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Yiddish pronunciation?

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GUEST,TNDARLN at work 11 Oct 02 - 12:37 PM
GUEST,adavis@truman.edu 11 Oct 02 - 01:07 PM
GUEST,herbroth@san.rr.com 11 Oct 02 - 01:08 PM
GUEST,TNDARLN at work 11 Oct 02 - 01:22 PM
EBarnacle1 11 Oct 02 - 03:13 PM
GUEST 11 Oct 02 - 07:49 PM
Sorcha 12 Oct 02 - 12:23 AM
mousethief 12 Oct 02 - 12:34 AM
TNDARLN 12 Oct 02 - 08:10 AM
BH 12 Oct 02 - 06:48 PM
TNDARLN 13 Oct 02 - 08:58 AM
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Subject: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: GUEST,TNDARLN at work
Date: 11 Oct 02 - 12:37 PM

The word is from a children's book, and is used as a term of endearment: mother for child. The word is spelled "shaynkeit", and I was able to determine from Yiddish websites that the "ay" gets a long I, as in shine. But I didn't know about the ei, and whether the two vowels got one syllable or not. Could someone help with this?

Thanks in advance! T


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: GUEST,adavis@truman.edu
Date: 11 Oct 02 - 01:07 PM

Different pronunciations, depending on region. This one's connected with Hochdeutsch "schoenheit," meaning "beauty." The first vowel doesn't exist in Standard English, but you can make it by saying the vowel of "make" ([e] in the International Phonetic Alphabet) and rounding your lips. In the Yiddish I heard among Jews in St. Louis, the Standard German vowel is unrounded, and the diphthong in the second syllable loses its offglide, so the word would have been, I think, "shane-kate," or with the heavy stress on the first syllable, the second element might be reduced: "shane-kit," especially in rapid or informal speech.


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: GUEST,herbroth@san.rr.com
Date: 11 Oct 02 - 01:08 PM

First off, I'd disagree that "ay" is automatically pronounced "I". Yiddish, like most other languages, has regional dialects,but the more usual pronunciation of "sheyne" (pretty, beautiful, etc.) would be "shay-neh." The "-keit" suffix is analagous to English "-ness" and is pronounced as "kite."


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: GUEST,TNDARLN at work
Date: 11 Oct 02 - 01:22 PM

You guys are great! Thanks!


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: EBarnacle1
Date: 11 Oct 02 - 03:13 PM

In Yiddish, as in German, "ei" is pronounced "ay," as in mine. The "Schayn" part of the word, as mentioned above, is a transliteration. The 'correct' spelling is schoen. The ambiguity arises due to the difficulty in using Hebrew lettering, with its limited vowel menu, in pronouncing words derived from German.


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Oct 02 - 07:49 PM

I think a vowel was left out for the pronunciation"

shayn i kite (shaynikeit)   The I is as in a short E.

Oy---such lovely little thing---who may this shanyikeit be?

Bill H


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Oct 02 - 12:23 AM

So, you have come up with "shane-kite" (sort of) right? Except that the "shane" is almost 2 syllables..........


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: mousethief
Date: 12 Oct 02 - 12:34 AM

I wonder if the original isn't shoenigheit? That would explain the "kite" ending and the extra syllable in the middle.

Alex


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: TNDARLN
Date: 12 Oct 02 - 08:10 AM

I really appreciate y'all's input on this. The book is Molly's Pilgrim, written by Barbara Cohen. Molly and her family are newly immigrated from Russia, and the Cossacks are mentioned. Molly's mama calls her "shaynkeit".

I copied the word exactly as it appears in the book, which is on about third grade level. The hills of East Tennessee don't have a large Yiddish speaking population [that's supposed to be funny] and so anything y'all give me is more info than I had, and again, is greatly appreciated.

We're going to dramatize this story for our Thanksgiving program; and while I want to be fairly authentic, when it comes outta' the mouth of one of my young'uns it's gonna sound anything but Yiddish.

So- shehn' eh kite?

Reminds me of the first time I taught Tzena. Came out Zay na with a drawl. Most "ehs" come out as "aaayyyyyys" 'round here. My middle name is Jane, and I have an aunt that pronounces it with about 3 syllables!


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: BH
Date: 12 Oct 02 - 06:48 PM

Many (many) years ago while in the army I was stationed in Columbus GA. On the High Holy Days we were invited to the local synagogue--lovely community --and what a delight to hear Hebrew chanted with a Georgia drawl.

Hope the Thanksgiving program is a success---shaynkeit, ya'all

An aside---if you pronounce Tzena as Tsayna---you are saying "teeth"

Bill Hahn


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Subject: RE: Yiddish pronunciation?
From: TNDARLN
Date: 13 Oct 02 - 08:58 AM

Ooooooeeeeeeei!

Thanks, Bill, I will be more careful.


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