BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 24 Oct 06 - 04:14 PM

Oh Shambles, please. You are asking me to repeat myself again and again. You know exactly how I know, just like you know.   

The host knows all, and you know that as well.

Enough already, I am tired of hashing out the same points in this repititious excuse for a discussion. You have suckered me in again and again and I can only blame myself. I apologize to everyone else on this thread.   See my previous notes before asking more questions to get the same answers.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Oct 06 - 04:39 PM

He will ask and ask until someone tells him what he wants to hear. If it takes forever then he will ask forever.

But Shambles, your days are numbered...you don't have forever.

According to Max "Trust me, this matter will be dealt with in time. Trust me, we working as hard as we can to make this happen as soon as we can." That's about you leaving.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Blowzabella
Date: 24 Oct 06 - 07:44 PM

Why, on reading the last few posts of this thread, do i suddenly feel like the theme music for Dr Who is most appropriate....?


He will ask and ask until someone tells him what he wants to hear. If it takes forever then he will ask forever.

But Shambles, your days are numbered...you don't have forever.

According to Max "Trust me, this matter will be dealt with in time. Trust me, we working as hard as we can to make this happen as soon as we can." That's about you leaving.

To be continued.....

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 02:50 AM

The host knows all, and you know that as well.

No I don't and with all due respect Ron - nor do you. All our forum knows about what our host knows or thinks is what he chooses to tell our forum in his few public statements.

I have yet to read a public statement wher Max has stated that his views are synonymous with mine, yours or anyone elses - have you?

However, a few other posters (with agendas of their own) insist on telling us that our host's views ARE synonymous with those of the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team. Or are they really trying to tell us that Max is now 'being led by the nose' and that Max would not dare not to do as the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team publicly requests?

These few posters choose to ignore and not to provide any answer to the following - which clearly demonstrate that our host's views are NOT synonymous with those of the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team - as they claim.

Our forum has also been told that the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team that:
And despite our best efforts, Mudcat is no longer a pleasant place to hang out and goof off or have a good discussion.
And that:
So, short of members-only posting, what can we do to bring peace to this place? I'd rather have another solution, but I haven't been able to think of one.
-Joe Offer-
Perhaps you could tell us if our host agree with this as well?

Max's more recent public statements have not given a firm answer either way to whether our forum is the further changed to a members only forum to meet the public request for this - made by the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team's to suit his requirements. Perhaps Ron you know and can tell our forum why Max has chosen not to do this? One thing is sure - posters appear to read from these statements and see in them - what they wish to.

But that no reply had been given by Max to this request was made clear in the post where the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team made the above statement. So why this claim that our host's views should be seen to to be synonymous with the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing Team - when he himself is under no such impression?

By the same token - why do a few posters so vocally support the continuation of 'best efforts' that the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing team has publicly stated have not been able to make Mudcat - a pleasant place to hang out and goof off or have a good discussion?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 07:06 AM

PM] Max No BS: The Mudcat Is Shutting Down (72* d) RE: No BS: The Mudcat Is Shutting Down 02 Nov 01

>snip<
There is a Mudcat clique, or core group, if you will. I call you the 1%ers. Half of my design efforts, functions, doodads, are for the 1%ers, half are for the other 99%. The 1%ers are so because they're here a lot, and they post a lot, not for any other reason than that.

I ask more of you. I ask the 1%ers to simply represent us, the Mudcat, with pride, patience, empathy, tolerance, and love. I've seen some testiness lately. Don't you think I get pissed off? See me do much about it in the forum?

You are the 1%, which means you are not the majority by far. Try not to forget about the other 99%.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 07:09 AM

[PM] Max The future of Mudcat. What do YOU think? (81* d) RE: The future of Mudcat. What do YOU think? 12 Jan 00

Thank you Shambles. I think some may not catch what your trying to do.

The Mudcat's gonna grow. There will be a lot more content, a lot more people, a lot more posts, a lot more media, a lot more songs. We can't stop that now. But does this change anything? Some of us may get nervous that our happy world here may change, but what ever stays the same? The Real World is what it is, as is the Mudcat, and both are changing and growing everyday. Fear not the future, fear not the growth, fear not the change. It all comes down to one simple thing:

It will be what we make it... PERIOD

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: catspaw49
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 07:26 AM

You somehow believe that supports you don't you Roger?   How, I have no idea. Take a leap back to reality.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 09:28 AM

"No I don't and with all due respect Ron - nor do you. "

Stop playing a game of semantics. You know very well that the host can do what they want and they will.


