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Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy

DigiTrad:
AROUND ME BRAVE BOYS
BRISK YOUNG WIDOW
NOSTRADAMUS
OAK, ASH, AND THORN
On Board a 98
THE BARLEY AND THE RYE
THE GOOD LUCK SHIP
THE OLD SONGS
WE HAVE FED OUR SEA FOR A THOUSAND YEARS


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Spleen Cringe 25 Nov 11 - 07:31 AM
theleveller 25 Nov 11 - 08:07 AM
Elmore 25 Nov 11 - 08:45 AM
GUEST,matt milton 25 Nov 11 - 08:51 AM
The Sandman 25 Nov 11 - 09:49 AM
GUEST 25 Nov 11 - 10:03 AM
The Sandman 25 Nov 11 - 02:48 PM
Rain Dog 25 Nov 11 - 04:31 PM
Howard Jones 26 Nov 11 - 06:19 AM
GUEST,Folknacious 26 Nov 11 - 09:28 AM
GUEST,Black Jake Ex of Norwich 06 May 12 - 06:49 AM
Leadfingers 06 May 12 - 07:20 AM
The Sandman 06 May 12 - 11:26 AM
GUEST 06 May 12 - 11:40 AM
Continuity Jones 06 May 12 - 12:32 PM
Dave Hanson 06 May 12 - 01:20 PM
MGM·Lion 06 May 12 - 01:31 PM
GUEST,Brian Peters 06 May 12 - 01:45 PM
Big Al Whittle 06 May 12 - 02:05 PM
MGM·Lion 06 May 12 - 02:12 PM
GUEST,Brian Peters 06 May 12 - 02:23 PM
MGM·Lion 06 May 12 - 02:36 PM
GUEST,Brian Peters 06 May 12 - 02:54 PM
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Subject: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 07:31 AM

There's a lovely article about Peter Bellamy ove on the Proper Blog as part of their 'In Depth' series. You can read it here.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: theleveller
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 08:07 AM

Good article, Spleen - Colin Irwin is an excellent writer. It gave me goosebumps to realise that as I read it I'm gazing out over the Leeds/Liverpool canal by the side of which Bellamy took his life. He had all the traits of an Outsider, as defined by Colin Wilson, and, as such, there's a dreadful sense of inevitability running through his life.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Elmore
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 08:45 AM

Thank you Spleen. The article seemed depressingly accurate and insightful.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST,matt milton
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 08:51 AM

"[Bellamy held] a steadfastly apolitical stance (his widow Jenny says that during her time with him he voted for the Green Party)"

I'm probably not the only person to smile at that one!

The Green Party has certainly always been political - in the sense of having agendas way beyond green issues - and its politics has always been on the left. I don't know if that was as true 20 years ago as it is today, but today it's a lot further to the left than Labour is.

If he was "steadfastly apolitical" then he wouldn't have voted at all!


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 09:49 AM

an interesting article.Idisagree with this statement
"His most prominent disciples include Damien Barber and Jon Boden, who have both not only drawn on his material, but taken substantial influence and inspiration from his eccentric vocal mannerisms. Barber, a fellow Norfolk lad exiled to Yorkshire, was even mentored to some degree by him and it was Bellamy who christened him The Demon Barber, a name he has subsequently used with great success for the band he now fronts.
Damien in my opinion bears no resemblance STYLE WISE TO Peter Bellamy,I hear more the influence of Dave Burland, the singer that reminds me most of Peter Bellamy is the Teesside singer Paul Dalton.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 10:03 AM

Damien in my opinion bears no resemblance STYLE WISE TO Peter Bellamy,I hear more the influence of Dave Burland

I hear more the influence of his father, Mike Barber.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 02:48 PM

i havent heard his father much, anyway he doesnt sound like Peter


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Rain Dog
Date: 25 Nov 11 - 04:31 PM

Colin Wilson? Never expected to see his name mentioned here.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Howard Jones
Date: 26 Nov 11 - 06:19 AM

Bearing in mind the furore on a couple of other threads, it occurs to me that the BBC could do worse than make a posthumous Lifetime Achievement Award to PB. His achievements during his life were astounding, and with hindsight not only now appear even more astonishing but also are perhaps better appreciated. 20 years after his death his influence on a new generation is huge. You couldn't say that about many - not even, dare I say, Ewan McColl or Bert Lloyd.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST,Folknacious
Date: 26 Nov 11 - 09:28 AM

Maybe it's time, Howard, for there to be a respectable/ respected organisation set up some sort of folk "Hall Of Fame" with an annual induction of people dead and alive who deserve that accolade and recognition. Not just musicians either.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST,Black Jake Ex of Norwich
Date: 06 May 12 - 06:49 AM

I knew Pete Bellamy at Norwich Art School when he was about 18 and we were close friends, sharing a common interest in all kinds of folk-music and blues. We remained friends all his life, even though we were rarely in contact. He was even kind enough to sing at my wedding, stunning the guests with his songs (as well as his charm and his unconventional appearance!)

I thought Colin Irwin's article was really beautiful. It was touching, informative and a fitting tribute.

