BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?

Subject: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 03:53 PM

Is Lord of the Ring's Peter Jackson finally going to get the Oscar for best director this time?

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 04:35 PM

If that award means anything, they can't give it to anyone else. LOTR trilogy is historic cinema, pure and simple.

And they should DEFINITELY get the award for best adaptation, if that award means anything either.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 04:43 PM

That would imply that ANY such award really means anything at all...

Best Adaptation? I know a LOT of "RTFs" (Rabid Tolkien Fans) who would bite you in the a$$ for just the merest suggestion of such a thing...

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 07:35 PM

I gotta side with Clinton re: the validity of the Academy Awards.

But yes, Peter Jackson definitely deserves recognition for his work on that epic. It showcased what is best about the cinema. And why we should even still bother attending it.

One of the coolest moves Jackson made was bring on to his staff the likes of Alan Lee and John Howe, the two top (IMO) illustrators of Tolkien's work for years. They provided a centre for much of the cohesive look of those films. Some scenes were direct adaptations of those artists paintings, down to composition and lighting.

Peter Jackson also made a sort of tribute to other artist's visions in a lot of different scenes, especially in the first film. I saw scenes reminiscent (especially in the Shire and Bree) of Bakshi's previous aborted attempt at bringing LOTR to film (which PJ was very familiar with).

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Raedwulf
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 08:17 PM

I bloody well hope not! ROTK was far & away the worst of 3 less than sparkling adaptations of the book (& no, I don't class myself as a purist or a RTF). He might have deserved it for the first film of the trilogy, but the last is a piece of garbage!

I'd agree with Cluin that the look was near perfect. Unfortunately, Mr Muppet Jackson & his wife saw fit to take appalling & unforgiveable liberties (i.e. completely unnecessary changes that added rather less than nothing) with the story itself. In the first film, this is a fairly minor point.

In the last they're glaringly (& obviously shit)! He doesn't know how to adapt a film from a book, his directorial style is pants (take 3 second scene that ought to be suspenseful, extend it to 30 seconds, lose all dramatic effect e.g. Sam's "drowning"), & his previous track record is non-existent. He's a good salesman, make no mistake. He conned, sorry, persuaded movie magnates to back the filming of what was considered unfilmable. Unfortunately, his persuasiveness is greater by far than his artistic ability. He's fucked up the film of the book that was voted the best of the millenium.

Thumbs down from me...

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 10:02 PM

And Clinton, to those who would "bite you in the a$$" for suggesting that Jackson told the story on film better than Tolkien told it on the page, I say...bite me. :)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Feb 04 - 08:40 AM

He conned, sorry, persuaded movie magnates to back the filming of what was considered unfilmable.

I think that in itself would deserve an Oscar - for whether you like or loath the 3 films that resulted - his efforts over 7 years are there on film. And just like the book is/was over many years - out there to be shot at or to be enjoyed and admired. I am in the latter camp and although I am not sure if Oscars are worth anything - they would certainly be worth a lot less should Peter Jackson's creation not be rewarded this time.

Perhaps if he wears a nice frock?

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 25 Feb 04 - 08:42 AM

C'mon Raedwulf. Don't beat about the bush. Tell us what you realy think:-)

I disagree personaly but, like music and literature, film is primarily about personal taste and is very subjective. That being said I will agree that the screen version of ROTK is the one that bugged me most as well. Having got both versions of the 2 earlier ones on DVD however I can see that some of the gaps left in the theatre version are going to be filled in on the extended DVD. Bloody annoying indeed but good marketing on New Line Cinemas part!

In answer to the original question. Don't know! The majority of people do seem to love him but, as Raedwulf points out, some people are vehemantely against. With opions split so diversely I suspect what will happen is that the awards will go to the blandest and least contraversial choice. Or the ones that put most mney into the pockets of the judges...

