Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)

Subject: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,NSC George Henderson
Date: 25 Sep 02 - 05:52 PM

Well, Pat Cooksey. Have you finished your tour and do you have any more news regarding your legal action.

Hope you are successful

George Henderson

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Pat Cooksey.
Date: 26 Sep 02 - 06:35 AM

Hi George.

Nothing new to report at the moment, I have been advised to be careful what I post here for the time being regarding this company but I will let you know direct when the time comes. Thanks for the kind words in the NSC Newsletter and best wishes to all in Nenagh.

Pat.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,james
Date: 03 Oct 02 - 07:40 AM

Thought this might be of interest
Way back in the mists of this thread was some talk about "a trickle of cd-rs" from cm. I went through my cd's and found that sure enough i'd bought one. It was from a high street store so i wrote and complained. They were good enough to compensate me even though it was over a year ago and i had lost my reciept. Perhaps an indication of how seriously they take this sort of thing. They now "no longer deal with this distributor"

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest, Eddie
Date: 05 Oct 02 - 12:04 PM

I hear that Sharpley has been busted and could find himself in the slammer. Anyone gotten better information? Is Bulmer in the frame with him?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Tony, Leeds
Date: 11 Nov 02 - 02:41 PM

I was told today that Neil Sharpley is to appear in front of the Lincoln Crown Court on Thursday 12th December 2002 where he will be formally indicted with two separate charges of deception. These are serious charges that carry a maximum of 10 years prison if convicted. I hope that this information is of some comfort to you, Eddie. As far as Bulmer goes my information is that his companies are all but broke and there are several creditors who may be issuing Winding Up petitions. If Neil Sharpley goes to prison its possible that Bulmer may himself be on his own to face "interest" from many parties including Trading Standards who I am also told are compiling evidence of the royalty scams and copyright infingements that CM are known to have been up to. I guess Sharpley will have to be the fall guy, won't he Dave?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Gerry.
Date: 12 Nov 02 - 09:08 AM

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie
Date: 21 Nov 02 - 05:03 AM

Geryy, what's keeping you from your message?? Also, Pat Cooksey - what's happening? Any news in your case against Bulmer?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:29 AM

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Gerry.
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:33 AM

Sorry about previous failed post, I hear that Pat Cooksey and
others have a lawyer dealing with Celtic Music and are making
some progress.
The Performing Rights Society are also investigating copywright
infringements on several of Pat's songs by other artists and
record companies.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie D
Date: 24 Dec 02 - 01:50 PM

I check this page out every so often and its seems that interest in Mr Bulmer is on the wane. Surely not - there was so much "critical" interest in his activities it can't all have come to a full stop? Perhaps he's paid the royalties he owes? Could he have said sorry to all those artists he has damaged over the years? Has he joined the Pete Coe band?   How 'bout you Pat, any news on your case? I'd love to hear.
Have a great Christmas to all.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: OBM
Date: 24 Dec 02 - 03:08 PM

I don't know if interest in DB is waning - I for one hope not - but his partner is very much in the news in the UK.

The following appeared in the Lincolnshire Echo newspaper on December 20th:

"Coroner case

LOUTH: Former Louth coroner Neil Sharpley appears before Lincoln Crown Court today facing charges of dishonesty.

Sharpley (51) of Westgate, Louth, is accused of dishonestly obtaining a money transfer of £25,000 from John Lewis by deception.

Sharpley, who is currently on bail, is expected to enter a plea to the charges today."

It's easy to keep a track on this one - point your browser at www.thisislouth.co.uk and enter 'Sharpley' in the search box, and this and previous court appearances are listed.

A very happy Christmas and a terrific 2003 to all!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Peter from Essex
Date: 24 Dec 02 - 04:36 PM

This is Louth

Should have appeared at the Crown Court on December 11 but I can't find any coverage

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: paulo
Date: 25 Dec 02 - 01:54 PM

But don't forget, Bulmer was a canny box player.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Mac Tattie
Date: 26 Dec 02 - 01:11 PM

Yeah, but it was piano accordion he played. cheers

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,John.
Date: 26 Dec 02 - 01:21 PM

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,John.
Date: 26 Dec 02 - 01:38 PM

Neil Sharpley was facing two counts of fraudulently obtaining
money, in total nearly 50.000 pounds, to finance his music
companies.
Last July he was fined 5.500 pounds plus costs, also for fraud.
Court cases are also pending against P.R. Records, another of
Bulmer and Sharpley's companies, and also Celtic Music.
The North Yorkshire Fraud Squad are also aware of Bulmer's
activities.
Slowly the wheel turns.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Catchee Monkee
Date: 26 Dec 02 - 06:10 PM

Dear Guest Eddie D....
Rest assured, nothing has been forgotten....or, forgiven..
Just watching with interest as the situation unfolds.
Very best wishes to all in 2003. (may be a couple of exceptions to that!)

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,cute alias here
Date: 26 Dec 02 - 07:54 PM

Does anyone know if Bulmer has anything to do with 'Castle Communications'? I just recently purchased a CD called "Folk Legends". It has quite a few tracks by Burt Jansch, John Renbourne, Ian Campbell, Gerry Rafferty, Ralph Mctell, Hamish Imlach, the Spinners etc.

It's definitely NOT these artists at their best, and it got me to wondering whether they are getting royalties and had any say in what was released. Any thoughts?

