BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 05:05 AM

Please delete spam

Subject: RE: Please Delete Spam
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04-Oct-06 - 02:04 AM
I think we're going to have to live with Spam in that Dubliners thread. It's a long thread, so moving all the "good" messages would be difficult.
We've had maybe 25 Spam messages in that one thread. We delete them as we see them.
-Joe-

Then a bit later.

Subject: RE: Please Delete Spam
From: Joe Offer
Date: 07-Oct-06 - 03:24 PM
We get Spam in the Dubliners thread almost every day, so I finally decided to close the thread. It appears the Spam is being sent automatically.
-Joe-

Poor old Dubliners – it certainly isn't their fault- or mine. Or is it?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 05:45 AM

Poor old Dubliners – it certainly isn't their fault- or mine. Or is it?

No but I doubt whether than anyone other than you would complain about taking an action because of the ongoing problem of spam. It is difficult to know how to deal with it, there does seem to be automated "spam bots" around and the problem seems to be getting worse.

Here is a blacklist file for domains from MediaWiki (the software used by Wikipedia).

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 05:57 AM

(I'd doubt that MC has a fraction of those "problem domians" btw. I think the Wiki list is more an indication of how things can go).

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 12:08 PM

No but I doubt whether than anyone other than you would complain about taking an action because of the ongoing problem of spam.

Jon - it surely depends on what that action and its effect is. I suggest that closing threads and deleting things is not the cure-all answer to every problem on our forum. If indeed it is the answer to any?

Sometimes we become so intent on solving a problem that we may not notice that the so-called cure is in fact doing more harm that the original problem is supposed to cure. This I would suggest is the situation here.

I would prefer to read and contribute to the Dubliners thread - and ignore any spam - than not to be able to read, contribute or refresh the thread at all. Which is now the case - what next?

We got used to static on the radio - most of us tend to treat spam in the same way, do our best to ignore it but not allow it to spoil our enjoyment. Few of us would have thought that throwing the radio away or not making any programmes - would be a sensible reaction to deal with static.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 12:50 PM

Please forgive the cut and paste but below is a Shambles post from the summer of 2000!!! It might easily fit into this thread. It's the same story folks and he's been making people post and respond for all that time. He'll never stop as long as we keep feeding him reasons to. I also apologize for THIS post but I wanted you all to see that if you think you're going to change anything by responding to him, well, it hasn't worked in over SIX years!!!

***************************************************************


Music threads are routinely retitled and consolidated and cross-indexed as part of our indexing process, to help make it easier for people to find songs by song title or songwriter name. If space permits, the original thread title is retained, with clarifying words added. Non-music threads are occasionally retitled for clarity, but the need to retitle non-music threads does not arise as frequently because non-music threads are not used for reference.
-Joe Offer-

Yes it is mostly well-intention but perhaps it is as well to forget the fancy words and the 'spin'? Routine censorship imposed by anonymous volunteer posters - upon the invited contributions of fellow posters - without their prior knowledge or permission is what we are talking about here.

My main point is that "our" indexing process does not seem to involve obtaining the agreement of the contributors. When the issues here - like whether a thread is combined into one - left as the poster made it - or have a link to others - are largely a question of personal taste - as Jon's post indicates.

The question is - whose personal taste? Why not mine, Jon's or your's?

As you can't please all of the people all of the time - perhaps it is better that the personal tastes of each contributor are respected and any changes to their contribution are only made with their agreement?   

We could all argue forever about the merits of each imposed change - (that is why it is better not to impose one's personal taste and judgement upon others). But Jon mentioned the Cyril Tawney thread so I will express my personal view on that imposed change.

A link to the two threads would have been better as one was started when he was alive (if very ill) and the others was started after his death. The originator of the later thread - did have the option of refreshing an existing one - but chose to start a new one.

Perhaps poster's freely made choices like this - can be respected by all our volunteers (especially the anonymous ones) - from now on?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 01:15 PM

I think Shambles made some good points in his last post and the 2000 note.