Oooooh. Am I being cynical here;-)

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: freda underhill
Date: 25 Feb 04 - 08:45 AM

i hope he gets an Oscar - i think he did a great job, in every way. I enjoyed it HUGELY and have seen the various episodes 10 times now. I LOVED IT. any miserable critic can go crawl into the depths of mordor, and wait to be saved by Gandalf. I HOPE HE GETS AN OSCAR.

so there

f.underhill

except for omitting tom bombadil.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Raedwulf
Date: 25 Feb 04 - 06:11 PM

LOL! Freda - Omitting Tom Bombadil was understandable & entirely correct, given that he had to trim things & Tom is wholly irrelevant to the plot. Yours is the first protest I've heard at his omission.

Dave - Look, if you want me to stop being tactful & reserved... ;) Seriously, I expect ROTK will pick up Oscars, but that only goes to show how rotten, worthless & corrupt the whole awards process is. It's far more to do with Hollywood politics, Buggins turn, & brown nosing, than it is about merit. It has been for many years. ROTK will get Oscars because it's 'their' turn - they've been ignored for the last couple of films, after all.

Other than that, I'd agree that the DVD's, from everything I've heard, present a much better version of the book than the cinema films. I don't necessarily have a problem with that. After all, you can only expect cinemas & filmgoers to co-operate with planting their bums for so long...

But Jackson absolutely does not deserve an Oscar. There should have been one or two for the FOTR. The look & feel was perfect, & the FX & production teams should have received acknowledgement for that. In ROTK, that is all old hat, which is one reason that it makes such little impact on me. The look of it was presented two films ago. It's no longer new & startling. If ever it fooled me before (it didn't), it certainly no longer covers for the appalling butchery of the final film.

Shambles - As far as I am aware, the Oscars do not currently have a category for "Behind the scenes politicking". If they do, I fully support its award to the Muppet, but as a director, he's a complete non-entity. Unfortunately, "Best Director" is what he will get...

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 04:13 AM

Shambles - As far as I am aware, the Oscars do not currently have a category for "Shambles - As far as I am aware, the Oscars do not currently have a category for "Behind the scenes politicking". If they do, I fully support its award to the Muppet, but as a director, he's a complete non-entity. Unfortunately, "Best Director" is what he will get... If they do, I fully support its award to the Muppet, but as a director, he's a complete non-entity. Unfortunately, "Best Director" is what he will get...

I hope that you are proved right for I think that we may have established that all of the awards are for - and due to "behind the scenes politicking".

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 04:18 AM

As far as I am aware they do not (yet) have a category for Shambles. This is how the post should have read.

Shambles - As far as I am aware, the Oscars do not currently have a category for "behind the scenes politicking". If they do, I fully support its award to the Muppet, but as a director, he's a complete non-entity. Unfortunately, "Best Director" is what he will get... If they do, I fully support its award to the Muppet, but as a director, he's a complete non-entity. Unfortunately, "Best Director" is what he will get...

I hope that you are proved right for I think that we may have established that all of the awards are for - and due to "behind the scenes politicking".

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: s6k
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 09:52 AM

He deserves to win awards for the film because it was a great attempt.
Thats all it was though, an attempt.

There is no excuse for the amount of stuff he left out of all of the films. the worst by far was the third part, he totally changed the ending so it was happy and "hollywood"

b******s to him but he made a pretty good effort. if he was a fan though, he would have done an adaptation of the story, not change it to suit his and hollywoods needs

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Strick
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 10:09 AM

I used to get excited about movies leaving stuff out of a book until I saw a movie script first hand. A script for 90 minute movie usually runs about 200 pages of fairly large print. Lots of white space. LOTR, my Ballentine paperback copy from the 60s anyway, runs closer to 1300 pages of print so small I can't read it without my glasses anymore. How could something not get left out?

