BS: Whine Fest

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST,peedeecee
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 07:03 PM

Michelle, as you may know from reading a different thread some time ago, my oldest daughter died 5 1/2 years ago - actually, it will be 6 years at the end of January.

All you can do is what you are doing. Cry. Cry again. Go to the places that you would normally go to in your life, and if they make you cry, then cry. Then go again. It is hard. It is necessary. It is not something you ever get over, but it is something you can get through.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 01:27 PM

Rage at Veronica's mother. Sometimes...yes. The school issue has been taken care of. Her clothing on the other hand....I have kept some of her favorites...but I have to face facts that she is not coming back. I have not heard from her nor do I expect to. When she lived here she did not ask to call her mother nor did she write to her unless prompted. She showed so little interest in her own mother that I'm sure we aren't going to hear from her. I have written and I have emailed her and have yet to get a response. I will write again anyway.

   Keeping the clothes? What am I going to do with them? I'm not going to send boxes upon boxes of stuff to New York. If she ever would return to our home, she would have outgrown all this stuff anyway. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

   And being consumed with this....I suppose that sometimes I am. I can go for days without having an issue in discussing Veronica...but for whatever reason this week, I'm having difficulty. I have scheduled another appointment with my Dr. for tomorrow. Part of me knows that I'm in trouble and the other part thinks that I am fine and grieving...and that's all there is to it. Again, I don't know. I think to myself that last year at this time, Veronica had been in a localparade, the last time I saw a particular bluegrass band, she was there...laying in the sun on a blanket tapping her toes in the sunshine....last time I picked apples, she was there, climbing the ladder and delighting in the thudding of apples falling to the ground. I miss her more when I am doing things that I know she would have enjoyed or that we had enjoyed together in the past. I am okay at home except for the occassional note that I find that she left for me..sometimes hidden in the darnedest places. I went to church last Saturday night...something that she and I always did together. The first time there without her was horrible...I cried through the entire thing. This week, my mom returned from her travels and she went to church. Veronica, who always sat between us seemed to be overwhelmingly missing again. Then someone asked me (very innocently, I'm sure) where my girl was? Didn't she want to live here anymore? That did it for me. As soon as the service was over, it was all I could do to get outside without just wailing. I'm considering not going there anymore because it is just HARD. I know it's not going to be easy and I have to work through this but I feel like every time I crawl back up on top of my stool and have a somewhat normal view of the world again, I fall off again.

)(*&(*&$^%$@$#@^%)*&^()*^(&$^%@$#!$%#%$(&%(&^(&^#%#$!@^%#*&^%*&^#%$@&%#&^$%$@%$#^%)&*%(&^#%$@^$@%$(&*%)(*^_(&)*&%^%#$@&%$#*^&%(*&^)*^(^&$%^#

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: Big Mick
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 10:28 AM

I am very conflicted by this discussion. On one hand I am reading the posts of a person who cares very deeply, who saw a child in need and did all the right things, put her heart and soul into making a difference for this child, and who is going through justifiable anger and grieving at the injustice of what has been dealt. For this extraordinary person, I want to extend my arm in friendship, caring, and understanding.

But the other person I see here is a person, with justifiable rage, who is so focused on her anger at the Mother, and her own feelings of sorrow at HER loss, that it is clouding her judgement. Michelle, it is so clear to me that you care for, and love, this little girl. Don't let your grief cause you to do things counter to the good works you have already done. For example, you take great pride in what she accomplished at school for the first time in her life. If the pride is due to the fact that YOU were good for her, then do nothing to help this sorry excuse for a Mother. But if your pride, and your joy, was for Veronica then you need to put away the anger at the Mother and get those records to that school. In your heart, you know that this isn't about you, but about that girl you have come to love. Whether you ever see her again or not, and I believe you will, your motivations have to be her best interests and not your anger at the injustice of it all.

I agree with the wise women here who are encouraging you to vent the grief. But DO NOT be consumed by it. Based on what I am reading, you are in danger of that. You have provided a brief shining moment in this little girls life. It is amazing how those times are often the defining times in the lives of these children. Grieve, sure, but take solace in that fact.