Can I ask one question Shambles? (no, that was not the one question!) After repeatedly making your point well known, and realizing that you are powerless to change the minds of the "hosts" of this party - what drives you to keep making your point?    The silence of the host, and the repeated examples that continue to occur serve to make your point. Why bother to continue making the same suggestion when it appears that it is falling on deaf ears, and you end up becoming the victim of scorn because of your persistence?

Again, I am not knocking your opinion nor do am I attacking you - I do see your points more clearly, but it is obvious that the powers that be aren't going to change.   Could you expain to our forum why you continue?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 01:33 PM

Ron,

Shambles just enjoys being argumentative. He knows that he won't change anything but he likes the attention that he is getting. The fact that so many people respond to him both postively and negatively charges his battery. If everyone would just stop responding, like we did about a month ago, there wouldn't be much left for him to say. Read 10 posts from Shambles. They are all basicly the same.

Perhaps it is time to end this thread once and for all and, if Max so desires, finally send Shambles into cyberspace with Martin Gibson. He really is annoying the hell out of too many people. There isn't any site that I know of that is unmoderated and that doesn't do selective editing. Moderators have the right to do WHATEVER THEY WANT. If the site owner, Max, doesn't like what they do he can replace them. If a poster doesn't like what they do he can go post somewhere else.

Sambles, stop making everyone miserable with your constant bellyaching. You said you piece, no one cares to do it your way so stop!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Wesley S
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 01:48 PM

Guest - the ONLY way that Shambles can make you { or anyone else } miserable is if you give him the power to do so by reading his posts. So.........

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 01:49 PM

Jon - it surely depends on what that action and its effect is. I suggest that closing threads and deleting things is not the cure-all answer to every problem on our forum

shambles, the idea that is considered to be a "cure all" is aomething that I believe only exists in your mind.

While deletions may still be needed, the answer (if there really is one) to spam in the longer term is likely to focus more on improving defences in order to prevent as much as practical getting as far as appearing on the forum. In the meanwhile, the mods just have to do thier best with the limited tools they have.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 01:53 PM

" He knows that he won't change anything but he likes the attention that he is getting. The fact that so many people respond to him both postively and negatively charges his battery"

Guest - I think the two sentence that I copied above speak volumes. Are all of us being a bit hypocritical?   The "anti-Shambles" posts are doing the exact same thing that they are accusing Shambles of - you won't change anything but you like the attention. The fact that he responds charges the batteries of the posters. We are all the same when you get right down to it. There is no difference.

I honestly would love to hear Shambles response to my question instead of everyone else putting their words in first.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 02:03 PM

I would prefer to read and contribute to the Dubliners thread - and ignore any spam - than not to be able to read, contribute or refresh the thread at all. Which is now the case - what next?

What we do know is this:


Subject: RE: Tech: Error 503 Service Unavailable
From: Max
Date: 27 Sep 06 - 09:26 PM
[snip]

2. Spam is increasing. We get hammered every day with thousands upon thousands of attacks from people and worms and spiders trying to use our site for nothing we want. We usually have more manpower to deal with it, but:

3. We're down a very key member of our staff due to an ongoing family emergency. Our planned upgrade for the 10th anniversary includes a great deal of behind the scenes defense systems, but is delayed due to this issue that I will talk more about pretty soon.
[...]

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 03:17 PM

I think Shambles made some good points in his last post

Not really, Ron. His points were based

a) on the false premise that closures and deletions are believed to be a "cure all". This is something that has been pointed out to him on numerous occasions but he continues to use it to make his points.

b) apparently under the belief that user prefererence is the only factor.

I know of no site owner who would willingly, at his own expense, advertise irrelevant material which is often dubious in content for an unknown 3rd party. I also know of no site owner who would wish to encourage such "advertisers" by allowing the material to remain.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 03:38 PM

Guest, I was referring more to Shambles suggestion that deletions and closures are often based on personal choice, and I do think that is fair to say.   I also agree with you that no site owner would willingly leave certain posts up, which is where there seems to be some issues.

No one is going to agree with every reason. No one is going to like every posting. My take is that everyone should make their point and then get on with life. If the powers that be have not shown an indication to change, it won't happen. It is no longer a question of right or wrong, because the only person that has the "right" answer is the host - who will do as they please.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 04:08 PM

Guest, I was referring more to Shambles suggestion that deletions and closures are often based on personal choice, and I do think that is fair to say.

