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BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid

Ed T 02 Jun 10 - 10:31 AM
McGrath of Harlow 02 Jun 10 - 10:36 AM
Ed T 02 Jun 10 - 10:39 AM
Ed T 02 Jun 10 - 10:42 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 02 Jun 10 - 10:59 AM
Bonzo3legs 02 Jun 10 - 11:01 AM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 11:03 AM
Emma B 02 Jun 10 - 11:19 AM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 11:22 AM
Greg F. 02 Jun 10 - 11:44 AM
mousethief 02 Jun 10 - 11:53 AM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 02 Jun 10 - 11:59 AM
greg stephens 02 Jun 10 - 12:16 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 12:25 PM
beardedbruce 02 Jun 10 - 12:46 PM
Royston 02 Jun 10 - 12:54 PM
beardedbruce 02 Jun 10 - 01:04 PM
Arthur_itus 02 Jun 10 - 01:04 PM
beardedbruce 02 Jun 10 - 01:04 PM
Lox 02 Jun 10 - 01:09 PM
mousethief 02 Jun 10 - 01:13 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 01:16 PM
Greg F. 02 Jun 10 - 01:38 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 02 Jun 10 - 02:16 PM
EBarnacle 02 Jun 10 - 03:15 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 03:19 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 03:22 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 03:31 PM
Lox 02 Jun 10 - 03:32 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 03:35 PM
Penny S. 02 Jun 10 - 04:07 PM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 02 Jun 10 - 04:36 PM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 02 Jun 10 - 04:40 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 05:10 PM
Paul Burke 02 Jun 10 - 05:31 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 05:36 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 05:59 PM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 02 Jun 10 - 06:24 PM
Crow Sister (off with the fairies) 02 Jun 10 - 06:31 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 06:35 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 10:42 PM
mousethief 02 Jun 10 - 11:34 PM
Bobert 02 Jun 10 - 11:34 PM
CarolC 02 Jun 10 - 11:42 PM
mousethief 03 Jun 10 - 12:08 AM
CarolC 03 Jun 10 - 12:27 AM
CarolC 03 Jun 10 - 01:09 AM
CarolC 03 Jun 10 - 01:17 AM
Jim Carroll 03 Jun 10 - 03:29 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 03 Jun 10 - 05:34 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 10:31 AM

"The Canadian Association of Journalists and the Quebec Federation of Professional Journalists have denounced actions of Canwest Global (Calgary Herald owner) as "a disturbing pattern of censorship and repression of dissenting views" and called for a parliamentary inquiry"

Of course I meant where and when did these two Canadian organizations say that, not USA folks....(about an organization that owns a lot of stuff, not the newspaper itself). BTW, these two organizations represents and advocates for its journalist members. Their main issues with Canwest Global is that they concentrate ownership and lay off reporters, so they don't like them....as is happening with most world media sources....including in the USA and the UK.


By the way, Canwest has recently been restructured and it's TV and newspaper and online-publishing assets are separately up for sale, if any of you folks have an interest?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 10:36 AM

When a ship is boarded by pirates the crew and passengers have every legal right to use whatever they have to hand to defend themselves.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 10:39 AM

"Oh dear, EdT, you're really struggling to find some sort of justification there. I suppose you'd be happy for armed troops to burst into your house and kill your family just because you happened to have a pair of scissors lying around. Don't be such a complete plonker".

No plonking or struggle, to reach common sense, (I know it is a misnomer) on my part. No, I would not take up a knife or other weapon ( or what could be seen as a weapon) against police nor the military...on or off duty. Mainly because I have seen first hand what can happen and because I do not believe confronting these folks with weapons of any type is ever wise. I call it common sense and a desire for survival. You may call it something else...as I am sure you will:)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Ed T
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 10:42 AM

"When a ship is boarded by pirates the crew and passengers have every legal right to use whatever they have to hand to defend themselves"

Maybe so, though it seems very stupid to me, as it can lead to your injury or death.

And, there is the disagreement about the legality of this (and other) naval blockade, that I suspect will not be sorted out on mudcat.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 10:59 AM

"My views are my own and I am NOT some kind of reverse hasbaranik with repetition compulsion."