CAH

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: OBM
Date: 26 Dec 02 - 08:43 PM

I've never heard of Castle Communications, so just had a quick trawl around and found out something about them. They apparently have the rights to a lot of old Transatlantic recordings - presumably where your recent purchase originated - as well as lots of other stuff. There's nothing to indicate that our good friend, ace accordionist and philanthropist is involved. Point your browser at http://www.progressor.net/articles/castle.html to learn more...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie D
Date: 27 Dec 02 - 03:49 AM

Well it seems that there is still some interest in the great accordianist and his fiddler pal - what a relief! I was interested in John's information that Sharpley was fined £5000 for fraud offences in July. Any more details on this one John as I can't find anything about it? An earlier correspondent said that Sharpley faced two charges of criminal deception but now it seems as if it's only one for £25,000. Does anyone know what's really going on? Please tell. Does anyone know what happened to Mr Sharpley at his proposed appearance on 12 December at Lincoln Crown Court. Did the great oily one managed to slip free again?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: OBM
Date: 27 Dec 02 - 11:40 AM

I too would like to know more about the fines last July - there's no mention of it that I can see in the Lincolnshire Echo. The current situation seems to be that the crown court appearance in Lincoln was postponed from December 12 until the 20 when a plea was due to be entered. I keep checking the paper's site but there is no new information since the 20th.

This could well be a very happy new year!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Gerry.
Date: 27 Dec 02 - 11:53 AM

Sharpleys latest dishonesty cases have been on the go since July, in
his former capacity as Coroner i'm sure he knows everyone in the
court, there are two charges by the way, one involving 25,000, and
the other 22,000, probably postponed again in the spirit of
Christmas.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Harry Basnett
Date: 28 Dec 02 - 11:48 AM

Nothing's forgotten...nothing is ever forgotten....

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: John Routledge
Date: 28 Dec 02 - 11:54 AM

Lack of a speedy satisfactory conclusion does not automatically mean lack of interest.

This is English Law at work after all:0)

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie D.
Date: 31 Dec 02 - 03:21 AM

I'm sure that everyone who has taken an interest in Mr Bulmer and his curious business methods in 2002 will, at this time of year, wish very sincerely with me that he gets what he truly deserves in 2003. What goes round comes round and surely it must be the turn of Mr Bulmer and his scribe Mr Sharpley? For everyone else, have a great time and may 2003 bring you all the luck in the world( thats especially too for Nick Jones, Pat Cooksey and all the others who have been damaged by the dastardly duo)

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: pavane
Date: 31 Dec 02 - 04:16 AM

Agreed. Mind you, that may not get us much closer to hearing all the 'lost' music.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Dec 02 - 04:22 AM

I think you are right Pavane, the "lost music" is most important.

That said, from what I have read in this saga of threads, I hope 2003 brings some justice. I still find it difficult to imagine (I'm one of the ones who likes to think folk is full of honest people) that folk managed to attract such a pair of what sounds to me like criminals with no conscience.

Jon

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin, I-O-M
Date: 02 Jan 03 - 11:30 AM

Absolutely pavane, but if these two individuals who have done so much to harm Folk Music are brought to book in some way or other, the way may be clear for a claim to be made on the rights to the music which could result in some fabulous new/re-releases. With a civil or even a criminal prosecution successfully mounted against the pair, somebody surely would see a way to obtain the precious copyrights that have been hidden from us for years.   I understand that there are many areas that (Mr Bulmer particularly) are under investigation and of course Sharpley could well go to prison for his acts of criminal deception. Lets hope this time that English Justice for once delivers to him what he is due! To Eddie, I agree, let's hope that 2003 brings to these two "businessmen" all they deserve.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,CelticAnnie
Date: 02 Jan 03 - 11:50 AM

Is it possible that one of the good people 'in the know' here could encapsulate the story in a few sentences. What did Bulmer do that was actually illegal? What artists are involved, and do they ALL feel the same way. I'm not trying to be Devil's advocate here, but I AM curious if the man has any SUPPORTERS in the business. Was he ALWAYS as disliked?

Anne

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Jon H
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 01:01 AM

Hi Anne.
To encapsulate this saga in a few words is hard...but, you did ask!
There once was (late 60's early 70's) a record label in the UK call "Leader" run by a folk music enthusiast (Bill Leader) who, very much against the trend at the time decided to record the best of the new artists around, along with what are referred to as "trad" Musicians (Billy Pigg springs to mind)
After many years, and many fine recordings, his company went bust.
All the product was acquired, eventually. by Mr Bulmer, and Celtic Music.
Since then..(Mid 80's) Most of the recordings of many of the artists have remained unavailable. Apart from a few home made CDR's popping up from time to time.
I don't think that people mind that Mr B owns the tapes. It's just that whenever a CDR of an old tape appears (the most notorious being Bright Phoebus, by Lal and Mike Waterson), no payments seem to be made to the artists concerned.
Whether this is illegal, or not, is for bigger minds than mine to work out, but, I think that a lot of people in the UK, and elsewhere feel that an injustice is being done to performers, who don't exactly earn a fortune anyway, but, have given a lot of pleasure to a lot of people.
As for Mr Sharpley, I know nothing other than I've read here.
But, I don't think I'd trust him to run my pension fund!

Hope the above helps

Best Wishes Jon H.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Shifter
Date: 03 Jan 03 - 10:33 AM

I will say this for Dave Bulmer, we had him at our folk club once and he was a bloody good accordion player (never liked him as a person though!)

