Thank God for Joan Baez!

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: rock chick
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 10:36 AM

I have been really influenced by Joan Baez, has anyone got the chords/lyrics to the following songs: Love song to a stranger and Prison Trilogy (Billy Rose) I have tried everywhere but without succes. I'll keep my fingers crossed!

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Tiger
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 10:57 AM

Lyrics (but not chords) can be found at:

http://baez.woz.org/

These are only the one's that Joan has written, but you're in luck.

Hopefully, someone will add the chords.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,guinnesschik
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 12:55 PM

I started listening to "folk" music when I was a teenager, long years after the original folk movement. Billy Bragg inspired me to look backward for material.

I loved almost everything I could find and consume with avid ears, but couldn't tolerate Joan's quavery, bloodless voice. Last week, I checked out a CD from the library to see if I had listened with immaturity, or if my dislike had a foundation. I couldn't get through the CD.

Ironically, I love the material. "Diamonds And Rust" is one of my all time favorite songs, as is "Jesse" and the "Prison Trilogy." I just can't get past her voice.

However, "Vive la Joan!" She paved the way.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: WyoWoman
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 01:03 PM

Well, ya know, we're sort of given a certain vocal mechanism with the rest of the package when we get dropped into this world. What we MAKE of it, now, that's something else. Lots of people have better natural voices -- and I personally prefer a voice with more timbre to it -- but what Joan Baez made with what she had (and still has) is pretty impressive.

ww

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 01:47 PM

You could say the same thing about Bob Dylan, ww, and a lot of people hate his voice too. He has, though, sung in several different voices at different times in his life, so he seems to be more versatile that way than most. I can understand exactly why some people don't like Joan's voice, but I like it fine...a matter of taste, that's all.

- LH

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: kendall
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 02:36 PM

I fell in love with Joan 40 years ago. Her voice can be a bit intense, but, well, when you love someone, you dont see all the warts. Never could stand Frank Sinatra, Bob Dylan sounds like he swallowed sandpaper. He has written some good stuff, although not all of it is original.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 02:38 PM

Well, at least he doesn't sound like Rod Stewart!

- LH

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Mark Clark
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 03:27 PM

Never heard Joan's voice panned before. I always loved it myself. I also loved Frank's and Tony's and Mel and Nat and Nina and Billie and Dinah and Ella and ... Also loved Bill's and Carter's and Mac's...

Quick, someone stop me!

      - Mark

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Big Tim
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 04:41 PM

The first 5 albums were good (though why did they change the cover for the 5th? - this from memory) after that it was mostly downhill.

Good singer, right time, bad songwriter.

Thank somebody for BD!

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Jun 01 - 05:03 PM

Oh, we do, Tim, we do.

I think some of Joan's later songwriting is quite good. "Diamonds & Rust" is a great song, for example. "Gulf Winds" likewise. "Time Rag" is excellent. And so on...

- LH

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: BobP
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 02:18 PM

Few thoughts 'bout Joan & dylanstuff.

Very young, 'bout 15, hung out in a record shop after school, couldn't afford her album, but loved the one with The Moonshine Song (my granddaddy made whiskey).

In those days they'd let you take the lp into a listening room.

Had the album later, wore out the grooves.

I collect old vinyl, but haven't found a replacement yet.

Contrary to one comment I think she sang from had the broadest song bag of any folkie, ever. From Wildwood Flower to most of Ochs (only really good voice to cover him thorougly, although Kim and Reggie do pretty well now).

She has several voices, like Bob, and uses different levels of "shrill" but seems able to reach down and turn it off when she wants, not unlike Garfunkel.

Best song is "All In Green Went My Love Riding", but her version of "Love Is a Four Letter Word", would be the best, except the recording is over-produced, says me.

A while back I was talking with friends about
"DYLAN, THE MOVIE" and we were kicking around who should produce, who should play Bob, and the biggest discussion was about who would play Joan?

Would Love to get catters going on this (probably done in some thread I missed).

Now that the boy, is sixty, the notion of doing that, with his approval, would seem appropriate.

I mean, can you imagine Bob and Joan at, say 70, walking out of the premiere or at the oscar show?