Again Ron, this is something that has been hammered out time and time again...

I wouldn't use the wording "personal choice" but I don't think anyone disputes that many decisions are based on "personal judgement" and can not be taken by rules that are written in stone. I also would doubt you will find many who at least in thier own opinion believe that on occasions a wrong decision has been made.

I do not know exactly how things work now but when I was a clone here, there was a structure and the clones only used powers of deletion in very limited circumstances (eg. a duplicated post, perhaps blatant spam , etc. - things where there was no question).

Anything further was dealt by Joe and Jeff, and "in consultation" with Max.

There also was, and I believe still is, a clear complaints procedure where one takes a matter to Joe Offer first and then onto Max.

Things might have changed a little from there but is my belief that a structure and chain of command still exists and that ultimately the "judgement calls" are in fact done under what I will call "Max's editorial guidelines".

By contrast, shambles' "mudcat view" appears to be based on Joe Offer sort of taking control and not acting in accordance with any "editorial guidelines". It is a situation that I do not believe exits.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 05:00 PM

If the powers that be have not shown an indication to change, it won't happen. It is no longer a question of right or wrong, because the only person that has the "right" answer is the host - who will do as they please.

Ron - your view is a reasonable one for a poster who has found our forum in the state of evolution that you have. But if you look back at Max's public statements - you will not see the 'take-it-or-leave attitude to the wishes of our forum's posters - that you quite reasonably express.

Again it must be pretty obvious that our 'moderators' next step - of members only posters - being allowed to post only what the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team has first personally vetted and approved of, before he allows it on to our forum - is not very much to my liking. And that I (and others posters) would have been very unlikely to be attracted by a forum containing all this anonymous interference, restriction and judgement. So it must be pretty obvious that our forum - that I and others posters found on Max's site - was a rather different one to the one posters see now (and largely accept as it always being).

What you refer to as the 'powers that be' were then only my fellow posters - not as you now see - my judge, jury and lynching party.

Again, I am not knocking your opinion nor do am I attacking you - I do see your points more clearly, but it is obvious that the powers that be aren't going to change.   Could you expain to our forum why you continue?

Things change - and it is right that they do - but my view is that there is never any need to be seen to carelessly throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I just try post my views to encourage and take part in discussion - as I always have and I will always try to. In the process of this debate, there is the hope that a little bit more of our precious freedoms - will not be as thoughtlessly curtailed as they might have been. There is some evidence to support this view.

Ron - that is the simple answer to your question. Perhaps the question you need to be asking is why it is thought necessary to make such a fuss in order to try to encourage so many different ways to prevent me and other posters from continuing?

With all due respect - perhaps you will accept that 'the problem' is not me or any other individual poster - no matter what posters may be currently encouraged to accept. Perhaps we can now go back to discussing the issue of closed threads and deleted posts?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: skipy
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 06:06 PM

Back off children, back off now! His objective is to take this through the "K". Don't help him, he can post and post and post but let him do this alone.
He can come back to the fold when he wishes to, but don't help him to do this. He is running rings around you for his pleasure. He repeats, you repeat, stop now.
Skipy (his next target)

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Azizi
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 06:14 PM

"...the ONLY way that Shambles can make you { or anyone else } miserable is if you give him the power to do so by reading his posts. So........."
-Wesley S


Just because a person reads a post by Shambles, he or she becomes miserable??!

In my opinion, if a person becomes miserable after reading a post of this forum [or any other forum] that is written by Shambles [or any other person], then the problem is that person's and not the person who wrote the text.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 06:18 PM

Yep, skipy. I will try to go back to just reading yet again...

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Azizi
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 06:24 PM

I've been delighted after reading some posts on this forum.

I've felt energized after reading some posts on this forum.

I've been angry after reading posts on this forum.

I've been sad after reading post on this forum.

But miserable? Naw.

Of course, different strokes for different folks.