I wasn't aware of the Israeli government initiative to flood the media with pro-Israeli propaganda via the mouths of volunteers. They tell these fake "bloggers" what to say, and even provide them with suitable YouTube clips and everything. It's all pretty 'Eeew'. We know we can't always trust the media for impartiality, but this state orchestrated barrage of propaganda hiding behind a front of fraudulent "bloggers" feels much more cynical and insideous.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:01 AM

Activists are just troublemakers - they knew what they were going into.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:03 AM

Despite claims that those on board were only prepared to resist peacefully, when Israeli military tried to board Marmara, they were resisted and attacked by many onboard, precipitating the resulting actions.

Except that the Israelis started shooting before anyone had a chance to resist, which makes it a war crime.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Emma B
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:19 AM

Ed - answer mark 2
- not totally relevent to the thread but certainly indicates the bias of reporting in a section of the Canadian media and how any report of the attack upon the flotilla might just be not entirely 'objective'

A website devoted to cross-media ownership, convergence & concentration in Canada has published a 'time line' about the formation of CanWest Global and its dispute with journalists at The Montreal Gazette in 2001 onwards

Sept. 1 Montreal Gazette publisher Michael Goldbloom quits, cryptically citing differences with CanWest over the direction the chain is taking

November Peggy Curran, TV critic at The Montreal Gazette, writes a column about a CBC documentary about to be aired. The topic is the treatment of journalists in the occupied territories. Her column is first held, then a rewrite is ordered. Curran complies, the amended column runs, but she then gives up her TV-critic spot and goes on a year's leave of absence.

Dec. 5
CanWest announces national editorials to run in all major dailies except one of the two CanWest owns in Vancouver, BC. A mini-insurrection erupts, leading to newsroom turmoil at the Montreal Gazette and the quashing of a byline protest. Editorial Page editor Peter Hadekel asks to be reassigned. His request is granted.

Dec. 11
Fifty-four journalists and other staff at The Montreal Gazette publish an open letter denouncing the national editorial policy as an infringement on freedom of expression. The text runs in Toronto and French-language Montreal newspapers but is not carried, much less mentioned, in any CanWest publication. The protest is covered by Canoe, a web site owned by a rival media operation, Quebecor. Other journalists add their signatures after the fact, bringing the total to 77.

Dec. 14
An "advisory" to unionized staff from Montreal Gazette management warns employees that working there is a privilege, not a right. The gag order warns that employees risk disciplinary action, up to and including dismissal, for sharing the internal goings-on at CanWest with rival media or publicly questioning the motives of management. The Montreal Newspaper Guild (a Local of TNG Canada/CWA) files a grievance but, under pressure, a web site independently set up by Gazette employees to voice their concerns is taken off-line. The Federation of Professional Journalists of Quebec soon re-posts the material on its Web server.

June 6 2002
Full-page ads appear in the Globe and Mail, the Winnipeg Free Press and Halifax's Chronicle-Herald – three of the few major Canadian newspapers not controlled by CanWest – denouncing the company's stifling of debate and dissent. The signatories are a Who's Who of Canadian journalism, including former publishers and executives of the newspapers now owned by CanWest. The ad was refused for publication in any CanWest paper.

Sept. 17 2004
Reuters news agency says it will be having a chat with CanWest Global officials about editors at their newspapers inserting inappropriate terminology, such as "terrorists," into their coverage of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. CBC Ottawa reports that the National Post altered Reuters copy while The Ottawa Citizen, which was caught out by an alert reader, distorted an Associated Press story for which it ran a correction.

Members of the Asper family, which owns CanWest, have never made a secret of their unqualified support for Israel and their disdain for journalists who strive to be objective in their coverage of the Middle East conflict(s). While Izzy Asper and his now-CEO son, Leonard, clearly delivered the message to CanWest Global reporters and editors that news copy as well as "national editorials" would reflect their personal views, this is the first time a news service has publicly objected to its copy being altered in such a way.

Sept 22
Globe and Mail publishes a commentary by Mazen Chouaib, executive director of the National Council on Canada-Arab Relations, in which he calls upon "Parliament to take a hard look at the impact and effect of media concentration in this country." Excerpts:

When the late Israel Asper's CanWest Global Communications acquired a significant share of the Canadian media, many of us feared the worst — particularly on the issue of Middle East coverage. In the past week, CanWest's editorial practices have shown we were right to worry.