I say it should be done while those two are young enough to get a kick out of it. Seriously, someone should contact Speilberg, or such, and let them know that this should be done and soon.

If done right, and told the story of Washington Park, thru the early 60s', just how big would a flicl would that be?

Year's #1 and well past Titanic, says me.

Maybe mudcat could get something for the suggestion!

Y'never know; sure beats a pledge drive.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 02:25 PM

It would be very, very difficult to do such a film and do justice to the subject matter. Maybe not impossible, though. I wonder....

- LH

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: BobP
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 02:57 PM

Incidentlaly,

My choice for Joan would be Suzy Roche(from the Roches) who had a small role, in "Crossing Delancey".

She has the stage, drama and voice training to do Joan's classical gone pop style without voiceover.

I a movie like this, the story and dialogue should carry the project beyond the need for mimicry.

Just a thought; before it gets "cast" in concrete.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: chip a
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 04:12 PM

I loved her 40 yrs ago and still do. Volume two is wonderful. I still have the scratched remainders of her records and still play them. Anyone else got "Folk Singers 'Round Harvard Square" with Joan, Bill Wood & others? I used to lay on the floor with a speaker at each ear and just float away on that voice! Went straight from Chuck Berry & Little Richard to folk 'cause of her. Thanks Joan.

Chip A.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,jaze
Date: 04 Jun 01 - 06:07 PM

Speaking of Bob and Joan in the 60's, I just finished reading "Positively 4th Street" by David Hadju (just published). This tells the story of Bob and Joan and Richard and Mimi Farina during the early 60's Greenwich Village days. Very interesting reading and gives a little different perspective on them from what has been written before. A lot about Mimi, who seems to have sadly been born into Joan's shadow. I agree, their story would make a great movie and should be told. Like 'em or not, they both had a profound effect on American music.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Big Tim
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 05:01 AM

I got my first Baez album in '62 but only saw her live for the first time about 18 months ago here in Glasgow, Scotland. The voice has naturally deteriorated with time but she was still pretty good. A member of the audience requested the "Four Mary's" (because of the line "as I rode into Glasgow town") and although she hadn't planned to do it she sang that long, intricate ballad word perfect. I was impressed by that. He mother (whom I believe is originally from Edinburgh) was in the audience and must have been very proud of her "lassie". I have many happy memories of Joan's SINGING !

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: kendall
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 06:01 AM

I have one of her early albums, titled Joan Biaz. It has Silver Dagger, John Riley, Mary Hamilton etc. To get it, you would have to pry it from my cold dead fingers!

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 08:02 AM

Brad Pitt would be a good early Dylan, or perhaps Val Kilmer, as he's had experience already playing 60's icon Jim Morrison. Older Dylan: Dustin Hoffman.

As for Joan Baez...perhaps Courtney Love.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Maryrrf
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:12 AM

I had the album Kendall mentioned on cassette but it got ruined. No matter, I know most of the songs by heart anyway. That truly was a beautiful album and I think it was her best. Joan Baez also was the reason I became a "Folkie" - I think it was the first time I heard her rendition of "House Carpenter" that I became hooked. But not too long ago I had the same experience as a few other mudcatters had - I re-listened to some of those recordings and, although I enjoyed them, I did find her voice a little too high and shrill and without enough emotion. I still consider her to be one of the greatest and wish she'd stuck more to traditional folk rather than going the singer/songwriter appeal to the masses route (although I do like some of her songs). Still, I don't think she does much traditional folk anymore and more's the pity.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Peter T.
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:52 AM

Of all the songs she introduced me to, hers was the first version of "In The Pines" I ever heard, and I can still remember being seriously frightened by it. I can't recall if I have ever been frightened by any other song.

I completely agree about "Diamonds and Rust" -- what an amazing song, really a triumph by someone who is not much of a songwriter. She singlehandedly retilts the whole relationship through which she took a lot of grief (and was probably a pain herself too). It just pours out. A novel in four verses: her Tangled Up in Blue (er, Bob). I would give a lot to find out what Bob Dylan thinks of the song.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Big Tim
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 09:56 AM

Probably not a lot. Bob himself now apparently regrets recording "Ballad in Plain D" - just too personal. Great art tho. Johnny Depp to play Bob, with a mask?