I guess some people could say that when I felt happy, energized, angry, sad etc after reading certain post on this forum, I gave people the power to influence my mood. But even when I felt sad at some of the Mudcat goings on, I didn't feel miserable.

But-on second thought-there have been some name calling posts that may have made some individuals feel miserable.

I don't count Shamble's posts among those miserable posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 06:35 PM

But-on second thought-there have been some name calling posts that may have made some individuals feel miserable.

I don't count Shamble's posts among those miserable posts.

Well one hopefully final comment from me for a while. We all vary but personally I find polite round about methods like".

"which others might consider not to be truthful"

can be more offensive than

"I believe he's a fu**ing liar".

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 10:07 PM

"With all due respect - perhaps you will accept that 'the problem' is not me or any other individual poster - no matter what posters may be currently encouraged to accept. Perhaps we can now go back to discussing the issue of closed threads and deleted posts?"

I agree with you 100% on that!! Shambles, I think you have eloquently stated your case and as I said earlier in this discussion, it took me awhile to understand your points.   While I don't agree with everything you say, I do think you have the right to say it (unless the host shuts down the party!). Others (including myself at times, and I apologize) have either goaded you into needless argueing or taken an opportunity to swipe at you, and it has sidetracked and clouded the whole discussion.

However, because the owners of this site seem to condone the behavior of the guests and bouncers, this argument will never reach a conclusion. We are just using this thread as an excuse to spout off whatever we wish, seemingly without reprecussion.   None of us have anything to complain about as we are doing what we wish.

I wish you success in your endeavour.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Oct 06 - 10:21 PM

Just don't say anything at all that is not ass-kissing about the queen bee or your posts will be deleted.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 04:04 AM

Others (including myself at times, and I apologize) have either goaded you into needless argueing or taken an opportunity to swipe at you, and it has sidetracked and clouded the whole discussion.

Bollocks.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 05:25 AM

The silence of the host, and the repeated examples that continue to occur serve to make your point. Why bother to continue making the same suggestion when it appears that it is falling on deaf ears, and you end up becoming the victim of scorn because of your persistence?

When you are encouraged by the example currently set - to post publicly ONLY to judge the worth of and to call other posters names - this will always say far more about you and your shortcomings than it does about the object of your scorn.

But it has always appeared to me that our forum's host has provided just about everything that all of their invited guests could require. For those who think that a good party is making personal judgements about and jokes at the expense of certain of their fellow guests - to other guests - Max has even provided personal messages where this can be done without inflicting it on our forum as an example of public posting behaviour to be followed.

The bottom line is - would any host who effectivly invites the whole world to their party - really expect everyone to be of a like-mind?

I strongly feel that it is up to any guest who appreciates Max's invitation to freely express their views - NOT to be seen to support (even by their silence) any unfair attempts to deny to other posters - what they themselves accept as a right. No matter how these attempts may be disguised and justified.

That does not of course mean that our host has to have to live with any old shit posted up on their walls. Our host has every right to throw away the foul-smelling bath water by all means - but please take care to leave the babies behind?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 05:27 AM

And the walls...

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 05:31 AM

perhaps the host is silent because he wants to spare himself "making the same suggestion when it appears that it is falling on deaf ears"?

Does your remark about the bathwater mean you accept it's ok for moderators to delete spam?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 05:48 AM

Does your remark about the bathwater mean you accept it's ok for moderators to delete spam?

If you actually read my posts - you will see that my problem is NOT with our moderators deleting spam or with spam being deleted from our forum automatically.

I do have a problem when having removed the spam - entire threads are then closed by our 'moderators - because of the possiblity some more spam MAY appear in it. To me that does not seem to be very sensible, proportionate nor to be showing much respect to the poster's invited contributions to that thread.....Does it to you?

If any should appear - then delete JUST the spam - do allow our 'moderators' to be seen to use it as yet another excuse to close yet another thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 06:09 AM

... allow our 'moderators' to be seen to use it as yet another excuse to close yet another thread.

Nonsense shambles. The idea that the mods go round looking for an excuse to close threads exists only in your mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 07:58 AM

Nonsense shambles. The idea that the mods go round looking for an excuse to close threads exists only in your mind.