• • •

For many Arab Canadians, this is another example of what they have long complained about: CanWest seems to make every effort to demonize them and their culture. There have been many complaints by Arab groups against CanWest, but the organization maintains an uncompromising and unapologetic position.

Nov. 17
The pro-Israel Aspers acquire a 50-per-cent interest in the Jerusalem Post, an English-language daily owned by disgraced media baron Conrad Black

link


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:22 AM

Bobad's insinuation that all of the people involved the flotilla are anti-Semites is not only an insult to our intelligence, it is also an insult to his intelligence as well. (When I say that, I am giving him the benefit of the doubt.)

I wonder what pavlovian conditioning Holocaust survivor Heddie Epstein was responding to when she signed up to accompany the flotilla.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:44 AM

We know we can't always trust the media for impartiality...

Sorry but bloggers whether "real" or "fake" are hardly "the media".

Any jackass can post a blog and anyone that would believe what's written thereon without independent confirmation from a reliable source is worse than an idiot.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: mousethief
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:53 AM

Golly I'm agreeing with GregF. Is it the apocalypse?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:59 AM

"Any jackass can post a blog"

Blogs are, or so we imagine, generally created by individual jackasses, and not generally mass-generated by jackass governments.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: greg stephens
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 12:16 PM

Amazing number of experts on international maritime law seem to be Mudcat regulars. Must be the shanty singing I suppose.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 12:25 PM

I don't know why anyone would think that the mainstream media (corporate media) whould be any more reliable than independent bloggers. Many independent bloggers are professional career journalists who no longer work for the corporate media because they refused to toe the corporate line. Just as with the corporate media, anyone reading a blog should verify whenever possible, but to make blanket statements about all bloggers makes no sense at all and shows a lot of ignorance about the nature of blogs these days.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: beardedbruce
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 12:46 PM

CarolC,

"All of that stuff was planted by the Israelis, beardedbruce"

You have some proof? I have no proof that the deaths were not caused by the pro-Palestinians themselves- since they are the ones benefiting from it, I guess that means they should be presumed to be guilty .


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Royston
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 12:54 PM

Beardedbruce

The proof is in the press - courtesy of the Israeli military spokeswoman that was quoted in the Guardian article I produced earlier today.

The only "weapons" apart from scissors, swiss army knives and kitchen knives, were guns and night vision scopes that were taken from, or dropped by, the Israeli soldiers. And were later returned. The spokeswoman said that the clips in the guns were empty when returned - she did not, or could not, say who fired the bullets.

I don't believe that Israeli special forces are in the habit of relinquishing loaded weapons to civilians armed with screwdrivers and tools for getting stones out of horse's hoof!

Fact, the boats and their passengers were unarmed.

The Israeli military have confirmed this.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: beardedbruce
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:04 PM

IDF: Hamas stops flotilla aid delivered by israel
By the CNN Wire Staff
June 2, 2010 12:04 p.m. EDT

STORY HIGHLIGHTS
Trucks of flotilla aid halted stopped at Gaza crossing
Clothing, medical material, blankets on trucks
Israel has naval blockade of Gaza

Jerusalem (CNN) -- Israel has attempted to deliver humanitarian aid from an international flotilla to Gaza, but Hamas -- which controls the territory -- has refused to accept the cargo, the Israel Defense Forces said Wednesday.

Palestinian sources said trucks that arrived from Israel at the Rafah terminal at the Israel-Gaza border were barred from delivering the aid over protests that members of the flotilla were not delivering the materials.

Israel had 20 trucks of aid found on the ships, such as expired medications, clothing, blankets, some medical equipment and toys.

Nine people died on Monday when Israel intercepted an aid vessel bound for Gaza.

Under Israeli policy, humanitarian aid must come through Israel and be checked by Israeli authorities who are looking to intercept smuggled weapons bound for militants aiming to attack Israel.

As part of this policy Israel forbids ships from dropping off goods at Gaza ports and works to thwart smuggling via tunnels between Gaza and Egypt.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:04 PM

David Cameron has condemned the Israeli raid on an aid convoy in Gaza as "completely unacceptable".

In his first question time as prime minister, he said he deplored the loss of life and everything should be done to prevent it happening again.

Here is the link
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10218450.stm

Make of it what you will.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: beardedbruce
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:04 PM

source


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Lox
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:09 PM

BB,

The Information blackout was imposed by the Israeli military after the attack began.