"why do a few posters so vocally support the continuation of 'best efforts' that the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing team has publicly stated have not been able to make Mudcat - a pleasant place to hang out and goof off or have a good discussion? "

Again you ask the same question and if we take the time to answer you will disregard it again. Stop the game playing, this is not a way to have a discussion about the serious issues you brought up.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 11:01 AM

Stop playing a game of semantics. You know very well that the host can do what they want and they will.

No - Ron this not a game it is a discussion. That our host can do what they want is a quite different point of this discussion and one that you know that I have long ago accepted in this discussion and in this thread.

You stated that The host knows all, and you know that as well.

Our forum only know what our host knows - when he tells us what he knows in his few public statements to our forum. Everything else is assumption.

As for me posting Max's public statements in support of my views - that is not it at all. It is to show that I support his views as expressed in his public statements.

To show that I am no idealist who just makes these things up. Ron you appear to have gained your views (from your somewhat shorter tenure as a poster) and seem to feel that the 'take-it-or-F*** *** attitude that you now pecieve on our forum has emantated from our host. The view that it is our forum - is one that host has encouraged. If Max's view has changed - I have not seen a public statement from him to that effect.

If you have answered the following - I have yet to see the answer.
By the same token - why do a few posters so vocally support the continuation of 'best efforts' that the current Chief of the Mudcat Editing team has publicly stated have not been able to make Mudcat - a pleasant place to hang out and goof off or have a good discussion?

But it is a point for discussion........For it remains a mystery to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 11:17 AM

Sorry, I'm tired of playing word games. For you to tell me where my thoughts come from is very disrespectful and unfounded. I do not care to have my words turned around and misinterpreted. I have clearly stated how I feel about this site and I do not appreciate being played with like this.

Also, my "shorter tenure" extends at least 8 years on this site.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: catspaw49
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 11:28 AM

LMAO.......Well there ya' go! You really are a mental case Shambolina!

Here's one guy who really tries to work it through and see your points and stand up for you with some solid reasoning............So you aggressively go out of your way to piss HIM off?!?!?!?!

I have a bad case of the giggles and it's hard to type..........The irony and your inability to perceive anything.............geeziz    LOLOL ................you're really mental........LOLOL

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Peace
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 11:37 AM

Goodnight, sweetheart, well, it's time to go,
Goodnight, sweetheart, well, it's time to go,
I hate to leave you, but I really must say,
Goodnight, sweetheart, goodnight.

(repeat)

Well, it's three o'clock in the morning,,
Baby, I just can't treat you right,
Well, I hate to leave you, baby,
Don't mean maybe, because I love you so.

(chorus)

Now, my mother and my father,
Might hear if I stay here too long,
One kiss and we'll part,
And you'd be going,
Although I hate to see you go.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 11:37 AM

Read the thread spaw. Most people don't find you funny. Most people are sick of you and your little group. Carry on laughing . Inanity suits you.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 12:21 PM

You are digging your own grave Shambles.

According to Max "Trust me, this matter will be dealt with in time. Trust me, we working as hard as we can to make this happen as soon as we can." That's about you leaving.

Repent sinner. The end is near!

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Bill D
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 01:38 PM

shure am a lot of annoymous predictions about what Max will do as he addresses the situation. I am making no assumptions.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Big Mick
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 01:40 PM

Ron, you are getting a dose of what has driven otherwise decent folks so solidly against this person. He has been twisting words and taking things out of context on this interminable argument since early on in this forum. I find no redeeming value in his posts, and am dismayed when decent folks get sucked into them. This is all a game for this sad man. It is about getting attention, creating red herring arguments. When he is ignored, he starts tossing bait out until some person answers.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 02:00 AM

Open letter to max

The above thread - after being relgated to the BS has now been closed by persons unknown for reasons unexplained.

But not before at least one recipe (and a good few sensible post) could be posted to it.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 02:30 AM

Sorry, I'm tired of playing word games. For you to tell me where my thoughts come from is very disrespectful and unfounded. I do not care to have my words turned around and misinterpreted. I have clearly stated how I feel about this site and I do not appreciate being played with like this.

Ron - I am sorry if you really feel that I have been playing games with you (or if you have now caught the dose referred to):-)

However, a look back will show that if anyone was playing games here and playing to the crowd - it was you. As for me telling you where your thoughts come from and you judging his to be disrespectful - this was something that you started. And a look brief back will show hardly a post from you has gone by when you have not been judging my worth and telling me what I should do. Like the in the following.