Jackson deserves the Oscar because no one else could even have come as close to capturing the essense of the books as he did. Then there's his innovation in filming all three movies at once to maintain some kind of continuity. It took keeping 9 film crews running simultaneously with fiber optic links between them so Jackson could monitor what the assistant directors were doing. How the hell do you top that? Has any director come even close?

The movies may not be exactly what I would have expected, but dang it, they're good and the second one would be hard to beat in any action genre for all its minor flaws.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 10:35 AM

The nominations for best Director are.........

Clint Eastwood for Mystic River.

Sofia Coppola for Lost In Translation.

Peter Weir for Master and Commander.

Fernando Meirelles for City of God.

Peter Jackson for Lord of the Rings - The Return of the King.

And the winner is!

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 10:44 AM

As an aside (since I haven't seen any of the LOTR movies, but I've read the books several times), whoever is even nominated is going to get a lot of loot to take home. Gandalf is happy, it says so here:

Oscars nominees won't go home empty-handed from ABS-CBN Interactive

Text of article removed. See link. --JoeClone, 4 March 2004.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Raedwulf
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 05:04 PM

Shambles - I just want you to know, from the very bottom of my heart (I just can't believe I'm standing here saying this, I'm so proud, I couldn't have done it if weren't for Joe & Max & Jeff, & all the crew {cue crocodile tears}, & my dear old mum {cue peeled onions for a more genuine article}), that if ever they do (eventually) have a category for Shambles you will 110% wholeheartedly have all of my vote (unless it gets bought off by someone else), no I mean it, I really do, I love you all.

After all, no-one I know is a bigger shambles than yo...

Hang on, that doesn't read quite as I meant it...

[To be taken with, not so much a pinch, as a MINE of salt! ;)]

Rædwulf the Luvvie

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Raedwulf
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 05:11 PM

Strick - I've no complaints about what he left out. It's what he changed that pisses me off. LOTR was voted the book of the millennium. Scarcely anyone will remember Jackson's name in a century. Who the hell does he think he is to "improve" things? Oh, & the fact that, as a director, he's an arty-farty idiot with only the slenderest grasp of the mundane reality of the things that he's filming.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 08:08 PM

I haven't watched the Oscars for years. Watched it once and that was enough for me. It's like post-game interviews with sports people: Yeah, we uh worked hard on offense but we really had good defensive play. Uh . . . . Blah, blah, blah.

Some of these Oscar people are wearing clothes--the cost of which--could feed a family for a year. I don't need to see that. Yes, you hair is absolutely darrrrling. Hug hug, kiss kiss. Let's do lunch. Gimme a break.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Strick
Date: 26 Feb 04 - 08:58 PM

Raedwolf, I've read the books 4 or 5 times, but it's been years (and years!). I guess I just don't remember what he changed or care since it seemed to work for me. Movies are a different media than books and you have tell the story differently.

Oh, well, I enjoyed them enough and don't consider any of the really sacred portions of the books to have been tampered with.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: s6k
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 04:07 AM

Third film:

Pellinor Fields: The dead army do NOT fight and defeat saurons army at Pellinor Fields, they enlist the help of a bunch of slaves and then defeat the army.

Sam: When gollum finds crumbs on sam, and Frodo tells him to go home, Sam does NOT turn back and set off home in the book. this has been made up.

The ending of the book.... hobbits return to the shire to find it being destroyed by orcs. this tells us a lot about the price of war, etc.
The film makes the war out to be happening somewhere else, that they have been defeated on their home ground and everyone can now return home.
The film does not stress like the book how the whole world would be changed if sauron won.

hollywood is so crap, that because it thinks it will lose 20 dollars by putting the real ending in as opposed to the "happy" ending, it opts for the happy option, almost ruining one of the messages of the story. this is why its refreshing to see films like The Usual Suspects and Memento.