Up until that point, the flotilla had been 100% transparent, with numerous international parliamentary and media representatives on hand to ensure this transcparency.

It was the Israeli military who wanted to stop information getting out.

So who had something to hide?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: mousethief
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:13 PM

Ah, Hamas is playing politics with the aid shipments, therefore Israel was justified in attacking unarmed ships in international waters? Such logic.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:16 PM

The Israelis were also carrying hit lists of people they were supposed to try to kill. I saw one of them being displayed by the correspondents periodically on the live feed. Here is a picture of the hit list I saw being displayed...

http://www.kawther.info/wpr/wp-content/uploads/1-18.jpg


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Greg F.
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 01:38 PM

mousethief: Golly I'm agreeing with GregF. Is it the apocalypse?

Sorry! I'll try harder next time ;>)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 02:16 PM

There were a number of Arab Palestinians on board, some from Israel itself. They are not being released with the others.
One newscast said that a number of the Turks aboard also were being held.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: EBarnacle
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:15 PM

CarolC: "All that stuff was planted." I suggest you read "Looking for a Ship" by McPhee on the subject of smuggling and inspections.

"Safeguarding the precious lives of innocents and respecting their dignity as fellow humans is the necessary burden that international law imposes on war." If you are engaged in a provocative act, you are a participant, not an innocent.

Of the ships in the flotilla, how many actually were fired upon? And by fired upon, I mean with more than a shot across the bowx. How many had violent incidents when boarded?

I know for a fact that part of police training amounts to the following: If the person appears to show any threat, pull out your club. If he pulls a knife, pull out your gun. If he still threatens you, shoot [now, it's Taze] him. We don't want you to be hurt or killed in the line of duty. Should soldiers respond any differently when threatened?

Hamas in Gaza is playing a wonderful game. While not officially at war with Israel, they make no effort to stop their so called militants from attacking Israel. These attacks, if addressed at all, are then disclaimed as the actions of militants.

I have spoken with members of the Palestinian Mission to the United Nations in the line of business. I find it curious that people can find money for weapons but cannot find the money for Atmospheric Water Generation equipment which would benefit the population of the Strip.

Curiouser and curiouser said Alice.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:19 PM

beardedbruce, on the subject of the faked "evidence"...

http://ht.ly/1TaQb


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:22 PM

EBarnicle, shots from the helicopters wounded two people. We know this because the correspondents reported it in the live feed before the ropes had even come out of the helicopter that you can see in the live feed, and before any of the Israelis had left the helicopter.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:31 PM

I should point out, for those who don't like to open links, those "weapons" weren't even planted. The Israelis didn't even bother to do that. They just gathered up some pictures that were a few years old, put them up on Flikr, and then they just waited for all of the useful idiots to go out and do their work for them.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Lox
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:32 PM

If Hamas are preventing the Aid from getting through then they are undermining the efforts and intentions of the flotilla.

For this I condemn them outright.

Just As I condemn the Israelis from hijacking the flotilla and murdering the civilians on board.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:35 PM

Maybe they are and maybe they aren't. I've also heard reports that none of the supplies ever even got to the Gaza border, and that the government of Israel has disappeared them, blaming it on Hamas (some of the reports have even suggested that the supplies have gone to Jewish settlements). I think I'll wait for more information before I believe that one, considering the Israeli government's track record of lies and what has happened to supplies from previous flotillas that were confiscated by the government of Israel.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Penny S.
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 04:07 PM

Some time back, a friend of mine, while working on a wildlife site in a London park, was engaged with by a group of four lads spoiling for a fight. It was a very peculiar business (there was a territorial issue, over the lads continued attempts to remove fences from the site, I recall), in which the four lads, approaching six foot, but only 14 years old, claimed to be being picked on by my unarmed 5ft 8in friend. The lads had a metal tipped cricket stump. Eventually all was resolved, but one thing stuck in my mind. The claim by the leader of lads' friends that "he was only little".

Every time Israel gets into one of these situations, and tries to justify itself, I hear that lads' claim.

Penny


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 04:36 PM

[From: CarolC - PM
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:31 PM
I should point out, for those who don't like to open links, those "weapons" weren't even planted. The Israelis didn't even bother to do that. They just gathered up some pictures that were a few years old, put them up on Flikr, and then they just waited for all of the useful idiots to go out and do their work for them.]