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin
Date: 08 Jan 03 - 01:52 PM

Annie, read some of the earlier threads (nos 1 - 3) and you should begin to understand what Mr Bulmer stands for. His activities over many years have destroyed several artistes and his business methods in tandem with his "solicitor" Mr Sharpley have caused ruination for people they have linked up with on a variety of projects. At least two former partners have had domestic properties "cautioned" and it is very obvious that Bulmer is driven by greed. Sharpley, the bag carrier, although now largely discredited and awaiting trial for criminal deception, does as he is told. However, do read all you can Annie and see that not only is unlawfulness on the menu, but simply a boorish and barely concealed attempt to screw everyone they come into contact with. Not often do facts speak for themselves, but in the case of Mr B and Mr S they certainly do.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Gerry.
Date: 08 Jan 03 - 08:28 PM

Word is that Bulmer is issuing threats agaist former partners
and several prominent folkies whom he considers have contributed to
his financial problems, the pot calling the kettle black, one at least faces losing his house as a result of bad advice from
Sharpley.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest: CH
Date: 14 Jan 03 - 06:48 PM

It seems that such is the power of CM that even to be mentioned in passing, even innocently, in these pages is the rocky road to perdition ...

The name Castle Communications seemed somehow familiar, so I set out in search, but it only turned out that I have a Ralph McTell CD from them, no old vinyls.

However, I also did a web search. and found this:
http://www.cafe80s.freeserve.co.uk/lovethis/articles/news23.htm

:-) See what I mean?

But I agree that they don't seem to be related to our two con men though ...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jan 03 - 08:06 PM

Interesting link on Bulmer/Sharpley on uk.music.folk.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Jeri
Date: 14 Jan 03 - 08:18 PM

The mysterious "interesting link" is here: http://mysite.freeserve.com/theclarrion

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin
Date: 15 Jan 03 - 04:29 AM

Had a look at the Clarion site. Excellent stuff! Suggest that anyone with info on these guys should post what they know. As word gets about it's very probable that yet more musicians and others tempted into trusting Bulmer and Sharpley may be warned off. Anyway the new "newsheet" looks promising and so, good luck with it and to whoever is operating it.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Johnny
Date: 15 Jan 03 - 09:30 AM

Well, I went the site and the first thing I wondered who was operating the site. Anyone know?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 16 Jan 03 - 10:30 AM

Information is that Mr Sharpley appeared before the Lincoln Crown Court on Friday 20th December 2002 when he pleaded not guilty to the charge of deception. He was committed for Trial later in the year and the "window" is between April and August 2003. In the meantime I expect he is still doing his "charitable" work and will be looking for funds towards his defence. Watch Out.....there's a Sharpley about!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Nerd
Date: 16 Jan 03 - 03:44 PM

I think Castle owns the Transatlantic catalog. They're a big company, though, representing mostly pop and jazz, and not to my knowledge related to Bulmer. But they have had dodgy dealings themselves. They were fined heavily for "hyping the charts" in the last few years, that is, buying large volumes of their own records in order to get them on the charts. Sneaky, eh?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: treewind
Date: 22 Jan 03 - 04:34 AM

I'm not a bit surprised that the owner of the clarrion site isn't revealing their identity! Before Sharpley was subject to the current restraints he would have sent them some very unwelcome correspondence, and even now CM might attempt to take action for libel if they can prove any of it's not true or defamation if they can't, or make life unpleasant in other ways.

The people with most detailed knowledge about CM's shady dealings are the ones who were directly involved. Just as Pat Cooksey can't reveal a lot of detail because it might prejudice his current lawsuit, there are similar reasons why others aren't going to say too much in case it prejudices any future opportunity for legal action. And while CM own the publication rights to various recordings they have a certain amount of power.

If Dave Bulmer were, as a result of prosecution for his business irregularities, forced to relinquish his ownership of CM and the artists got their music and rights back, only then I think we might hear a bit more...

Anahata

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin, I-O-M
Date: 23 Jan 03 - 03:23 AM

I think you may be correct, Treewind, except that what I read on The Clarion seems to be information that is really in the public domain already. I share your view that Sharpley would have commenced action before now other than for the fact he is technically unable to mount legal action as a solicitor, but more importantly because it would appear that the contents are correct and not libelous. I am certain that Bulmer must be champing at the bit for action but even he must realise by now that the game is nearly up and the more he protests the worse the end result will be for him. From everything I have seen written about these two, it can only be a matter of time before one or other, or both, will face serious criminal charges quite aside from those now facing Neil Sharpley. I have researched into copyright irregularities and note that there are quite serious issues for infringement that can result in heavy fines and/or prison. The sheer weight of ever increasing evidence against Mr B and Mr S must surely be giving them cause for poor sleep! The Pat Cooksey case may well open the floodgates and others will then be able to go in "on the coat tails". With Mr Sharpley very liable to be sent to prison for criminal deception (taking into account his then status as a solicitor/coroner) Mr Bulmer will then be exposed and it will be interesting to see with what grace the once mighty entrepreneur concedes defeat. We shall see. It cannot be too long now.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: winterchild
Date: 23 Jan 03 - 04:05 AM

I recall a discussion back in '00 about a person, whose name I've forgotten, who was "sitting on" (owning but not releasing) a large selection of artists' recordings and copyrights - some from the 60's and 70's - the feelings were understandably quite bitter and frustrated. Would that have been this Bulmer fellow, or are there others like him out there?

WinterC

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Nerd
Date: 23 Jan 03 - 12:02 PM

Probably the same, WinterC. We've been babbling on about Dave B for years!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: winterchild
Date: 26 Jan 03 - 11:38 PM

Well, and no wonder!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 27 Jan 03 - 11:38 AM

Winterchild....Read all the threads and weep..
Why do you think that 90% of contributors to this thread are Guests??
I Don't care....The two of them are sharks of the worst order (No offence to real sharks , of course, who are lovely, if a bit wet!!)
Come uppance beckons..
Cheers
Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 27 Jan 03 - 12:24 PM

I hope that you are right, Ralphie, and that justice and or retribution is meeted out on these two quickly. To WinterC, I hope that you did read the threads and have seen that Mr Sharpley and Mr Bulmer represent the worst of the music buisness in Britain. They are a disgrace and the damage that they have done to our beloved music defies calculation.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 27 Jan 03 - 08:23 PM