Like i said before, Jackson deserves the oscars because nobody else would make this good a job of it. But he is still a nonce and a prat who thinks hes a fan of the books, and he wont be forgiven for messing with the third part like he did.
Not that all three arent exceptional films in their own right. its just frustrating in the highest degree to people who have read the books and know he f***ed it up

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 04:25 AM

Like i said before, Jackson deserves the oscars because nobody else would make this good a job of it. But he is still a nonce and a prat who thinks hes a fan of the books, and he wont be forgiven for messing with the third part like he did.
Not that all three arent exceptional films in their own right. its just frustrating in the highest degree to people who have read the books and know he f***ed it up

Perhaps at least an award is due to him for not F****G up as much as he could have done or as much as other directors may have done? I for one am very glad that he made the film before others did.

For the only answer really, is for everyone to make the film of the book as they would like. I couldn't have made the fantastic effort that Peter Jackson made and although it is not the film I would have tried to make - I like his visual version of the book very much.

For you do still have the books to read and your own imagination to use and in this way you do make your own film of the books (in your head) every time you read them. But this was his version and om my opinion - a great one.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 05:32 PM

Remember s6k - the films just aren't Tolkiens Lord of the Rings - they are Jacksons Lord of the Rings. To take something so major from one medium to another will always involve serious changes. Jackson did what he thought was best. Some agree. Some don't. C'est la vie...

I not only read the books but studied them to quite a high degree. I do not agree with some of his changes. Some however, to me at any rate, enhance the books. An odd one was Boromirs death. In the book it seemed quite insignificant but the film opened up a whole new interpretation for me. I am sure other bits did the same for other people.

Just see the films as a window into how someone elses mind works, as well as a stunning display of effects:-) and I am sure you will enjoy them more.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 05:50 PM

"suggesting that Jackson told the story on film better than Tolkien told it on the page, I say...bite me. :)"

Well, For what it's worth, I came outa all 3 movies wishing that the books were half that good...

Raed?

" Mr Muppet Jackson & his wife saw fit to take appalling & unforgiveable liberties "

Such as...

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 05:57 PM

We had better be careful here, Clinton. Looks like we might end up agreeing on something...;-)

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: s6k
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 06:13 PM

ROFL. ohhhh dear. someone needs to learn how to appreciate literature :P

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 06:24 PM

:-) :-) :-)

Don't worry s6k. We'll wait while you take the course...

Cheers

:D

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 06:27 PM

s6k... I do appreciate literature...

DtG :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Tig
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 08:43 PM

Will you please stop talking about my big little brother.

(My little little brother is actually Michael Jackson :-) )

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 28 Feb 04 - 12:46 AM

Will you people quit grinning at one another? It's freakin' eerie!

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 29 Feb 04 - 08:26 PM

I hear that they are making a sequel to The Sex Lives of the Potato Men. Its is bound to win best picture next time - a real Smash.

It is to be called - The Return of the King (Edward)........

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 29 Feb 04 - 11:48 PM

Of course he is!
Robyn

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Robyn
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 12:09 AM

And now he has!!!!
11 out of 11!!!!!
Including the big one!
Robyn in Middle Earth.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: GUEST,freda
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 12:58 AM

so well deserved - All Hail, Peter Jackson, Lord of the Oscars!!!!!


freda underhill

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 06:55 AM

In answer to the original question.

Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes

Oh ye of litlle faith...:-)

Cheers

DtG

(Mind you Titanic won the same number and was nominated for 3 more! Says enough about the Oscars?)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 06:58 AM

Uh oh, too much success. Now all the fans who are inate iconoclasts and given to contrariness will have to turn against Jackson and start ridiculing the movies. ;)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: freda underhill
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 07:01 AM

not all.. not at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: The Shambles
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 08:32 AM

That bloody Peter Jackson..........

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 08:54 AM

Well, I agree they were short a few nominations. Not nominated for cinematography? What WERE they thinking?