AND WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT GIVE THOSE CLOTHES AWAY. Pack them in boxes, and put them someplace where you do not have to look at them. I will bet you anything that she will be back for them one day. Might take a while, but she will. And the act of love involved in giving them back will have an impact that is profound.

Remember, Michelle, it is not just this girl you made an impact on. It is the as yet unborn children that she will bear that will also be the recipient of your love. After all, you have shown Veronica what a loving Mother really is. Congratulations.

With great respect and concern for you,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 10:00 AM

How about posting them to her. With some of her favorite sweets and a cheerful letter. Letting her know how everyone is.
She might be missing you just as much and if she did phone and ask for x item of clothing, and you tell her you gave them away, she might feel really abandoned.She might want to start up a dialogue with you but unsure of how to start?

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 09:35 AM

Maybe your body is telling you not to do this?

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 27 Sep 04 - 07:42 AM

Well.....all of Veronica's clothes have been packed up and are now in the back of my car. I will be taking them to the Salvation Army tomorrow. It just makes me sick. I woke up sick, I sat at the breakfast table and cried some more. It's almost been a month since she left and it feels like years.

I don't want to take those clothes anywhere, I just don't. There's nothing else to do with them though...they aren't helping anyone here.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 20 Sep 04 - 11:10 PM

Hey Harpgirl,

I agree...I think SueB pinpointed a lot of my frustration.

I'm sorry to hear you are having a rough go of it too. :(

   There's a very logical part of me that KNOWS I don't have it so bad and that there are many more who suffer far more. My heart, however, doesn't give a shit about what my head has to say...I wish it would listen...

    I hope your appointment book turns up...sounds like a paperwork nightmare.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 20 Sep 04 - 11:01 PM

Dear Mrs. Cootiesniffer,

   What makes me laugh? Not much...at least not right now. I can feel my face smile sometimes (a particular story about a woman standing in the doorway of a bell tower and a bunch of rain dumping down on her...for instance) but I don't feel the laughter inside. Does that make sense? Auto pilot is the best way I can describe it. I do things without really knowing I did them....I take notes in class and the next time I look at those notes I don't recall writing them. I frequently have no idea how I got to bed, etc....yep...auto pilot. Scarey, really.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: harpgirl
Date: 20 Sep 04 - 11:01 PM

This is a sad story but maybe it will have a happier ending. Perhaps Veronica's mother will decide after a short stint at being her mother again that she is not up to the job. I'm sorry you are hurting, Michelle. The time you did spend with Veronica will be a defining moment in her life, though, I'm sure.

SueB said it so well. The worst problems are the ones we feel helpless to correct. I myself seem to have had one problem after another since the hurricanes began to hit Florida. Now I've misplaced my appointment book (I think while I was going over and back to Pensacola) and I have no idea who is coming in, whom to bill, and countless other pieces of important information are lost to me....

My brother is really suffering though. His wife hasn't worked since Charley and he is disabled but unable to get SSD. It affects the entire family...I feel so tired...

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 20 Sep 04 - 10:32 PM

That tummy thing is usually fear looking for a way out. What makes you laugh? SueB got in a good one today in the Helpful Hints thread-- might get you started. Laughter is a great way to discharge fear.

~The Honorable Mrs. Cootiesniffer

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 20 Sep 04 - 08:58 PM

Hmmm....well....I've been working on trying to see the brighter side of things and I've been doing fairly well.

Today we did a little searching. It seems that Veronica's mother has the phone listed in someone else's name. In fact, that name has 2 phone numbers within a few blocks of each other. In searching amongst all my paperwork for some information, I ran across another little sticky note from Veronica. It says, "I am SO HAPPY Michelle. I LOVE YOU.

I've been very good about not crying lately....even discussed this situation with 2 people in the last 2 days who asked about Veronica (who had no idea) and didn't even begin to well up with tears...but that note....yep...I cried.