Andy...IOM
A pleasure to read your musings re the situation..
One day I'll shake you by the hand and we'll drink a good health to all the people who've been hurt by this whole sorry tale, (when that happy day finally dawns). And we will also remember those that didn't live long enough to see the day.
A peaceful New Year to you and yours.
Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 27 Jan 03 - 08:50 PM

Oh...and in the interest of not offending anybody.
All the other "GUEST" postings have been fascinating too...I just wonder if there any Celtic Music supporters included in that list of GUESTS...?
I would caution all contributors to this thread, not to say more than is wise. I just have a feeling that wounded animals tend to lash out.
Particularly when they feel that there is nowhere left to turn.
I honestly wish that they would just give up soon.....they can't win, and will only cause more pain.
Yours, more in sadness than pleasure
Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Pandora Box
Date: 03 Feb 03 - 01:12 PM

This should interest followers of Mr Sharpley. The only thing that puzzles me is why the good folk of Louth cannot work out what happened to their money!

http://www.louthtoday.co.uk/fullstory.asp?storyid=1

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Noreen
Date: 03 Feb 03 - 05:25 PM

http://www.louthtoday.co.uk/fullstory.asp?storyid=1

Mr Sharpley, the only remaining trustee, has said he is still trying to salvage the project.

Right, yeah....

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest.
Date: 03 Feb 03 - 06:15 PM

This guy Sharpleys a real artist, trustee!!!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,David
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 10:46 AM

just came across this whole saga today. i hope Bulmer'll get his come uppance. always thought he was a highly slimy and dodgy character. but then again, it is the record industry, scheming bastard company directors ripping off naive artists.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 26 Feb 03 - 12:49 PM

Nice to hear from you David. If you think Bulmers a "highly slimy and dodgy character" go on to enjoy reading about the disgraceful Mr Sharpley. The two are thoroughly dishonest any way you care to examine them and their business practices. It looks as though Mr Sharpley after stealing from trusts in which he, in his capacity of solicitor, was an executor, will hopefully be looking now at several years inside. It is probable also that Bulmer will face charges very soon and with any luck could, himself, be behind bars which is exactly where he belongs. The problem is what will happen to the copyrights and recordings that they have puloined over the years? Anyone have any ideas?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: winterchild
Date: 02 Mar 03 - 02:07 AM

Anything new on the Sharpley/Bulmer/Celtic Music saga?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie in Leeds
Date: 03 Mar 03 - 12:01 PM

Don't know much about Celtic although you can bet that someone is being screwed.   Bulmer continues to sell CD Roms as production CD's whilst the infamous Sharpley is due to appear at Leicester Crown Court on 8th May this year as part of the ongoing police prosecution. It seems also that at least another two people he has damaged (whilst as a "solicitor") are now sueing him for various malpractice. The good news is that these problems must by now be causing even him to loose sleep at night. Or perhaps not.....

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie in Leeds
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 04:30 AM

News has reached me that Mr Sharpley and his business partner, Mr Bulmer, are again embarking on legal action against another prominent Scottish folk musician. When will these bully boys stop this crusade against the very musicians that have given them their wealth? Let it be an object lesson to anyone thinking about dealing with the pair of them - in the end you will be screwed.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Richard L
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 09:35 AM

This has been going on for so long, I have to conclude that there may well be another side to the story. At least more than has been discussed at Mudcat. Messrs. Sharpley and Bulmer have been accused of a great deal of offensive behaviour, but apparently wake up every day, go about their business, play music (at least one of them) collect strange things, presumably hoist a few at the pub, sue (unamed) Scottish musicians, release recordings, and in general, enjoy life. When this series of Mudcat threads started, I was expecting to be reading about prison visiting hours (for sympathetic relatives) rather than each time one of the principals got a parking ticket.

Is this whole thing (these threads) simply a tempest in the folkie teapot, or has anything illegal actually transpired? Will we still be reading about this in halting increments a year from now? I don't have any direct connection with anyone involved, but have dealt with record company owners, hence my interest.

Richard L

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 01 Apr 03 - 06:32 PM

Guest Richard L..
Thank you for your thoughts.
The wheels of the judiciary grind exceedingly slowly, but, grind they will.
One day, my friend, One day.....
Kind Regards Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest (CH)
Date: 15 Apr 03 - 06:16 PM

Was browsing around Barbara Dickson's site recently, www.barbaradickson.net, trying to locate a classic album called "From The Beggars' Mantle" and found this page:
        http://www.barbaradickson.net/discography_albums.html

Quote:
"1971 : FROM THE BEGGARS MANTLE...FRINGED WITH GOLD (Decca) LP only
Reissued by Celtic Music in 1985 on LP and cassette, and by Music By
Mail on CD (mail order only) in 2002"

So I searched for +"Music By Mail" +"Barbara Dickson" and found this:

Barbara Dickson.net - News - ... and is available by mail order only via Music By Mail at PO Box 182, Harrogate, North Yorkshire HG2 7XD. (Many thanks to Rob at the Barbara Dickson Shrine chat ...
www.barbaradickson.net/news.html    [More Results from www.barbaradickson.net]

The page linked is different now but note the address - another CD-R venture? Does Barbara get royalties? Presumably, 'cos why else would she link it? Does she know and/or care whether they're CD-Rs?