I believe the sweep is a testament to what they pulled off, which was truly historic. For once, kudos are well deserved.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 04:51 PM

Er... with regards to best original song -I don't even remember it from the movie! We Cold Mountain fans wuz robbed! Linda Kelly(wearing dress by Marks & Spencers earings and jewelry Top Shop)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 05:39 PM

Yes, the Oscars are a huge, overblown, self-serving exercise by a huge, bloated, self-congratulatory industry. Fine.

And yes, Peter Jackson deserves winning those Oscars for delivering a very impressive, though flawed, adaptation of the LOTR trilogy...better than anyone (okay, ALMOST anyone) might have expected.

As for Titanic, what that was was a superb recreation of a huge ship sinking...combined with a perfectly dreadful and unconvincing soap opera love story that, if I may quote the teenage girls of my town...just SUCKED! Oh, but the teenage girls mostly loved it, didn't they? That's Hollywood for you. They wouldn't have sold a quarter as many tickets without that stupid F***king love story, would they? (sigh) I remember when historical movies felt it was enough just to tell the real story (as in "A Night To Remember")...but we live in the Age of Excess now.

We should all be quite thankful that Peter Jackson did as fine a job on LOTR as he did. Good for him. Imagine how bad it could have been! Just imagine. We were all very lucky to get a fantasy trilogy that good from the movies.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: GUEST,Arne Langsetmo
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 02:08 AM

I thought the biggest liberties were taken in TTT, not ROTK.

Who cares much whether the Dead were on the Pellenor fields
or not; the result is pretty much the same.

But in TTT, the Ents have to be tricked into attacking
Isengard by the hobbits. Not really fair to the quite
thoughtful (if not so hasty) Ents. Littler point is their
role in the victory at Helm's Deep (which could admittedly
be left out due to time considerations).

But my most serious problem with TTT is the portrayal of
Faramir. Faramir is far more insightful than Jackson
portrayed him, and does _not_ try to take the ring.
Admittedly, he contemplates it, but decides that doing
the right thing is more important than duty. That business
of hauling Frodo off to Osgiliath was completely bogus.
And then the business of Frodo about to hand over the
ring to the Nazgul: never happened. Why put these things
in there? They really twist what the book characters
were like. Then there's Arwen's marching off with the
elves. Wrong. Many elves were leaving (but they had
been for some while anyway), but the head elves did indeed
stick around through the final battle rather than cut and
run when the going was still good.

As for ROTK, they leave out Sam's use of the ring
(which will eventually gain Sam passage "into the West"
as well), (and as someone mentioned), the aftermath
in the Shire, not to mention Saruman's fate _and_
Frodo's continuing compassion WRT Grima/Wormtongue.
Sure, action is nice, but they could have cut a few
of those long still shots of Frodo's made-up eyes
a bit and squeezed a few more things in that _really_
developed these characters some more.

. . .

Was ROTK all that great? I don't think so. Very good,
but not so much as to trample everyone else in any
category they were nominated. I think part of it
was guilt for stiffing LOTR in previous years, much
to Clint's misfortune this year. Was some of it
lingering hangover from the Iraq war??? If so, they
ought to have gone to check out the picture walls
on the web of Iraq casualties, and maybe they wouldn't
have been so ga-ga-ga about "good-v.-bad" battle
epics in which the heroes kill hundreds of baddies
with nary a scratch ... and destroy all the evil WoMD
in the end so that every one lives happily ever after.

. . .

If the AMPAS gave ensemble awards for best cast acting,
I'd think of the LOTR folks as serious contenders (but
still pick the _entire_ "Mystic River" cast, personally).

. . .

As for "best song": Typical. Schmaltzy orchestrated
stuff breaks these people's hearts ... gimme a break,
how about a good song (either "Cold Mountain" song was
better).

Yeah, that's how I really feel.

Cheers,

                            -- Arne Langsetmo

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: flattop
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 08:34 PM

Does Brian Sutton still play that Titanic song about the polar bear?