I just want to STOP crying...I hate this feeling and it makes me sick to my stomach. I feel like I am almost at square one all over again.

On a more positive note, my letter to Veronica has not been returned. I can only hope that her Mother (and I use that term LOOSELY) let her read it, or maybe Veronica picks up the mail herself after school...since the kids are home alone at that time.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Sep 04 - 05:23 PM

shhshshhsss your self

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 09:46 PM

For relief breaks, see thread:

BS: Eye Candy

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 12 Sep 04 - 09:40 PM

I think the worst problems are the ones that make you feel the most powerless. Everyone has problems, some huge, some little, but we can almost always find something to do about them, and taking some action, any action, no matter how small, helps. When there is nothing you can think of to do, when your own fate, and that of someone you love, is out of your control, that is the hardest thing in the world. That's where the expression "impotent rage" comes from. When your happiness, and that of a child you love, appear to be in the hands of someone who shouldn't be allowed to keep a hamster, it's intolerable.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 10:04 PM

Just a few minor things:

1. Veronica had a caseworker or she would have never been part of the Fresh Air Fund.

2. I am a Social Worker.

3. I have spent the last 10 years teaching parenting skills and working with a program in my state designed to keep kids at home (least restrictive environment possible). This involved working not only with the parents, but the courts and schools. Don't talk to me about parenting skills. I have a pretty good idea about that.

4. Discuss all the grief coping skills you want...I'll take any of it at this point. I know I'm a mess. I also know that I would never jeopardize Veronica.

5. If you feel the urge to beat on folks when they are really down, how about you bend over and take a splintery baseball bat and park it where the sun doesn't shine, mmmmmmkay? Great.

Tschuss.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: robomatic
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 08:37 PM

I remember my first encounter with Moose while skinny dipping in Maine. One pair of very civilized mother and child, nice, compatible, not a lot of noise, adult kept child away from the nasty humans. One pair of noisy moose, bawling calf, mother nipping at it.

Reminded me of that quintessential joke from "Fish Called Wanda"

Kevin Kline character is making fun of the stutterer, sister character Jamie Lee tells Michael Palin, the poor stutterer, "you've got to forgive Otto, Dad used to beat him."

Palin goes: "g-g-g-g-g-g-g-good!"

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: SINSULL
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 07:27 PM

Good point, GS. Through it all my son worried about his mother and loved her. Veronica loves her mother. It is natural and normal. I would never recommend criticizing a birth parent to a foster or adopted child. You might as well cut out his heart.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 05:25 PM

Sinsull being called an 'unfit foster mother' has obviously had an effect on you. You are quite right I have no experience of how that would feel.

But to damn a whole profession because of bad apples within it's ranks is extreme.

Presumably then you would not call the police if you woke one night to find intruders trying to break into your home, because of Rodney King's experiences.

And then of course there are abusive priests, incompetent surgeons and crooked accountants. They exist, but they are not representative of their colleagues as a whole.

I think that a social worker who has been promoted through the ranks has probably had more experience than a fresh faced college leaver, can not see a problem there either.

Flaming? No, just not in agreement with you, which in your view amounts to the same thing.

WYSIWYG...you are right. She is angry because she cares. Nothing wrong with that at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 04:28 PM

Whatever you may personally believe...the parent/child bond will always be there in spite of any conditions or environment.
Best wishes.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: SINSULL
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 03:42 PM

Guest says:
"I said it would involve a rigorous assesment on yourself and plenty of professional help and training."

I don't know what wonderful world you live in but I was a registered certified foster parent in NYC and the training was minimal. Assessment? They measured my huge bedrooms and checked to see if there was milk in the frig.They also did a background check for previous abuse complaints. Mostly I was instructed to do whatever nonsense the supervising social worker (not college trained but promoted through the system) said. This included lying about supervised visits, removing my son from school for three days for a dental appointment - one to dope him up, one for treatment, one for recovery. I could go on forever. And it hit the fan when I took him after school one day to my family dentist who treated him without painkiller and without incident. First they threatened not to pay for it - that was never an option for me. Then they threatened to sue the dentist. I offered my lawyer's number.He was healthy, happy, for the first time in his life doing well in school...but I was an unfit foster mother because I did not blindly take direction.