Is it only in my mind that (for his own purposes) the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team has intentionally littered this thread with the very same type of spam which its appearence there - he has used as an excuse to closed the Dubliners thread?

I expect any minute that he will use its presence in this thread as a excuse to close this one down too................Even though it was the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team who placed the spam here, unbidden in response to an anonymous 'compalint'.. Please delete spam

Not of course an act that would be described as 'hijacking' a thread. As those sort terms are now reserved for a poster simply posting any views that the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team does not agree with and wishes to prevent our forum from seeing.

Rather like the use of the term 'complaint' and the restrictions now seen to be imposed on any post so judged and described by the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team as any view that he may not agree with. When any poster is seen to be permitted to express any flattering views about our 'moderators' efforts as often and in as many threads as they wish without getting relgated to the BS section.

But where 'complaints' in posts, from one poster about the posting of another are not restricted or discouraged at all, but actively encouraged on our forum and where there is now even a special Snitchers Corner set-up for this - called The Mudcat Help and Trouble Forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 08:06 AM

Nonsense shambles. The idea that the mods go round looking for an excuse to close threads exists only in your mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Wolfgang
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 08:24 AM

not to be able to read, contribute or refresh the thread at all. (Shambles)

You may not know it, Shambles, but you can read that thread.
click
So one part of what you say is simply not true.

As for posting and refreshing, you are invited by Joe to post to other Dubliners' threads and I'm sure he'd be pleased if you just start a follow up thread with a link to the old thread in the first post. That would be a constructive act instead of headbanging.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 09:15 AM

Nonsense shambles. The idea that the mods go round looking for an excuse to close threads exists only in your mind.

No - the idea exists alright - in Snitchers Corner

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 08:24 PM

The suggestion that our forum be a place where all threads remain open to be refreshed by any poster - may seem totally idealistic to many posters - when it is of course nothing of the sort.

So routine has thread closure now become that it may be news to some posters that our forum managed perfectly well for many years without any threads being closed at all. It was only fairly recently that our 'moderators' were armed with this weapon.

I see that as a sad day for our forum. For now our 'moderators' scratch around to find an excuse to close a thread and encourage other posters to suggests candidates for closure - and give the impression that this has always been the case and that it achieves something.

The reason I refer to it as finding an excuse - is that although the act of imposing closure on threads has now become routine it makes no difference to the running of our forum nor improved the level of posting behaviour on our forum.

The hysteria now generated on our forum by the concept of imposing closure on threads has become nothing but a counter-productive distraction. an end in itself. Playing about with posters invited contributions now appears to have become a bit of a fun game for our 'moderators'.

Posters are now encouraged to take part in this game by finding threads to be closed - (along with other imposed actions on the post of others) - rather than be encouraged to simply concentrate on their own posting. It would be nice to see a return on our forum to where all threads remained open.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 08:28 PM

Go slag a mod. The post will disappear within 12 hours. Especially posts about the queen-bee mod.

Rip the shit out of a regular member and the shit will stick around. Shambles is right about much he says.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 08:29 PM

The power of the private edit button.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Ebbie
Date: 11 Oct 06 - 11:22 PM

And here I don't even know who the 'queen-bee mod' is. The sham is SO right; there is real hysteria about.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 02:44 AM

You may not know it, Shambles, but you can read that thread.
click
So one part of what you say is simply not true.

Thank you Wolfgang - You have a backward way of saying it - but I am glad you accept the rest of what I say is being perfectly true.

A poster cannot refresh a closed thread as they cannot post to it. The only way any poster can read a closed thread (once it falls of the bottom is if they search for a thread they will not know even exists, or if there is the link to the thread provided.

Perhaps - IF THESE ROUTINE THREAD CLOSURES ARE TO CONTINUE - Our 'moderators' can always ensure that there is a record of the thread kept for posters to see and a permanent link provided to enable posters to read the clossed thread?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Blowzabella
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 03:18 AM

The only way any poster can read a closed thread (once it falls of the bottom is if they search for a thread they will not know even exists, or if there is the link to the thread provided.