Bellamy was, I think, probably the most brilliant and innovative artist on the British folk-scene, and pitifully underrated. How the BBC (supposed guardian of culture) could have failed to put on 'The Transports' for the Australian Bi-Centenary, I shall never know. There should be some kind of massive award, statue or something, to mark the memory of this remarkable purveyor of (mostly) English folk-song, and Irwin's article is certainly a step in the right direction. Why can't BBC4 do something now?!

Bellamy put songs together with such consummate skill, the like of which I've never seen. Some of his own compositions were so good, with such a feeling for the genre, that they appear absolutely authentic. (The only give-away is the is the poetic skill with which they have been crafted -a level of perfection which few, if any, composers in the past could have matched.)

I shall miss Peter Bellamy for ever, as must anyone with an appreciation for the very best in English folk-song. Colin Irwin, who can write infinitely better than I can, has provided a memorial in words for which we should all be grateful.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Leadfingers
Date: 06 May 12 - 07:20 AM

Peter COULD be somewhat caustic if anyone upset him - I recall him starting his second half set at The Folk Chmber in H W with a ten minute Treatise on the origins of Cowboy Hollers , WITH Vocal illustrations (Informative , but NOT good entertainment ) because someone made an adverse comment to him during the interval .
And I agree that he IS deserving of all the awards that could be made - His input to the British Folk scene is incalculable


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 May 12 - 11:26 AM

colin wilson, is he one of the wilson family, that was born the wrong side of the blanket?


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST
Date: 06 May 12 - 11:40 AM

Colin Irwin is a good writer BUT I have found myself to dissagree with many of his ideas and views.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Continuity Jones
Date: 06 May 12 - 12:32 PM

I think he's a terrible writer, full of mistakes, innacurcies bad spelling awful grandma, hysterical errors, but I agree with every last semi colon and doting semi quaker.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 06 May 12 - 01:20 PM

Colin Irwin is not much of a writer, he is one of the people that perpetuated the myth that Ewan MacColl was born in Aucheterader, when the rest of the world knew he was born in Salford.

Dave H


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 06 May 12 - 01:31 PM

I have never that greatly rated Colin as a writer, tho he has struck me on the few occasion we have met [all many years ago now] as a nice enough guy; and he did always have this tendency to rush into print without checking his facts {Auchterarder!...}.

I have a sneaking regard for him, however, for all those times way-way-back-when, in the 70s-80s, that he would devote a whole MM column to denouncing little-me for something I had recently written about the traditional/contemp divide in Folk Review or The Guardian ~~ the sort of publicity you just couldn't get by paying for it...

Retrospective thanks again then, mate ~~ from a voice from the far-off past!

Best

~Michael~


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST,Brian Peters
Date: 06 May 12 - 01:45 PM

Regarding the 'critical piece' that Karl Dallas later regretted (it appeared in the then Folk Roots' March 1991 issue), Peter's problem with it was not that it was damning of his music (which it wasn't; Dallas was an admirer), but that it dwelt on his politics in a way that Peter believed would be detrimental to his career, by suggesting that his music had a right-wing agenda. Peter wasn't blameless in creating that impression, however, since he was quoted in the article as railing aginst the lefty tendencies of the folk scene in general, and offering up waspish pen-pictures of certain prominent performers who'd displeased him by abandonning traditional songs for political ones.

Whether or not he was quoted correctly (and I suspect he was, having heard the same kind of thing from him in person several times), he certainly regarded the article as a shot in the foot and a missed opportunity, not least because a glowing live review had appeared in the previous issue - written by me, as it happens - and he had reason to believe that fashion might just be swinging his way again. I remember wondering, as I wrote that review, how come the towering performer I'd just seen had been reduced to selling bootleg cassettes at his own gigs, instead of being the toast of the folk world. A great pity that the feature article didn't relaunch his career in the way it might have done, but instead caused ill feeling all round.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 06 May 12 - 02:05 PM

fascinating stuff brian! In fact an interesting thread. thanks everybody.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 06 May 12 - 02:12 PM

Brian ~~ In what way 'bootleg'? They were his own cassettes to sell, not illegally smuggled by devious underground means. I agree with you that the necessity for such a recourse was a pity, as he couldn't find a proper label to issue proper recordings commercially. But I still don't quite get the force of 'bootleg'.

~M~


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST,Brian Peters
Date: 06 May 12 - 02:23 PM

Michael - they were his own home-made recordings of his deleted LPs. Didn't mean to suggest desperate illegality.


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 06 May 12 - 02:36 PM

Ah, thanks, Brian. See now. Thought you meant those late cassettes which he hired studios to self-produce & self-record, like Fair Annie, & Mr Kipling Made Exceedingly Good Songs.

~M~


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Subject: RE: Colin Irwin on Peter Bellamy
From: GUEST,Brian Peters
Date: 06 May 12 - 02:54 PM

I think the LPs he'd copied were from labels that had gone bust. I seem to remember a self-deprecating remark at that gig, along the lines that record companies that had made the commercial blunder of releasing Peter Bellamy albums were doomed to bankruptcy.


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