Shall I tell you about his previous foster parents who beat him with wire hangers until he required hospitalization? They were allowed to keep their other foster children when he was removed - obviously the beatings were his own doing. Or the ones before that who covered him with bruises and human bites? How about the sexual abuse performed systematically by another foster mother's boyfriend?

I am with Lily, GUEST. Time to go flame someplace else and preferably on a subject you have some experience in.

And back to the original topic - Lily, you have been used. Veronica is a pawn. Rant away and do what you know is best. You have a head on your shoulders and a good heart. Your best instincts will not fail you.
SINS

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 03:00 PM

Yes-- I can't think of anyone who does not hope for this:

Let's hope the new school will eventually recognise her problems and direct her to the many skilled bodies that exist to pick up the pieces.

But as to the focus of the thread, it would seem to me that the thread title reflects a clear intent to vent, and in addition to hoping for the above (italics), I also hope that the venting that has been possible has been useful and will contribte to a good outcome for all concenred.

And I, for one, would be pleased to see more of the venting.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 02:38 PM

The focus HAS been about what she could do in the future.

Interference? Why post on an open forum then?

Anyone who professes to know how to care for someone elses damaged child WITHOUT support and professional training is a liability.

There is a very slim chance that the birth mother has sought help and counselling,in an effort to improve her parenting skills, and was too embarrassed to phone and ask for help herself. I do not think it was right for her son to do the calling, but can understand why she avoided it.

On the otherhand maybe she couldn't be bothered? Let's hope the new school will eventually recognise her problems and direct her to the many skilled bodies that exist to pick up the pieces.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 02:18 PM

"The Shuddadons" is what we call the kind of focus that is more about what someone ought to have done in the past than about encouraging them toward what they choose to do in the future once they get their venting done. It's amazing really how elegantly people make and implement decisions, once the venting has occurred without interference.

An archaic, nearly-extinct species-- shuddadons.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST,school office employee
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 01:16 PM

Imagine this conversation in a school office:

What a lovely girl. Since she's new here, she doesn't have a lot of friends yet, but she'll have lots of them in no time. Academically, we're just not sure where she is. We need to have her records, to know how she has been served in the past, and how we can best help her. If we place her with so and so , she'll receive such and such. On the other hand, she might be better served by being in such and such program. It doesn't appear that mom is much of an advocate for her or we'd have what we need already. The sooner we have those records, the better off this child will be.


That said, it may well be that the school can request transfer of records once a child has been registered. Given the name and location of the school, they should have no trouble obtaining the information they need. (Laws may differ from state to state on that, though)

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 01:01 PM

I did read the entire thread. I know you are not a foster parent.

Which is why I, and many others on this thread, suggested you could enquire about the process of becoming one.

Like I said it would involve a rigorous assesment on yourself and plenty of professional help and training. However you seem to think you need neither.

Had this been an authorised fostering the CHILD'S return to her birth mother would be being monitored right now. THAT is in the interest of the child.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 12:57 PM

Anyhow, "fostering" a child does not always correspond to being a foster parent recognized by the State. It's an old practice in many cultures. The term now has a legal meaning, but the reality is more than the legality.

In other words, one can be in effect "a foster parent" without being "a Foster Parent".

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 11:59 AM

*YAWN*

Had YOU bothered to read the ENTIRE thread, you would know that we are NOT foster parents. Go fan flames elsewhere....you know nothing of my situation and frankly, I'm not interested. *YAWN*

Michelle

PS. I didn't see anyone asking for my "qualifications." Besides, I don't see where anyone must qualify to be a parent....would be nice...but such a thing doesn't exist. Buh bye now. Have a good life.

Tschuss!

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 11:41 AM

And that totally irrational diatribe highlights why foster carers should be professionally registered and trained.