Would Titanic work better with a stupid F***king hate story?

Elwy Yost played a more historical version a few years ago. The plot still sucked. The boat sank. I figured the new one might have the same ending so I couldn't watch it. What would be the point?

In Elwy Yost's version, I think the band played "Shall We gather at The River as The Boat Sank."   Did they have delusions of being on a wide river, not off newfieland, was the scriptwriter bored with his work, or did I get the wrong hymn?

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Peace
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 08:43 PM

In answer to the title of this thread, I predict, "Yes!"

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 10:39 PM

Flattop!!!! My God, man, I was wondering if you were still in the land of the living. Still playing devil's advocate, eh? :-) Titanic would have worked better for me with this kind of story: Focus on the key people who were responsible for building the ship and crewing it. That's high drama. You had one of the foremost shipbuilders of his era, a career captain, and a group of highly professional seamen, none of whom would ever have dreamed that ship would sink on its maiden voyage. That makes for tremendously high drama. You also had the very rich and the very poor, literally all in the same boat...but of course, you were more likely to get off if you happened to be among the rich. More high drama. You don't need a contrived love story to dress up a situation that is already totally chock full of important moral and psychological issues of a really timeless nature.

Am I to deduce that you want to see a movie where the Titanic DOESN'T sink? (LOL!)

There is still debate about which was the last song played by the band, but most witnesses said that it was a tune called "Autumn". In some of the movies done about the Titanic it was changed to the tune "Nearer My God To Thee", for obvious reasons.

Whatever it was, that was a tremendously poignant moment.

Note that a recent movie, and a very good one, called "Master and Commander" had no love story. Hurrah! Someone out there had some guts for a change, and decided to tell it like it was in the British Navy of the 1800's. Ever read any Patrick O'Brien, Flattop?

PM and let me know what you're up to.

Yeah, Bryan still sings the song about the polar bear. He's going to England shortly.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: flattop
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 10:59 PM

Hey LH,

How about a surprise ending? Why not a surprise ending? In fact, a tale with the correct amount of revenge would have that chief shipbuilder strolling down to the drydock and getting wacked in the head with a spanner - none of the hordes of innocent ticket purchasers getting soaked in the north atlantic.

What kind of a bitter ole man are you turning into, wanting thousands to die in the sea while begrudging them a bit of passion?

f,

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: flattop
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 11:02 PM

And who is Patrick O'Brien, Conan's brother?

I feel like I'm in a different time zone & won't PM tonight.

We have to go to bed.

f.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 12:08 AM

I'm with Brucie up there. I think Jackson is a mortal lock to win more than one Oscar.
He's liable to win 10 or 11 in fact.
I'm gonna bet the mortgage on this one.

Seamus

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 12:18 AM

Actually, I think Peter Jackson will only win 3 oscars: Best Picture, Best Director, and Best Adapted Screenplay.

Though others involved in the project might win an awrd or two also...

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 11:05 AM

Flattop, I am becoming the kind of bitter old man who prefers spending his money on model airplanes and guitars than on good looking women... :-)

Whaddya mean "We" have to go to bed? Has some female had the colossally bad judgement to move in with you?????

Patrick O'Brien is an author who wrote a whole series of novels about the British Navy in the Napoleonic era. Those novels feature two important characters: Captain Jack Aubrey, a career officer in the navy, and Doctor Ray Maturin, the chief surgeon on Aubrey's ship(s). They are very well written books and are almost universally considered to be the finest and most realistic and detailed depictions of the age of fighting sail. A movie was recently made, based on those same books, and it's very faithful to the books in every way. It's called "Master and Commander - The Far Side of the World". Go and see it.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 11:11 AM

Manly men, doing manly things on their manly voyage through rough, manly waters!

"Now where's that cabin boy?..."

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 11:28 AM

Watch that loose tongue, Mr Cluin, or we'll introduce you to the gunner's daughter!