Link to Irael MFA's Flickr Photostream: http://www.flickr.com/photos/israel-mfa/

Can anyone explain to me, how so many of the posters in response to these images, are able (apparently) to ascertain that the images of the umm seized "weapons cache" are in fact way out of date, and thus not images of anything on board the flotilla.

Irrespective of whether or not the images are genuinely of what they are purported to be of, I find it a bit bizarre that the Israeli's would have even bothered falsifying 'evidence' of a "weapons cache" comprised of a kitchen knives, woodworking tools and marbles..


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 04:40 PM

Lets try that again:

[From: CarolC - PM
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 03:31 PM
I should point out, for those who don't like to open links, those "weapons" weren't even planted. The Israelis didn't even bother to do that. They just gathered up some pictures that were a few years old, put them up on Flikr, and then they just waited for all of the useful idiots to go out and do their work for them.]

Link to Irael MFA's Flickr Photostream: http://www.flickr.com/photos/israel-mfa/ (I've kept the original url in the link there, in case anyone's dubious about what they might be clicking on)

Can anyone explain to me, how so many of the posters in response to these images, are able (apparently) to ascertain that the images of the umm seized "weapons cache" are in fact way out of date, and thus not images of anything on board the flotilla.

Irrespective of whether or not the images are genuinely of what they are purported to be of, I find it a bit bizarre that the Israeli's would have even bothered falsifying 'evidence' of a "weapons cache" comprised of a kitchen knives, woodworking tools and marbles..


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 05:10 PM

I don't know the process one would use to find this information, but this is what one of the commenters posted in the comments of the saw photograph. Maybe someone with more technical expertise can explain how one goes about getting the EXIF metadata from photographs posted in a site like flikr...


Hi. Just to confirm that the EXIF metadata points to this photo being taken in 2006:

barney@benchwood:~$ identify -verbose farm5.static.flickr.com/4047/4662965686_a91f8 bab2e_o_d.jpg | grep Date
exif:DateTime: 2010:06:02 10:38:47
exif:DateTimeDigitized: 2006:02:07 05:52:19
exif:DateTimeOriginal: 2006:02:07 05:52:19


I notice a lot of bouquets of red flowers laying around in that picture. I wonder what those are doing there.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Paul Burke
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 05:31 PM

Java EXIF viewer from a dependable source, though it only gives the original date. You'll need to have the Java runime on your computer.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 05:36 PM

Thanks, Paul.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 05:59 PM

I asked one of my Facebook friends, a young woman who lives in Gaza, if she knows anything about the reports that Hamas has refused to allow the aid to enter Gaza, and this was her response...

"that news are just stupid lies !! well i think that they are looking for a way to make it a little bit easier on Isreal !! it is not not not true !! Hamas people still PALESTINIAN .. and they can not and would not do this !! they need it more than every body !!! how they could do that !!! Crazy westren news !!"

I will keep looking around for more information, though.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 06:24 PM

"I notice a lot of bouquets of red flowers laying around in that picture. I wonder what those are doing there."

Yep, lots of plastic wrapped bunches of red roses or carnations laying about on board next to that umm "weapon": http://www.flickr.com/photos/israel-mfa/4662965686/

Could that site be a spoof?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 06:31 PM

More reported weapons on the flotilla (I've left the url in): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PV4eiDi12w


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 06:35 PM

Could that site be a spoof?

No, the hasbara people really are that dumb.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 10:42 PM

Nutmeg is coming to destroy Israel


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: mousethief
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:34 PM

Nutmeg and sunflower seeds. Those can be made into rockets. Put de lime in de coconut. That was about liquid explosives, remember?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:34 PM

Ain't rocket surgery...

Isreal is strengthening Hamas with it's blockaid...

Folks root fir the underdog and Isreal is creating an underdog in Hmas...

Time for some serious rethinkin' in Isreal... Times have changed... Military might alone won't keep Isreal secure... This is a new deal here... People are too connected... Isreal is fightin' the "last war"...

I'd say it's time to get this thing figured out... Without the the friggin' militraists this time... They are passe'... They have nuthin' to offer...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 02 Jun 10 - 11:42 PM

I understand about the lexdexia, Bobert, but I can't let this one pass...

Isreal is strengthening Hamas with it's blockaid...