Dunno what to make of this ...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Gerry.
Date: 15 Apr 03 - 08:39 PM

Celtic Music, Bulmer and Sharpley, OWN the rights to this and many
other back catalogues, and are perfectly within their rights to
re- issue them all under whatever format they chose.
This company has long traded beyond the bounds of decency, and as they are in serious need of quick money the views of those on this
and other forums concern them not.
Incerdible as it may seem 99 per cent of the music buying public
have never heard of the Mudcat Cafe or other forums and care little
about the rights of the artists in question, if people want to buy
these C.D's. C.D.R's or whatever they will do so, and Bulmer and
Sharpley will continue to pocket the money with a barely surpressed
chuckle.
Clan Alba, the Dransfields, the Watersons, Nic Jones, are all freely
available from this company, and others will follow.
No amount of waffling here will prevent this.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Peterr
Date: 16 Apr 03 - 11:54 AM

Website linked by jeri in January is no longer available, I have just discovered. I was completely ignorant of the whole saga, but find it morbidly fascinating, esp Ralphie's heartfelt comments.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 16 Apr 03 - 07:45 PM

Peterrrrrrr!!! (How Many R's?!!)

Kind Thanks from me for your thoughts.
We are all just little people out here, and as GUEST Gerry quite rightly points out, who the Fuck has heard of Mudcat anyway?
No matter....
An injustice, is just that.

Happy Easter dear readers

Regards Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 16 Apr 03 - 07:53 PM

Oh, and on a related point.
The kind people at Fellside records have just sent me the Martyn Whyndham Read double CD "Song Links".
Over and above the wonderful versions of lots of the songs that we all know and love performed by some righteous people, It includes what I presume to be the last recording by Tony Rose..."Sweet Jenny of the Moor"
Shame that Tony didn't live long enough to regain the rights of his own recordings......Guess who denied him?

Happy Easter again

Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Mary Humphreys
Date: 16 Apr 03 - 07:59 PM

Ralphie - have faith that good will prevail in the end.
And Happy Eastertide to you & Barbara.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Noreen
Date: 16 Apr 03 - 07:59 PM

And a happy Easter to you too, Ralphie...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Apr 03 - 03:53 AM

Apparently Dave Bulmer lives just down the road from me. Should I ring his doorbell and run away?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 22 Apr 03 - 01:22 PM

Trouble is he has probably got a foul temper and you will probably hear from his "solicitor". But it sounds like fun , so why not?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest: Java Jive
Date: 05 Jun 03 - 08:05 PM

Re someone's earlier post, this site might be of interest:

        http://www.celtic-music.co.uk/index1.htm

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 06 Jun 03 - 10:51 AM

Hey Java...

Thanks for the link, but, as websites go, it leaves a lot to be desired...!

Nuff Said

Regards R xx

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Tony, Leeds
Date: 06 Jun 03 - 02:49 PM

The site is about exactly what you would expect from Mr Bulmer - cheap and out of date.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest: Java Jive
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 04:29 AM

This from James Chokey in uk.music.folk

"""
I've heard that a label called Elegy has recently been re-releasing on
CD a bunch of British folk-rock bands from the 70s, including
Frogmorton, Wooden Horse, Maple Oak, Aubrey Small, and a few others.
"""

Does anyone know, would this be another CM venture, or completely unrelated?

Seems to have gone rather quiet in here ...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin, I-O-M
Date: 06 Jul 03 - 09:26 AM

It does seem to have gone quiet. All interest in this man and his companies cannot be forgotten, surely? A diary note for any of you that might like to see at least one of the ghastly pair gets justice is 29th of September at Leicester Crown Court. The hairpin like former lawyer appears there on criminal charges. Word on the street is he would like as many of you to be there to support him!!!!! Ha bloody ha!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Leo Condie
Date: 18 Jul 03 - 10:07 AM

been any news on this lately? I am reading up on this whole saga with an extremely angry facial expression that seems to turn up whenever i think about the music business.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Ralphie at work (as usual!)
Date: 18 Jul 03 - 03:55 PM

Hi Andy (IOM) and Leo..

No, no updates on the situation, but, thanks for refreshing this thread every now and again.

Nic himself is fine, saw him a few weeks ago, and actually beat him at Pool once!! (he's a devious b*****d sometimes, all this stuff with a walking stick, etc, but put a pool cue in his hand....!!)

Happy Summers to one and all

Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Leo Condie
Date: 18 Jul 03 - 04:30 PM

I just read up on the whole saga today, and it definitely seems to be a hefty scam that our friend mr bulmer is pulling off, though why exactly i can't quite ascertain - surely there's better ways to cheat the law for greasy onesers than to rip off folkies that don't make much as it is! anyway yes, good luck to all involved, and i really hope we can eventually get some proper laws in place to deal with these shysters. like the musicians union, ha...ha...ha...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 18 Jul 03 - 08:50 PM

Oi Leo...
Don't get me started on the MU!
Ralphie

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 19 Jul 03 - 10:23 AM

Hi Leo. Does your Dad have any stuff with him?

Rick

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 19 Jul 03 - 01:53 PM

I must have fallen for one of Bulmer's CD-RWs! Bought a reissue of Ray Fisher's 'Bonnie Birdy' when in Scotland (can't remember where, unfortunately), and only took a closer look when it wouldn't play in my computer: Published by Leader, distributed by CM.

But maybe Mr Bulmer is simply desperate. Someone who'd spoken to him recently told me he was owed a lot of money by a lot of folkies ...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 20 Jul 03 - 04:05 AM

Susanne..

Shouldn't your last sentence be the other way round?!...LOL!

As for Ray's album...Luckily, I've still got the original vinyl...It hasn't corrupted ...Yet!

Regards R

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 21 Jul 03 - 07:07 AM

To Suzanne. I used to know Bulmer well so it comes as no surprise to learn he believes he is owed money by folkies. Of course he believes this as he believes everyone owes him money! He will generate a bewildering assortmnent of incomprehensible paperwork to justify his claims and will, eventually, order the vile Sharpley to commence action - most likely in Great Grimsby County Court. That is how they operate. Beware. By the time Claims are filed (late) and musicians "notified" of the action (very late if at all, the case is as good as won. There are many cases to draw from and I saw Bulmer do these things many times and to his great satisfaction. To him its simply another way of making money, its a game and a game to which he is addicted. I say again, B E W A R E.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 21 Jul 03 - 06:13 PM

Well, Guest - surely not the 'vile Sharpley' the next time? Didn't I hear he's been struck off for offences of his own?

