repeats. The young performers now will see the rise of the fundamentalists again. And the evidence for this is......? If history repeated itself then there would be a rise in the number of folk clubs commensurate with the rise in the interest in folk music. I don't see it. Incidentally define fundamentalist. I'd love to know if I fit the definition. And don't call me Davie. Dave or David is fine. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 11:32 AM Countesses and her ilk Not only is this orthographically nonsensical, I have no ilk. Anyone who knows me is well aware of that. Sod off into the windmills of your mind, you wordy bastard. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,wordy Date: 03 May 07 - 11:10 AM Don't worry Davie, history repeats. The young performers now will see the rise of the fundamentalists again. Round, like a circle in a spiral..etc. By the way, the periods where anything goes in any art form are the times when the great new talents emerge. Luckily I lived in such a time in the music world and have worked in it with immense pleasure and fiscal reward until this day. However, the Countesses and her ilk just depress me with their joyless,judgemental, holier than thou,"NO" shouting, profane idiocy. Profanity is always the last resort of the inarticulate and language challenged. Her posts are no different in tone to those you can find on any football website. Sad. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 10:54 AM Good grief Dave, thanks but it wasn't ALL my doing (hehehe). |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Folkiedave Date: 03 May 07 - 10:41 AM I think the Countess is the reason for the decline in folk clubs. When I started going in the 60's there were none of her type about. First of all there were plenty of people about then who were prepared to define what folk clubs were about and what was and was not allowed. It was why Hull had two folk clubs, one was "traditional", the other did "folk and blues". Since the Countess and those like her are responsible for the decline and folk clubs, are they also responsible for the rise in folk festivals, ceilidh dancing, the dozens of sessions that now exist and all those fine young musicians I see at festivals? I think she should be congratulated for the consistent rise in standards of folk music that has happened. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 10:33 AM Good grief, how wrong can you get? I've never run a venue in this country in my life although I did in Germany in the 1980s. Chucked it in cos all they wanted was singalong MOR Celtic. All through the 60s I visited just about every venue there was, sometimes performing and sometimes just driving others around. In 1969 and 1970 I was involved in producing the EFDSS Folk Directory. So I knew where they all were and exactly what they were like in the 1970s when I was a music journalist and observed in despair when towards the end of the decade they were invaded by the comics and snigger-snoggers. Anything goes? Pah! What a load of dumbed down crap. I 'emerged' from nowhere. I'd always been there. Since I was about six, actually, clogdancing and learning the violin at school and tunes from my grandfather. My 'type' (as if you had any idea who or what that comprises) turned to English dance music, collecting from real live trad musicians or (as in my case) eventually getting the hell out of the country to escape the twin horrors of musical dross and Thatcherism for part of the next decade. You have clearly not the faintest idea who I am and how I have nothing to do with the cliquey 'f*lk' club scene where they may well argue over trivialities, for all I know. I try my best to disregard their existence, apart from perhaps half a dozen scattered throughout the country that fit roughly into the old-style 'club' format but have participative resident bands and are usually linked to eceilidh or tune session organisers. I'd endorse only the latter half of your final sentence: DON'T tell me where any of these 'fakesong', dross-peddling, good-enough-for-f*lk venues are. I absolutely don't want to know. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Dave the Gnome Date: 03 May 07 - 10:10 AM I think I must be one of the lucky ones! The two folk clubs I am now involved in - White Lion, Swinton, Manchester and The Bridge, Newcastle have nearly 80 years running between them! I find myself, unusualy, agreeing with the countess. There is an awful lot of dross in some (or should that be a lot of awful dross?). I don't think that can be blamed for the demise of so many clubs though. Both the Lion and the Bridge have their share of poor performers (Me for instance!) but they are in the minority. On a singers night, in either club. for every bad performance there are five good ones. On non-singers nights they both have top-line local artists. On odd nights the Bridge has the Folk degree stuents performing. On odd nights at Swinton we make sure we book nationaly (and internationaly) known stars. Everyone going to either club seem to know that bit of rough can be ignored for the sake of the abundance of smooth:-) I think the main difference between the sucessful clubs and those that fold is the attitude of EVERYONE involved, from organiser to artist to audience. If it is inclusive and everyone feels involved we are all quite happy to give a bit of leeway. As soon as anyone starts to say "This is MY club" or "MY night" to the exclusion of others they start on the top of the slippery slope. It is dificult sometimes when you know that an act really is bad enough to put people off but with a bit of good planning they can do one song - early on - when only the organisers and the landlords