If you truly wish to keep this on topic, you would not respond in public to the negative comments about you and defer all comments and responses of the type to private messages.

Although it was unasked for, I will take this advice starting with your posts - which rather clearly demonstrate the double standard of posting conduct, that some now consider to be acceptable on our forum. If you wish to post any more advice to me or personal judgements about me (or any other poster) you are welcome to do this via PMs.

If you wish to post to enter in to a public discussion on our forum - you may just get one but you will never get the 100% agreement you appear only to accept as a discussion.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 02:39 AM

The above thread - after being relgated to the BS has now been closed by persons unknown for reasons unexplained.

That thread does now have an inserted editing comment of explanation for its (eventual) closure. As follows:

OK, so now it's time to say goodnight and to close this thread, since we only allow one Shambles thread to be active at a time. Say goodnight, Shambles.

Goodnight, Shambles.

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Joe Offer
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 02:41 AM

Say goodnight, Shambles.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 05:33 AM

Perhaps our forum can be told, how exactly a 'Shambles thread' is now defined?

It would now appear to be any thread that our 'moderators' wish to close - but only of course after they have set the example of posting their own personal judgements (of other threads) in it?

Like the following:

Subject: RE: Open Letter to Max
From: Joe Offer - PM
Date: 25 Oct 06 - 01:42 PM

The birthday threads are obviously intended to be obnoxious, but the nice thing about them is that we can add actual music information to them and reverse the obnoxiousness.

We all have our own opinions on what we judge to be obnoxious intentions or not - perhaps our forum should be left to decide for themselves what those things are?

I may judge the intentions behind these imposed restrictions and thread closures to be obnoxious - but unlike an open thread - it is not possible for posters to 'reverse this obnoxiousness'.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 09:23 AM

Yes Shambles you are 100% right about selective editing. The Open Letter thread was not hijacked by you...yet. While the thread had absolutely no purpose and much of it was in poor taste there is no reason whatsoever that it should have been considered a second Shambles thread. Perhaps a moderator would like to comment on this. Shambles certainly had a right posting to that thread and defending his actions on the birthday threads. I think that the mods jumped the gun on this one.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 09:27 AM

There you go again, twisting my words. I don't know why you call it "judging your worth" when someone offers criticism or suggestions. That is a slimy way to garner sympathy and you are certainly not a martyr.

If I am guilty of "judging you", it was when I came to realize that your points were valid and you are indeed the victim of scorn and derision that is simply not necessary. Yet you accuse me of seeking "100% agreement". The fact that I don't agree with all your statements and tactics has you calling me part of "the crowd" and catching a "dose". You can't seem to grasp that some people can make judgements and interpretations on their own.   Shame on you.

As for throwing out a line that you did not ask for advice, perhaps you have been a big guilty of that yourself?

I am not asking for 100% agreement from this forum - I could care less how the majority or the minority feel. As you very well know, it begins and ends with the host. I know you hang on to that one post made many years ago, but it is not "our" forum in the sense that you are trying to make it. This has been discussed over and over.

You asked for examples on how you are rude and how you've attacked people. Look at your last post directed at me. You can continue to attack me if you would like, but when you do, think again the next time you accuse people of attacking you.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 09:57 AM

Guest you answered your own question really, you said it was not a Shambles thread YET. It was however well on it's way to becoming another one of his platforms. You also said it served no purpose, and was in poor taste.
Work it out for yourself!
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: number 6
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 10:51 AM

You guys are a riot!!

This thread has now become a daily "lunchtime" read for me ... along with the Daily City segment of the Saint John Telegraph news. The part of the paper were one reads about the Mayor, city councellors arguing about such matters on what is the most efficient way garbage can be picked up, or defining what constitutes an unsightly building. In effect nothing is ever resolved, but the debates are very entertaining.

"And THAT'S the way it is,"

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 11:02 AM

It's a hobby! It beats watching Springer.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 11:32 AM

I see it the same way. It's a form of slightly tacky but definitely amusing daily entertainment. Much better than a Hollywood gossip column and less depressing than the evening news.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: jeffp
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 11:43 AM

A lot of it reminds me of Professor Irwin Corey. Makes just about as much sense.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Peace
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 11:50 AM

"A conceit is a figure of speech which makes an unusual and sometimes elaborately sustained comparison between two dissimilar things."