Ralphie, remember to put your glasses on when on Mudcat! I said I was TOLD ... surprised me so much I clean forgot to buy an album by the guys Jordan and Dipper, plus a third (first) one whose name has sadly become the victim of a senior moment on my part :-)

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 03:30 AM

Susanne...Duly noted...!

And I'll even forgive your "Senior Moment"...Not sure that James Patterson will though (the 3rd member of what is now being referred to as "New Variant PJD")...
Should have got your copy when it was hot...waiting for a repress at the mo,

Cheers R

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: treewind
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 04:34 AM

Hey Ralphie - Sold out already?
Well done chaps!!!

Anahata
(we've shifted 25 so far, not doing too badly)

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Ralphie
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 04:35 AM

Oi A..

Will you stop plugging. LOL!
And, where's my copy?
R

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Jul 03 - 08:33 AM

Suzanne. Sure he's been struck off but apparently it has not stopped his activities for Bulmer not one jot! The pair carry on as if nothing has happened and nothing can stop them although perhaps Mr Sharpley's appointment at the Leicester Crown Court shortly may have the effect that so many of us pray for.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 23 Jul 03 - 08:45 PM

Thanks Ralphie for setting my mind at rest. And no disrespect intended to Mr Patterson!

Thanks Guest - how this is possible is beyond me. It's not the way we do things here in Germany ...

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jul 03 - 04:32 AM

To Suzanne. It shouldn't happen in the UK either! Sharpley appears before a court or tribunal in one area and gets a knuckle rapping and a "telling off" and is able, next day figuratively speaking, to go to another court and make hell for a folkie musician. There is nothing "joined up" in the UK legal system and that is why Sharpley (as Bulmers bag carrier) is able to appear in courts as if nothing has happened to him. It must surely have come to the stage where a disgraced lawyer is required to disclose his status to the court particularly where he uses his former skills in an attempt to damage others. Naive perhaps but the deficiencies in the UK legal system have enabled Bulmer and Sharpley to scythe through all channels of decent business behaviour. If you think I'm wrong, simply refer to nearly all of their former business and music acquaintances - it's unlikely that a good word will be heard in their favour.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: red max
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 05:10 AM

I think it's shameful that so many people are expressing very personal opinions about a bloke they don't really know. With that in mind I'm hereby providing some more specific information from a friend of mine that actually used to work for him. And I quote...

"Knowing him personally, I can confirm that he has absolutely no redeeming qualities, and is in fact an utter bastard! I enjoyed the work I did at CM, but hated Dave. Glad to hear that he is now almost universally hated....couldn't happen to a nicer bloke!"

So there you are, heh heh!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Leo Condie
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 10:18 AM

Rick: he doesn't, thankfully, but seemed suitably shocked when i told him about the whole thing. All his stuff (all one album!) is on his own label.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: baur325
Date: 12 Aug 03 - 12:26 PM

http://www.louthchamberofbusiness.org.uk/members1.php

check out the above for amusement and click on "Marker", see if you can guess who that is?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Max
Date: 12 Aug 03 - 12:33 PM

No, shewerly not. Not the great ingrate, the debagged, defrocked legal nobody Sharpley? I think we should be told - and also the good folk of Louth.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: baur325
Date: 12 Aug 03 - 12:46 PM

for more fun see this

http://www.mudcat.org/detail.cfm?messages__Message_ID=1000915

well I reckon the chamber of business already know who it is.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie in Leeds
Date: 13 Aug 03 - 11:10 AM

It is totally astonishing. The man has no shame whatsoever. Don't know who the Stone Network are, but they sound "legit" yet how can they be if they have appointed a crooked legal agent to act for them? Having ripped off several of his personal clients, I wonder if he's found a new way of making money now that the Bulmer route to riches must be on its last legs. What a pair!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: baur325
Date: 14 Aug 03 - 04:24 AM

I think it is legit too, but it was the righteous tone of the copyright message that bemused me, especially in the circs. See his MARKER message on the Louth Chamber of Business site for sheer brass neck.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: baur325
Date: 14 Aug 03 - 04:29 AM

Mr. S does have another source of income. He has been clamping cars! No joke.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Eddie
Date: 14 Aug 03 - 06:08 AM

Well...... after that, what? Perhaps recycling ice creams nicked from unsuspecting kiddies. I will watch with great interest how the defrocked one continues to climb the ladder of commerce.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Sep 03 - 09:30 AM

see latest on clamping in "Neil Sharpley-Any News" thread. Isn't it time to start part 5?

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 29 Sep 03 - 11:57 PM

CORONER IN FRAUD TRIAL


10:30 - 29 September 2003

Former Louth coroner Neil Sharpley was due in court today accused of deception charges involving £47,000.

Sharpley (52), of Westgate, Louth, faces a charge of obtaining £25,000 from John Lewis in February 1997.

He faces a similar charge of deception involving £22,000 obtained from John Lewis in May 1997.

Both charges relate to money allegedly obtained to finance a music business.

Sharpley has denied both charges and was due to go trial at Leicester Crown Court.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 08:55 AM

EX-CORONER DENIES CHARGES


10:30 - 30 September 2003

Louth: The town's former coroner has denied deception charges involving a total of £47,000.

Neil Sharpley of Westgate, Louth, appeared in court yesterday and pleaded not guilty to a charge of obtaining £25,000 from John Lewis in February 1997.