No, Flattop, I'm not begruding the doomed 1500 their moments of passion. Not at all. A few such moments could be nice. I'm just objecting to being subjected to a melodramatic "moment" of passion that lasts the better part of 3 hours and gets in the way of the whole rest of the story.

And I'm objecting to Celine Dionne. I went to Cuba to get away from such stuff, and even the kids there were singing that silly song.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 01:22 PM

"Watch that loose tongue, Mr Cluin, or we'll introduce you to the gunner's daughter!"

More of that manly stuff. Rum, Sodomy and the Lash, yessir!

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 01:51 PM

The important thing about sodomy in the old navy, me lad, was not to get caught doing it! Sort of like present-day politics.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 02:15 PM

And the thing about no women...therefore an almost complete lack of sexual opportunity for the sailors at sea...was this: Men fight the enemy more vigorously under such circumstances. They've gotta do something with all that pent-up energy! :-)

But just wait till they get to port. Drunkeness and debauchery fit to curdle the blood! Wine, women, and song! It would be entirely possible to tell an Aubrey-Maturin tale that included such incidents, as well as touching on Aubrey's personal lovelife when ashore, which was quite involved as I recall from the books. They just didn't happen to do that in the first movie. I hope there's a second one.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 03:57 PM

Arne L - The points about the Ents part at Helms Heep and Faramir are both addressed ably in the extended DVD as, I suspect, will a lot of ommisions from ROTK.

Bit of a money spinner for the producers but as long as silly buggers like me keep buying both versions they will keep doing it;-)

If you can get hold of the extended versions I would recommend you watch them

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Mar 04 - 07:21 PM

And...watch for the EXTENDED extended version....which will be released a couple of years from now to complement the extended version. The EXTENDED extended version will be 160 hours long and will even include Tom Bombadil (played by Robin Williams) and the scouring of the Shire!!!!!!!!!!
















Okay, I'm just kidding... :-)



- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 02:07 AM

It was much funnier the second time, LH.   ;)

I agree about the extended editions. Well worth the money. If you're going to buy the DVDs, get the extended editions. over 30 extra minutes of must-see footage in "Fellowship" and over 40 minutes in "Two Towers". Fills out the story a lot and the soundtrack was re-edited and re-composed to make the additions seamless. I look forward to the release of "Return" in the same version. Still boggles my mind that Peter Jackson took time out from filming and editing the more recent chapeters to go back and re-do the previous movies in extended format for DVD release. When did he sleep?

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: GUEST,Arne Langsetmo
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 02:09 AM

Thanks, Dave.

My Bro-in-law has the extended version of TTT, and I thought
I watched that, but maybe I watched his old one (or had the
settings wrong on my DVD).

I'll try it again, when I get my hands on it. Hard to
figure out how they'll patch up the mischaracterisation
of Faramir and the invented Osgiliath/Frodo scene by _adding_
to the movie, though. . . .

ROTK, needless to say, I haven't seen in extended version,
so I'll withhold judgement.

Cheers,

                         -- Arne Langsetmo

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Cluin
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 02:09 AM

p.s. There were almost no women in Deliverance too. Little Hawk. ;)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 11:23 AM

Yes, and there were none in "Flight of the Phoenix". I have no reluctance to watch women in films (to put it mildly!)...but it's refreshing now and then to see a story where there wouldn't have been any women actually treated in a realistic fashion by the movie industry.

Now for a great movie WITH women, watch "Body Heat". I give it 10 out of 10.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Peace
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 12:42 PM

I like women.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Amergin
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 03:26 PM

for a really good movie with women in it....watch Behind The Green Door...

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Peace
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 05:37 PM

Yep, I definitely like women.

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 06:36 PM

You're really sure now? :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Oscars - is Peter Jackson going to win?
From: Peace
Date: 04 Mar 04 - 06:51 PM

Yeppers, I am sure. Absolutely. No question. God, I love women.