Maybe that's what they should call the next flotilla. It's perfect.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: mousethief
Date: 03 Jun 10 - 12:08 AM

Oooh! Major PR coup! I can see a concert with big-name stars, raising money for cardamon and nutmeg and sunflower seeds to smuggle into Gaza:

BLOCKAID

Please give generously.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Jun 10 - 12:27 AM

By the way, one way people can help the Palestinians cope with the economic difficulties they face because of the stranglehold that the Israeli government and military have over them is to go to this site and buy some of their great products. They are made in Palestine by Palestinians (not in an apartheid settler colony). I bought a kufiyeh that was made in the last Palestinian kufiyeh factory by Mr. Herbawi and I love it.

http://www.palestineonlinestore.com/


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Jun 10 - 01:09 AM

I just got word from a source I trust that Israel has stolen all of the aid along with the ships, and has no intention of letting any of it go to help the people in Gaza. I'll keep an eye out for more sources of information about this for further verification.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Jun 10 - 01:17 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMq19qHq7Jo&feature=player_embedded


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 03 Jun 10 - 03:29 AM

Yesterday I heard an Israeli spokesman claim that cement was a banned import into Gaza (deperately needed to re-build damage done to schools and hospitals by the last Israeli incursion) because it could be used by Hamas to build military installations!! Following this 'logic' I assume that foodstuffs could be added to the list because it could be used to feed Hamas fighters!
I don't know how far the forged Irish passports incident has hit the world press. A couple of months ago Israeli terrorists used forged Irish passports.

From The Belfast Telegraph:
"Members of a hit squad that assassinated a top Hamas military commander used Irish passports to enter and leave Dubai, it's been claimed.
The suspected Israeli hit team, including at least one woman, entered the United Arab Emirates using Irish documents, police authorities said.
Mahmoud al-Mabhouh (50), held responsible by Israel for the abduction and murder of two Israeli soldiers in 1989, died in mysterious circumstances on January 20 in a Dubai hotel room.
The Irish Department of Foreign Affairs spokesman said yesterday: "We are aware of the media reports and we are in contact with authorities locally to try and determine the truth of the reports."
Al-Mabhouh was said to have been shocked with an electric weapon held to his legs and then suffocated or poisoned.
Iran and Hamas have blamed Israel for the killing, but Israeli news media claimed al-Mabhouh had many enemies and could have been killed by other Arab factions.
Up to seven people were said to have been involved in al-Mabhouh's killing, four of whom used Irish passports to enter Dubai and who later fled to a "European country" after the killing, according to police sources in Dubai.
Declining to reveal their identities, an official said UAE security personnel were co-ordinating with Interpol to have them extradited
A few years ago the Israeli's were reported to have sent one of their murder-squads to the Irish Republic to carry out the murder of a Palestinian seeking refuge here."

Nazi extermination camps were at their most efficient during my lifetime, so I grew up surrounded by horrific images of Belsen and Auschwitz. I'm sure I'm not alone in finding it extremely distressing to witness the persecuted having become the persecuters and resorting to many of the tactics used by their former 'ethnic cleansers' in pursuit of a two thousand year old myth.
This bunch are shitting on the memory of their own predecessors.
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: New Israeli atrocity: attack on Gaza aid
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 03 Jun 10 - 05:34 AM

""The pattern is pretty well established - Israel is provoked until it has no choice but to respond to the provocation thus providing those who hate them with another opportunity to condemn them and call for an end to their state. The response is Pavlovian as evidenced by the majority of posters to this thread.""

That is the best example of pure horseshit I have seen for many a day.

1. PIRACY! The aid ships were in international waters. For the Israelis to claim justification, or provocation, they would have to be inside Israeli territorial limits, or what the Israelis claim as their territorial waters (not necessarily the same thing).

2. The Israeli blockade is of dubious legality to say the least, and if it cannot be justified, then neither can any action taken in its support.

3. NO CONTRABAND WAS FOUND! Experience of the efficiency of Israeli Intelligence leads one to suspect that they would have known exactly what was, or was not, aboard those ships, in which case they were intentionally targetting a humanitarian aid shipment, with the intention of harming innocent civilians in Gaza.

4. Nothing that has been advanced or proposed as justification stands analytical scrutiny. This is just another case of the Middle East's biggest bully flexing its muscles in full expectation of support from the West's biggest bully.

Don T.


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