The 52-year-old has also denied a similar charge of deception involving £22,000, which was also obtained from Mr Lewis, in May 1997.

Leicester Crown Court was today hearing legal arguments and a trial jury is expected to be sworn in later this week.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: baur325
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 10:12 AM

check out the result on the thread "Neil Sharpley-any news"

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 12:16 PM

John Lewis! Mr Lewis!? LoL

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Lien
Date: 03 Oct 03 - 05:49 AM

DECEPTION CHARGES DROPPED BEFORE TRIAL


10:30 - 02 October 2003

A Former coroner and solicitor accused of deception offences has walked free from court after the charges against him were thrown out.

Neil Sharpley (52), who was once the coroner for Louth, was alleged to have obtained £47,000 from a client's estate and used it for his own purposes. He had been due to stand trial at Leicester Crown Court this week.

But the proceedings did not reach the stage of swearing in a jury to hear the case.

After three days of legal argument Judge Ian Collis ruled that Mr Sharpley could not receive a fair trial due to an "abuse of process" in bringing the case to court.

Abuse of process is deemed to have taken place when something is judged to be so unfair or wrong with the prosecution that the case cannot continue.

The individual facts of each case are considered when deciding if the method used to bring the case to court was unfair.

Mr Sharpley, of Westgate, Louth, had denied two offences of obtaining a money transfer by deception from his client John Lewis between February and June 1997.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Lancashire Lad
Date: 14 Dec 03 - 06:51 AM

I've just spent an hour or so looking through all the previous posts on DB and Celtic music etc. A couple of things spring to mind

CDRs
CM are not the only people pressing music on CDR these days. Many small to medium sized operations are now switching to CDR production, as this is the only economic way to handle a large catalogue given the costs of pre production, glass masters, etc. If you handle a catalogue of a few hundred titles, many of which are not the fastest selling titles in the world, it makes sense to utilse CDR and press "on demand" rather than tying up a vast amount of money on a large number of titles. I predict that within the next couple of years, many many more labels will be forced to run CDRs as standard, just to keep going.
Regarding CDR quality: Providing care is taken, there is no reason why CDRs cannot be as good as "regular" CDs. As I'm sure you know, many artists release their own music in CDR format and I personally have a large number of these in my own collection and regularly listen to them with no complaint.

Companies "sitting on" back catalogue
Surely DB is not alone in this. I would personally love Paul Adams of Fellside to re-issue the complete back catalogue of the Tradition label, which he bought a few years ago. However for whatever reason (probably commercial) he has barely touched it as yet. come to think of it, there are many fine albums that were released on vinyl by Fellside, but as yet have not been re-issued. The same also applies to Topic and most other "folk" labels. They will usually only re-issue back catalogue albums if they think they can make a profit from it. We have to remember, these are businesses, not charities. DB in this respect is no different from them.

Accounting / royalties / etc
EVERY record company should make sure that artists are paid what is owed to them. If they don't, they desrve their arses kicking. If there is a problem in artists vs Record labels, surely this is where bodies such as PRS, ASCAP should intervene.

Anyway, thats just a couple of thoughts.
Happy Christmas to all

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Dec 03 - 11:50 AM

Well said, Lancashire Lad. Your post is well informed. You are obviously knowledgeable enough about the folk music industry to know many of the arguments put forth here are red herrings, put forth to poison the well.

However, that isn't likely to prevent the anti-Bulmer cult from foaming at the mouth about you possibly being Bulmer's wife, or attempting to crucify you for heresy and non-conformance with the Word of Ralphie and the Church of Dick G.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Dec 03 - 06:01 AM

There are many in this world who work on the principle that the people to whom you owe money can't afford to sue.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Dec 03 - 08:06 AM

And there is many a musician who is too much of a skint to hire a proper solicitor to review their contracts before they sign.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 16 Dec 03 - 12:54 PM

I am an artist who was well and truly screwed by Mr Bulmer and Mr Sharpley over many years. It's not a question of being too mean to pay for a solicitor to check the contracts and in CM's case, Bulmer's method is to befriend you as a fellow folkie. You get lulled by the crap he promises - even musicians are human you know - and then you are offered a great contract prepared by another musician - the awful Sharpley. Bulmer even came to my home and I seriously thought that he was an honest man. How wrong I was. I later learned from a friend also in the business that Bulmer had bragged to him about how he had stolen records from the floor of a distributor he visited while the mans back was turned. What a guy. No wonder the MU stated that they "have had more complaints about the business methods of DB than anyone else". The man simply has no morals and should be avoided at all costs and the quicker he is brought to book the better for everyone - certainly those like me who have suffered fiancially as a direct result of him and Sharpley.It's the season of goggwill and all that but strangely I doubt if that pair will receive too many good wishes for the season. To everyone else, have a Happy Chistmas.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Dec 03 - 12:59 PM

Sorry, for googwill read goodwill - bloody finger trouble again!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Lancashire lad
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 09:37 AM

Hi all
Sorry for playing the devils advocate here, but if DB is such a ****, then why do so many people still deal with him. I'm not just talking about artists, but also other "reputable" labels such as Topic?

Also, on a bit of a tangent. Does anyone know about artists who owe DB / CM money? I certainly know of 2 artists who do (they will remain nameless). However it is unlikely they will ever pay unless "forced" to do so. ie by court action.