I nowhere stated what you quoted I did.

You have repeatedly ignored questions from many posters re your qualifications/training for 'the job'.

I withdraw my good luck, it is the CHILD who needs it now.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 10:43 AM

A very welcomed PM.......



"You're being flamed. Classic flaming. The GUEST while acting like the voice of reason throws out snide backhanded statements. You can't win. Every response you give will be turned against you. That's also why GUEST chooses to remain nameless and keeps coming back at you with the same shit - "you don't have Veronica's interests at heart." You do! Of course you do. And you're the only one who does.

This one (recognized from her style) is an unhappy bitch who has a bug up her ass against Max. IGNORE HER."

Thanks for the advice.....point well taken and appreciated.

Love,

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 07:48 AM

You know, Veroinca is really a victim here. She has been dragged around, kicked out, forgotten, neglected and the list goes on. In the wake of her mother's destruction are 2 other siblings who no longer were able to have contact with Veronica, her NY friends and now people in the other part of her life are suffering. OBviously my husband and I are having a difficult time...but so are the rest of her new family that was made here. My dearest friend, the one Veronica referred to as Auntie Jenn is heartbroken, her daughter, Veronica's best friend, Kayla is at a loss, Forrest, a little blonde haired blue-eyed boy who had a crush on Veronica is beside himself, my mother and Pete's mother.....neighbors and certain people from church who loved Veronica...all these people are hurting to some degree. I'm glad you are able to see that there is a child who is a victim of completely horrific parenting....but there are many more lives that were touched....don't forget that.

I have done nothing to harm Veronica, nor would I. The schooling issue really is something her mother will have to tend to as I am not legally able to get the information she needs. Veronica knows the name of the school she attended for the last year and a half and what town it is located in. That's all the information her mother needs to know to get in contact. Also, Veronica has been with her mother for a month now. School starts on Monday for Veronica. If she was so concerned with this information, why wait until the last minute? HEr first priority is not her children and never will be. That is clear in every single thing she does. It's a shame, a dirty rotten shame.
Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 11 Sep 04 - 07:31 AM

Yep. she is the victim of tis case (through the fault of HER MOTHER)....doesn't mean the rest of us aren't hurting. Guess that doesn't matter though, huh?

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 09:45 PM

Thankyou Sinsull and Sue B for also being honest enough to post advice that will actually help the child.

Let's remember SHE is the victim in this sorry case.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: SINSULL
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 07:05 PM

NO HEAD HANGING! you finally have left yourself open to an honest emotion - you were used, your precious child was used, you were lied to, you've had enough!

My take on this, neither advice nor criticism: By being up front, refusing to do the leg work and giving MAMA the basic information she needs to get the records you remain the functioning adult. Playing the game by her rules gives credibility to her rules.

Veronica has to face her friends at school and explain where the hell she's been and why. It is important for her to be there Day One when all the other kids start out new. Do what you can to get her there in a timely fashion without doing anyone's work for them.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 03:07 PM

*hanging my head*

Don't you dare! Chin up! Resume rant!

:~)

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 03:05 PM

Okay...okay...so I stomped and had a fit....likely there are more where they came from. The world is full of assholes and our lovely guest is no different.

*hanging my head* Sorry about that.

I disagree with everything Guest had to say and there's little more to say about that.    We were led to believe that Veronica would be here until she graduated from high school. Stupid fucking us.....we believed that and loved Veronica with our whole hearts.....what else can I say?

Regarding the school business, Ana is going to have to figure it out on her own. I'm not sure what I'll do when she calls about it. Perhaps I just won't answer the phone. Perhaps I should make empty promises like she did....I could play stupid like she does...but that just really isn't my style...none of those. We shall see when the time comes. Gotta admit...there's a very LARGE childish side of me that wants to give back as good as I've been given. I won't...I won't...I won't...I won't.