Surely that applies to any thread - closed or not? Once it's gone off the bottom, you've got to take some action to find it.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 04:28 AM

Surely that applies to any thread - closed or not? Once it's gone off the bottom, you've got to take some action to find it.

Yes of course. But having taken this action and the time and trouble to find it, being able to read a thread is only one part of the inter-active experience that is our forum.

For having taken this time and trouble to find a thread - you may then wish to contribute to it. Which you not be able to do - if the thread has been subject to closure for some unspecified reason by some anonymous 'moderator'.

And of course you will only know - after you have read (or scrolled down) the entire thread - if you do wish to add something. And only at this point will you see a little note by the box you are about to make your contribution in, telling you that you cannot do this - as the thread is closed..........

Then when you have started a new thread on the subject - you will find a post from some helpful poster (often a 'moderator') who will inform you and our forum - that we have already discussed this subject in an earlier thread (perhaps not being aware that it was not possible to refresh this earlier thread.

Even when you find that the in question thread is not closed and it is possible to refresh it - posters are not sure if this is judged to be the best course of action. As after you have done this - you will find a post fron some helpful poster (often a 'moderator' telling you and our forum that this is not the right thing to do and suggesting that starting a new thread would be the correct course of action.

I have seen both actions to be publicly judged right and be judged wrong by our 'moderators'. No wonder posters are confused.

So in addition to the direct inhibition cause by our 'moderators' intentionally making it impossible for a poster to refreash a closed thread - there is indirect inhibition cause by this uncertainty about whether either of these actions will be seen to be judged wrong by our 'moderators'.

I would have thought that the role of any 'moderation, would be to be seen to enable and encourage posting and would not wish to be seen in any way to inhibit any poster from contributing. That does not now appear to be the case on our forum.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,He Who Shall Not be Named
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 10:36 AM

I support Shambles for his bravery here, and for his ability to expose Corporate Mudcat for what it is.

This place is a cesspool of much anti-American activity.

Mudcat and al-Qaida, arm in arm against America.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: MMario
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 10:42 AM

approximately 50 closed threads out of over 95 thousand threads. yes, horribly oppressive.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:13 AM

Blah, blah, blah...

Worse than CNN.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:18 AM

Maybe. But Shambles tells more truth than CNN.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:24 AM

Has Art Blakey's birthday been 'hijacked'?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:27 AM

approximately 50 closed threads out of over 95 thousand threads. yes, horribly oppressive.

When all 50 of them were started by you - perhaps you may think it so?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:39 AM

The closed threads were not all started by one person unless that person is posting under multiple identities.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:52 AM

I recall 2 threads I started that were deleted (well, "closed", actually)...

In both cases it was due to what I regardes as harmless humour but that someone else deemed offensive to some particular group of people (but not the same group, by the way). (in one case I was making fun of really obnoxious rappers, most of whom are assumed to be black, generally speaking) (in the other case I was posting in a ridiculous quasi-Japanese accent...but the person who deleted the thread has no way of knowing that I respect and like the Japanese far more than most other westerners do...but so what?)

I was surprised to have my threads terminated. Both times. I didn't expect that. I momentarily was a bit irritated about it. Then I accepted the fact that (1) I don't control the rest of the world and I never shall; and (2) it didn't matter much anyway.

And I moved on. I suggest you do the same. Think of the time and energy you will save which can be put to good use doing something constructive.

Think of the time I have just wasted typing out this piece of advice which you will surely not follow. ;-) LOL! We are all big time wasters when it comes right down to it.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Wolfgang
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:53 AM

Has Art Blakey's birthday been 'hijacked'?

Yes, Shambles, it has, and you've been the one to start that with your response to a simple suggestion, a response that had nearly nothing to do with my request but all with your crusade.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 11:55 AM

SO if you don't like the behavior you adopt it?   Hmmmm.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 12 Oct 06 - 12:02 PM

And I moved on. I suggest you do the same.

Thank you for your suggestion.

But it was only the fact that that I have carried on that enabled you to make your suggestion in this thread.

And as a result of this thread remaining open for free and open discussion of this subject (so far) - perhaps the next time your humour and intentions are misunderstood - your threads containing this - will also be allowed to remain open?