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 12:02 PM

I wonder if Shambles realizes how many people are laughing at him. I'll bet that he probably doesn't care.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 12:08 PM

There you go again, twisting my words. I don't know why you call it "judging your worth" when someone offers criticism or suggestions. That is a slimy way to garner sympathy and you are certainly not a martyr.

Ron - The start and finsihing point is that you consider we both have the right to express our views for purposes of discussion.

Following on from that all that is required is for us to stick to the issue. Unlike yours - most of my suggestions and questions are largely limited to just that.

If you judge what I have posted to you to be an attack - then how would you judge some of the regular posts from the likes of Mick and Co? Which example - if I have to remind you - you were more than happy to follow - until you say you came to realise that my points were valid.

If my points are valid - I consider that any of my (many) personal short-commings are secondary to this discussion - as are yours.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Wesley S
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 12:10 PM

I rather laugh at someone who thinks we should care about the insults and opinions of a nameless "guest". Or should I say troll?

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 12:42 PM

"If you judge what I have posted to you to be an attack - then how would you judge some of the regular posts from the likes of Mick and Co?

We've been throught this. I answered this weeks ago. I agreed with you.

Enough with the repeats. Stop making accusing me, I'm not accusing you. You make it hard to stick to the issue when you do this. Don't try to invalidate me, I'm not doing that to you.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 12:48 PM

Obfuscation is Shambles middle name Ron

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Peace
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 01:12 PM

Shambles: Ron has been the fairest poster here with regard to your 'campaign'. IMO, you owe him an apology. It is a bit disheartening because I too agree with very much of what you say. Willows survive Canadian arctic winds because they learned to bend a little.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Pseudolus
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 01:17 PM

For what it's worth, I think Spaw is VERY funny....

And Ron? You're a good man, I feel your pain....

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 01:22 PM

People who think they are funny are generally the bane of those suffering their 'wit.'

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 01:30 PM

People with no sense of humour often post as Guest!

[BTW Guest this post is just as accurate as yours.]

G.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 02:05 PM

Ron,

That's the payback you get for trying to befriend Shambles and defending him more then most people do. He obviously intends to disagree with anybody and everybody. It would probably be in your best interest to refrain from trying to engage him in a debate since it is obvious that he does not know how to debate. He is way too stuborn to even contemplate that his ideas may not be 100% right.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: number 6
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 04:29 PM

I'm am certainly not laughing at Shambles .... or at anyone who posts to this thread ... I just find it very entertaining.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: number 6
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 04:38 PM

"Willows survive Canadian arctic winds because they learned to bend a little."

Also .... the roots of a willow tree are strong, wide and deep .... keeping it stable and secure.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 05:03 PM

I'm not sure about the willow tree.   From what I know, they do not have deep roots which is why they thrive near sources of water. They are strong to support the massive bulk of the tree, and they do spread, but they are not very sturdy.   Two years ago an approximately 50 foot willow narrowly missed my home when it crashed during a noreaster.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Peace
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 05:21 PM

Sorry, Ron. I'm in forestry country. A fifty-footer is just a sapling.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 05:27 PM

I did not think that willow trees grew much higher.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: number 6
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 05:55 PM

OK Ron ... you are correct ... the roots of a willow tree don't go down deep ... but they sure as hell spread out and will grab hold of anything they can.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: Ebbie
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 06:33 PM

Southeast Alaska's topsoil isn't deep and we have LOTS of rain so almost all of the trees - and we have LOTS of them - pancake instead of sending their roots down to much of any extent. (On the other hand, we also have giant trees, primarily of spruce and cottonwood, so we also have a certain amount of downed trees.)

Just about any lawn up here has a network of roots outlining the tree's system. I remember a few years back when the house museum I was living in got new sodding, a new lawn from start to finish. For a few months it was smooth and even but very quickly the roots became evident and mowing once more became a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 07:35 PM

That is true BiLL - I still have roots that were spread 5 or 6 feet from the trunk. Tough to get them out of the ground.   It was amazing to see it when it fell over - the base was huge.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 07:39 PM

I've never in a long time seen anything so funny as Ron Olesko's reactions coupled with Peaces comments. Do these people really not think many of those who got caught up in "shambles" things have not been there.

Can they not now admit they now know why what seems to be instant judgements to them have occured over a 6 year campaign...

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 08:01 PM

Aw c'mon. Let's ban guests in the BS section - what would it hurt.

Besides,1300 is the new 1,000.

Subject: RE: BS: Closed threads & deleted posts.
From: jeffp
Date: 26 Oct 06 - 08:10 PM

Thirteen hundred!