Veronica sounded sleepy, I woke her up. I didn't talk to her long because I didn't want her to hear me cry. :( It was nice to hear her voice.....I miss her so much.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: SINSULL
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 02:08 PM

My My My. Sweet Lily has finally had her buttons pushed. I told you anger was good. Vent away. It is all healthy. And get rid of the rage before MAMA calls whining about school records. I actually think our GUEST was trying to help. Glad she was the first to post and not me.

MAMA of course had her son call because she doesn't want to speak to you. You may ask questions she doesn't want to answer.

You can be the concerned adult in this and call the mother with a name and phone number at the school with an explanation that you cannot legally request the records. They won't give them to you. That is in fact the law. Then quickly change the subject - ask about Veronica. The message that you are not going to be involved in the records will be heard loud and clear.

My experience has been that the new school can officially request the records from the old but it may require the mother's signature.

Now - more importantly - how did Veronica sound?

SINS who loves a good temper tantrum

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST,SueB
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 02:03 PM

Maybe you could meet her halfway. You could give her the name and address and phone number of the school Veronica attended when she was with you, again, even if you've already given it to her before. The picture I have of her is that she doesn't function at a very high level.

Your anger is understandable, and you're entitled to it.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 01:23 PM

In addition, you failed to answer my question...no answers? Not willing to listen or respond to my posts...just your own arrogance. If you are going to comment that I am hurting Veronica and didn't want the kind of response you got, then perhaps you should doa better job of explaining how it is that we are hurting Veronica. You know, we the folks who have been the people who have ever showed her a loving home.

You bet I'm gonna be defensive....but since you already knew that, it's likely that you are simply looking to push some buttons. Job well done.

To the rest of you folks who have been supportive, thank you. I'm done here. I have enough difficulty making it through my days KNOWING that we did the best we could without some asshole who knows nothing of the entire situation making ridiculous comments that bring up a lot of pain.

Thanks again.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 01:20 PM

Dear Seriously Angry Michelle,

What a GREAT rant that was! Good job! I know that you will do what is best, just as you have been doing.

GREAT rant!

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 01:18 PM

*Shrug* Not worth my time.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 01:15 PM

It wasn't a criticism, but your reaction was precisely why I didn't put a name to it. Good luck.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 01:14 PM

OH yes.....copying her mother's behavior? We are EVERYTHING BUT copying her mother's behavior. We call, we right, we care, we love Veronica, we never abandoned her physically, financially or mentally. I have never left her alone in the house, I have never left her with people who beat her, I have never left her to fend for her own meals and I have never EVER made her wonder about whether she is loved or not. I have not lied to her, left her at a bus station, forgot her birthday or put any other child above her...so don't even begin to compare me to her mother. Ana is concerned with what clothes she has and what brand of purse she carries.....she is not concerned with if her children have enough to eat or if they have clothes/shoes that fit them. She stands with her hand out to anyone who responds to her.....nope...I am NOTHING like her....NOTHING AT ALL.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 01:09 PM

My anger with Veronica's mother is NOT taken out on her in any manner. If Veronica needs her school records, her MOTHER will have to put forth the effort to get them. Legally, I cannot request her information to be transferred as I am no longer Veronica's guardian. Her mother in incredibly lazy in ALL aspects of life and stands with her hand out. I WILL NOT be part of it any longer. It is not MY JOB OR RESPONSIBILITY TO REGISTER VERONICA IN SCHOOL IN NEW YORK STATE. I have not been rude to her mother, I have not cursed at her mother but I'll be damned if I am going to continue doing HER job as a parent. How does that hurt Veronica? She has previously learned from her mother that if you look cute and whine a bit, you generally get what you want without doing for yourself. I did my best to UNTEACH that and will not be a model for Veronica along that venue. If Veronica doesn't get to go to school on time, that is her mother's responsibility and she will have to deal with the legalities of that.

The mother has decided that she wants to play mama for now, let her tend to all that it requires...including taking a day off to get her child's paperwork in order.