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 11:17 AM

I can't think of anyone who could play Bob. 'Cept maybe his son...

"Ballad in Plain D" was not only too personal, perhaps, but it was also horrendously unfair to Carla Rotolo (Suze's sister), and just a tad self-indulgent. On the other hand, it has that great last verse:

My friends from the city, they ask unto me
How good, how good does it feel to be free
And I answer them back most mysteriously
Are birds free from the chains of the skyway?

What a marvellous lyrical image to end a song with!

- LH

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Jun 01 - 12:00 PM

Dylan used to ask Joan to perform Diamonds and Rust during the Rolling Thunder tour. Whether because he liked it or that it was big at the time is unclear. For all his twisted words, Dylan does seem to like the truth to be told(when someone else is telling it). Johnny Depp is a good pick to play Dylan. He excels at quirky characters. But who could play Joan? Too late now, but a young Emmylou?

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,Celine
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 12:14 AM

Ah yes, I am a Joan Baez fan. My mother raised me on her and Buffy Saint Marie. Needless to say that I remember the sixties because I wasn't there... (have you heard that joke?) My mother was attracted because of the social activism these two women carried on through their music.

I can understand that some people would not like the wavering of her voice. It is excessive although I never tire of it. The first song I learned was "All In Green Went My Love Riding". Then "Fountain of Sorrow" which I find describes classically the fall-out of romantic obsession. That would be the pattern of her life romantically I would say after reading her auto-biography. I couldn't follow her path career wise. Someone had to tread that path. Thank God for her.

Perhaps her beauty lies in her mixed heritage - Mexican and was it Irish? A beautiful combination and from an intellectual family.

As for a movie, I'd love to audition although I'd not get the part. I don't have the looks nor the artistic profile.

Celine

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Gary T
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 08:52 AM

The mention above of Rod Stewart brings to mind his comment to the effect that he thought (correctly) that he didn't have much of a singing voice, but was inspired to go ahead and sing anyway by the fact that Dylan was able to get away with it.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Jun 01 - 10:11 AM

Of course, Dylan had something to sing about. In somewhat recent years Rod's stable of songwriters churned out a blatantly transparent ripoff inspired by Dylan's "Forever Young" of 1974. They either thought no one would notice...or they just didn't care. Probably the latter.

The commercial music business actually really goes for people with "non-voices"...there have been a whole bunch of Rod Stewart clones of both sexes. Gravelly voice translates to romantic emotion in some people's minds.

- LH

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: GUEST,JEFF
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 07:38 AM

A friend's older brother bought Baez 1&2 when they were first released. I was pre teens and it was the first real music I had heard (apart from "The Laughing Policeman" and "Sparky's Magic Piano") and started a 40ish year love of folk music. Mary Hamilton and Geordie were beautiful but the best from the early years (ever?) was Birmingham Sunday. It had a great effect on me (a callow and probably objectionable teenager at the time) and showed me the power of a song. Later, of course, Diamonds and Rust. Why has nobody mentioned the great Dylan impression in Simple Twist of Fate on D and R. I can't believe I'm the only one who has spotted it.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: balladeer
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 08:12 AM

I love Rod Stewart. And Bob. And Joan. Still.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Stevangelist
Date: 07 Jun 01 - 10:58 AM

And just to make the point, there are very few women in music, IMHO, who have held up as well in the looks department as Joan. Always been very beautiful in my mind. BTW, Emmylou's nothing to scoff at, either.

May The Road Rise To Meet You,

Stevangelist

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: MorwenEdhelwen1
Date: 28 Jun 11 - 09:08 PM

Personally, I've been compared to Joan Baez in my singing a few times. I think she is a skillful singer with a very soulful voice, especially on spirituals.

Subject: RE: Thank God for Joan Baez!
From: Joe_F
Date: 29 Jun 11 - 08:19 PM

People used to put her records on in the Student Center at Caltech while I was there in 1962. I did not know then, and do not care now, what she looked like or what her place in history was. I thought she sang like an angel, but I have thought that about a lot of people whose names I have forgotten & you have never heard.