Just a thought

Happy Christmas

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Lien
Date: 23 Dec 03 - 10:33 AM

I think you will find that fewer and fewer artists deal with Bulmer. Word is now well and truly out that to do so is leaving yourself wide open to being taken to the cleaners. I have a feeling also that if any money was actually owed to CM / DB court action would be in place as surely as day follows night. It is inconceivable that the struck-off former solicitor would have changed the habits of a lifetime. Quite why Topic should deal still with these crooks is unclear but I am certain that CREDIT trading is not an issue!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: treewind
Date: 23 Dec 03 - 12:47 PM

They certainly won't if they're Musicians Union members. He's listed in the MU magagzine's "Special Notices" section in every issue.

Anahata

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Lancashire Lad
Date: 25 Dec 03 - 10:37 AM

I've bought many albums on the Topic label over the last 20 years or so. However, in recent years many that I have purchased have either contained a sticker from CM Distribution or a "card" for CM's mail order side. some of these purchases have come from "real" shops (independent and chains) or from UK online sellers. This obviously suggests that many dealers are happy to buy Topic products direct from CM or its distribution company.
Ive also bought CDs from Beautiful Jo, Fuse, Transatlantic and others which indicate they are sourced from or sold via CM. Again I ask, If DB is so disreputable, why are these labels deaing with him on a regular basis and on a long term basis. Surely these peop[le are well aware of the furore surrounding DB?? They obviously havent had the problems others claim to have had.

Happy Christmas

PS One of the most recent Topic albums I bought that seems to have come via CM was Bob Fox - Borrowed Moments....Have others heard it? Possibly my contender for album of the year 2004

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin, I-O-M
Date: 26 Dec 03 - 04:16 AM

Don't be misled by stickers and cards in Topic Records. If you check the Topic site (www.topicrecords.co.uk) you will see that nowhere is CM Distribution referred to. The official distributor seems to be Proper Records Distribution of Beckenham, Kent. I imagine that in order to maintain some credibility in the folk record industry, CM has simply purchased from Proper and added their own info to the packaging - a common practice as anyone buying imports will know. Don't know anything about Proper Records Distribution but I guess they are on a hiding to nothing if they have made the msitake of giving credit terms to CM - watch this space! What might be more important to consider is that it is very possible that new artists/records companies deal with CM once, but how many do it for a second time???? Once bitten, twice shy and all that!

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Dec 03 - 11:15 AM

Proper Distribution are a huge operation that are not about to be put into any serious trouble by the likes of CM.

All the major folk labels go through Proper, who sell to the high street shops. This is how Topic, Fellside and (since August) Wild Goose and the like get their product into places like HMV stores.

Anahata

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin
Date: 26 Dec 03 - 12:50 PM

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin, I-O-M
Date: 26 Dec 03 - 12:54 PM

Well that confirms what I thought. CM simply purchase from Proper using them as a One Stop thus avoiding commitment to artists etc and thereby enabling them to keep their company name visible by inserting cards etc. No, earlier GUEST, it is very unlikely that any reputable record company and equally unlikely that any established artist would choose to do business with Mr Bulmer and CM. It will be interesting to see CM's accounts when they are released to see just how succesful it has been in the last 12 months or so.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Lancashire Lad
Date: 27 Dec 03 - 06:35 PM

This seems very odd to me. I bought 2 Topic albums from a well known chain within a month of release. Both had CM cards (actually Music by Mail which is a CM company) inside. I cant believe CM would go to the trouble and expense of buying CDs from a distributor such as Proper then sell them on to HMV. The price you pay from a distributor for most new full price CDs is aprox £7 - £8 plus VAT. Would CM actually pay this amount to sell at a similar price to the shops. Somehow I don't think so.

I checked with a friend who works at HMV. He says they certainly order many titles on assorted labels from CM. Apparently many labels use more than one distributor! He says they buy "product" (his term not mine) from CM and even gave me some pof the labels they have bought from DBs company. These have included include Topic, Fuse, Fellside, Making Waves, Edsel, Wooden Hill as well as labels CM or DB owns such as Trailer, Leader, Black Crow, etc.

I'm sorry if this goes against the general opinion, but I say again: If all these reputable labels and businesses are prepared to deal with CM on a long term basis, then he must be doing something right.

Anyway..time for bed

all the best and happy new year

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 27 Dec 03 - 06:43 PM

You are confusing the record company with the distribution company. Although they are presumably owned by more or less the same people, they are entirely separate legal entities.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Andy, Port Erin, I-O-M
Date: 28 Dec 03 - 03:37 AM

I am certain that Fellside, for instance, would not deal with Bulmer. As for a sub-distributor paying the same price as others for "product", this is not so. There are deals and deals within deals and there is little doubt that CM has a "file discount" (as its known) from the head distributor.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: GUEST,Tony, Leeds
Date: 04 Jan 04 - 01:02 PM

Any news on how your legal case against CM is going, Pat Cooksey? We haven't heard from you for quite a while.

Subject: RE: Celtic Music Dave Bulmer (4)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 27 Feb 04 - 05:14 PM

A Plea for Some Sort of Clarification

As I (perhaps poorly) understand it, Celtic Music has done three bad things"

A. They sat on some titles (notably Nic Jones) and refused to release them, doing financial harm to the artists.

B. They (allegedly) have not paid royalties to the artists on thr few CDs they have released.

C. They have released CD-Rs without notifying anyone that they're nor properly pressed CDs.



Could someone tell me if I'm reading this correctly? The reason I ask is that CM has recently released a small flood of excellent previously-unavailable CDs, and I'd like to make this very fine music available to my customers. Objection "A" clearly doen't apply here. As far as "B" is concerned, I'd be grateful if any artists whose work has been released would let me know if they are receiving royalties; if they're not, I can probably make some arrangement where I'll pay the royalties to them directly. As for "C" it is as it is; I'll make no secret about whether they're CD-R's or not, but I'd like to point out that any CDs (or CD-Rs) I sell come with a lifetime (probably mine) warranty.

I'd really like to help make this music available. What think you?