You know, I wouldn't be so pissed if the mother (Ana) had taken time each week to write Veronica a note or to call...to stay in touch with her and be part of her life. But she didn't. She abandoned Veronica and we did our very best to help Veronica adjust and make a new life for herself. Now Ana feels gulity, is likely under some observation for fraud from social welfare so she decides it's time to play mommy again. I am pissed and refuse to help because not only has one very wonderful little girl been dragged around, but we were taken advantage of in a HUGE way. And why????? I don't know. We are suffering and hurting and for what? Good things happened for Veronica because of us and I am proud of that....and I want all good things for her....but damn it, I am NOT going to help her mother anymore. I can NOT.

Further, if you don't have the guts to put your name on a post where you criticize....don't bother as I won't respond again.

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: mg
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 10:26 AM

Call the school and explain the situation and say the child is at risk and that she be monitored carefully. Then ask them to send the records. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 10:10 AM

Copying her mother's behavior probably isn't the best way to help the child? Her new school would presumably need to know how she has been doing, as her mother will not be able to tell them.

Sure get angry with the mother, but why take it out on the child?

Maybe you could apply to be a registered foster carer, most foster children do actually return to their birth parent/s. But part of the procedure in registering you would entail 'seperation counselling', so you would know how to act in the best interest of the child when they leave?

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 10 Sep 04 - 07:17 AM

Woke up this morning to, "HOney, you are never going to beleive who called." Veronica's brother called requesting that her school records be sent. Instantly my stomach is in a knot. I called Veronica (woke her up at 6:55am) and asked to speak to her mother. Mother is not there. HMPH. Veronica said that her mom needed a bunch of papers so that she could register Veronica for school. WELL GUESS WHAT? I AM NOT NOT NOT going to do a damn thing to help out that woman. SHE is the one who wants to play MOMMY let her do all the same legwork that I had to do to get Veronica registered. FUCK HER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHenever I had a question of importance regarding Veronica, her mother's response was always a long, drawn out...I Dooooooooooon't KNooooooooowwwwwwwwwwww. Well guess what? It's MY turn. I DOOOOOOOOOOOOON'T KNOW. I'm not the responsible adult who took in a girl and loved her and cared for her and saw to her education and health cares......no...I'm the fucking moron who was nothing more than a babysitter......an unpaid baby sitter at that. WHy would I have ANY idea as to how to handle the legistics of getting a child registered in school? _()*)(*^&^$#%^$@$@&^%$&*)^%(&*^$&#^%$#*&%^$^%#$*&%(^   AND the mother didn't have enough nerve to call me herself but sent a child in her place.....should we REALLY have expected anything different? That woman....THAT WOMAN!!!!!!!!!(*&%(&#%^$@&%^$(*&^_*(&)(&%*^#^%)*&^*)&$*^%#$@!#$@^%*(&*%

Seriously Angry Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 09 Sep 04 - 04:55 PM

OHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! *Clapping my hands and jumping up and down**

I sure hope Henrietta the Hen doesn't get to that dried corn before I do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Michelle, The Reformed Quacker (Good duck gone bad...gone good)

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Sep 04 - 04:34 PM

Good news - the Church of the Reformed Quackers has added you to their mailing list. You can expect a barrage of pamphlets and little bags of dried corn. Rest easy.

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: LilyFestre
Date: 09 Sep 04 - 04:28 PM

I'm having a pretty good day. I have been looking forward to the sonogram (my girlfriend's)for weeks! After the sonogram, we went to another appointment, got some lunch and then took sundaes to the sonogram techs....that was fun and made all of us very happy! :)

I blew off every afternoon obligation I had and went back to bed this afternoon. Lunch was not a great idea as food just isn't sitting well...but I did get some more sleep and am feeling better.

((((((Hugs for everybody)))))))))))))

Michelle

Subject: RE: BS: Whine Fest
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Sep 04 - 03:36 PM

Miss Lily is doing nicely at least that's what I surmise from the "What have you done to improve the world" thread. Brownie Sundaes to hospital personnel - think how many will reap the benefit of that! And being there for a friend. Sonograms are fun but a little frightening too. Good for you, Lily.