cat are in. The added advantage is that when people start to arrive they can see something is already going on. Cheers Dave |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,wordy Date: 03 May 07 - 09:45 AM I think the Countess is the reason for the decline in folk clubs. When I started going in the 60's there were none of her type about. It was a happy, anything goes, join in, write it, listen, play, have a pint, find a partner, laugh, cry, sort of scene. Then, over the years, people got older and the Countess and her ilk emerged. Critical, puritanical, dictatorial etc, and they began to take over clubs. As most of us on here would not contemplate spending an evening with the foul mouthed woman she is, so people didn't want to spend time in venues where her type were exercising their power. She's not the only one, but the "NO" sayers have driven many of the "YES" sayers away. They deserve each other in their in-growing groups where they squabble over trivialities. Thankfully, there are still one or two places where happy, anything goes, join in, write it, listen, play, have a pint, find a partner, laugh, cry, people go for a night out, but they are few. Worth finding though, and please, don't tell Countess where they are!! |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 08:29 AM I dislike ALL dross. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Rasener Date: 03 May 07 - 08:20 AM You dislike most things CR |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 08:14 AM (1) Two other posters before me made the observation before I repeated it. And they're right. Dross is rather too ubiquitous on the 'good enough for f*lk' club circuit. (2) No, I haven't. And I don't really want a review copy either. I dislike compilations. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Rasener Date: 03 May 07 - 08:03 AM >>Most everywhere else is drowning in dross<< I thought that was you Countess Richard (Diane E****), judging by all of your nasty comments. You still haven't offered to buy a yellowbellies 2 Cd to help young children who suffer from cancer. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 07:22 AM But you have to draw the line some way before the bleedin' Corrs. And well before the likes of Led Zep who used trad to rip off tunes for free. And mandolins? Yeah, yeah, Rod the Mod tried to rip off the McPeakes didn't he, but didn't get away with it. And Watersons & Carthys don't DO 'Celtic', oh no, so what sort of a circular non-argument is that supposed to be? And there's a world of difference between routes into trad and being a tourist. The Magpie's Nest is one of the very few venues (that and the now threatened with closure Spitz) that is breaking conventions while respecting the tradition and making a success of it. Re-read Jim Carroll's post above. And Dave Eyre's for that matter. Most everywhere else is drowning in dross. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,Nicholas Waller Date: 03 May 07 - 06:57 AM Norma Waterson and Eliza Carthy on the radio the other day (Woman's Hour) talked about traditional music being affected/enriched/informed by other stuff going on at the same time, so Norma in the 60s couldn't help but be influenced and affected in some way by The Beatles and Eliza's generation by Prince and/or the Arctic Monkeys. (And indeed vice versa, with the likes of Led Zeppelin and who knows who else being influenced by folk). |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,Helen Date: 03 May 07 - 06:42 AM To Countess Richard - no need to be offensive. I wasn't trying to imply that the Corrs sing folk music, only that you can detect the 'Celtic' influence in their music. Sometimes if you try to explain Folk to people who aren't used to music it's useful to be able to refer to something that is widely known. When I'm talking to people at work or socially, especially teens/twenties, then they know who The Corrs (or several other Irish groups)are through their chart presence and although we may think it's all 'pop', todays youngsters know that a mandolin or whatever in the line up is different. Believe it or not I have on several occasions had people want to know more about 'Celtic' music as a result, and perhaps borrow a CD or two. And the occasional one from there 'gets the bug' and explores deeper into the wonderful body of traditional music from which so much, even 'The Corrs', has come. It doesn't pay to be too snobbish about what constitutes music of traditional influence, or to be too dismissive of the routes available to people on their way to being folk afficionados. I find a bit of enthusiasm and encouragement works a lot better than disdain or criticism when you're looking for new recruits. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Hawker Date: 03 May 07 - 05:22 AM Well! Folk clubs demise eh? The Bude Folk Club re-opened its doors on Sunday 22nd April 2007, and has moved from The Globe To The Falcon in Bude. There has been a need for a club ever since the last club died, but the porblem was getting someone to run it and getting a venue. The Carriage room at The Falcon is ideal and has great acoustics. Our first gathering had people from 11 to 78, all joining in. Some sang, some played and some just listened. Once again in this thread, I see the discussion about whether it is right or wrong to sing with the words in front of you. I have been to many performances by prfessional musicians and singers, singing non-folk. They always have their music and their words in front of them and nobody condemns them for doing so, why do the folkies seem to think its so wrong?. For me, it matters not if they have their words/music in front of them,, what maters more is that its not the first time they have sung it, and that they are familiar with the words, flow and feel of the song and the tune. There is nothing worse than someone squinting and mis-reading words that dont scan in performance, as they have not practised or prepared beforehand. As an aide memoir I'd rather see words in front of them than see someone spend 10 minutes dying in front of an audience as they try desperately to remember the missing verse! Perhaps I am just more forgiving than the average folkie! Bude Folk Club next meets 13th May and you can bring your words if you like! Cheers, Lucy |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Folkiedave Date: 03 May 07 - 04:55 AM I used to go to folk clubs that I expected would be not all that good, because I hoped I would hear someone who would be uplifting, a young performer learning his/her trade etc. The odd good singer, musician. I gave up going on such a frequent basis because I heard so much dross. Others maybe able to listen to a night of people singing their teenage diaries, I confess I can't. At least one folk club do attracts a young audience I am told, - anyone here been to the Magpie's Nest? http://www.themagpiesnest.co.uk/ |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,Mad Jock Date: 03 May 07 - 04:36 AM And some still do!. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,MAD JOCK Date: 03 May 07 - 04:35 AM To many people though they were just full of a bunch of jumpers with their fingers in their ears singing inane lyrics ...fall de di rol da da rol da. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: The Borchester Echo Date: 03 May 07 - 03:39 AM Jim Carroll is, of course, utterly and completely right but he has the good luck of being able to escape far away from the indignant wrath likely to erupt from the 'good enough for f*lk' brigade. Chaps, you'll just have to scream at me instead. I won't be listening. I just noticed this quote above: Groups like the Corrs nowadays are doing the same job of capturing the imagination in todays teens/twenties The fucking CORRS? Even THEY say they don't do f*lk music. Presumably to try and stay clear of people who don't like or understand it. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST Date: 03 May 07 - 03:26 AM I'm not going to be able to finish this argument - holiday. Of course folk clubs declined - count them. Listen to the dross performed in them, listen to the poor performances, the idiots popping their cheeks "then out of his knapsack....", hear the bad manners of people joining in when they have not been asked to, visit the folk clubs where you will never hear a folk song all night. Some time along the line the clubs became refuges for lazy, untalented and indifferent performers who simply don't feel it necessary to work at what they are doing - I've even hear it argued (not so long ago on this forum) that good performances are detrimental because they put off the mediocre. In many cases the clubs became refuges for those who failed to make it on the pop scene. Why did they decline? A whole raft of reasons; the main reason being that they fell into the hands of people who don't like or understand folk music (recent thread - folk clubs that only do folk songs are boring). Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: stallion Date: 02 May 07 - 06:56 PM The first time we recorded was the first time we realised that we were not all singing the same words, now we take the words with us to record and take a bit more care learning them! |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,Terry McDonald Date: 02 May 07 - 02:56 PM I've always wondered why the Coppers sing from the words - after 200 years you think they'd have learned the songs by now. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: greg stephens Date: 02 May 07 - 02:51 PM They've always used the book, so it's traditional! |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,Warwick Slade Date: 02 May 07 - 02:49 PM Why with the exception of the the Copper family? Is it because they are old? Well so am I! |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: greg stephens Date: 02 May 07 - 02:41 PM Singers with the words in front of them I do find a bit off...with the exception of the Copper family of course. But the worse thing I have experienced(well one of) was singing a song and having certain members of the audience loudly joining in with a different version of the same song which they were reading out of a book. |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: GUEST,Warwick Slade Date: 02 May 07 - 02:03 PM Singers with the words in front of them??? Alright, I confess, but I also often find myself upstairs with no idea why I am there! Anyway I went to see the Glasgow Orpheus Choir and they all had the words so if it is good enough for them...................... |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Dick The Box Date: 02 May 07 - 05:34 AM I agree that there are a lot fewer clubs than there used to be, especially once you move out of urban areas. There are less clubs and they are more spread out i.e. fewer venues and more travelling for the professional musician. This means that it is harder to earn a decent living which means that they have to charge more. This leads to higher door prices and fewer guest nights. This leads to smaller audiences which leads to clubs closing which leads to...... A bit of a vicious circle here? |
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Subject: RE: Collapse of the Folk Clubs From: Les in Chorlton Date: 02 May 07 - 03:53 AM Seems the thoughtful flexible approach works? And then their is the snug? Cheers Les |
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