BS: Popular Views on Obama

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 03:43 PM

"He seems to be dropping in the polls, even while the convention is going on."

Of course! It's the Riginslinger Effect that's responsible for that. All your negative talk about Obama is wearing his campaign down, man. Nothing spreads faster than bad news and negative gossip, right? I predict that your incessant dissing of Obama on this forum will eventually reduce his support nationwide to the point where he will be lucky to carry even a single state. Why he might even retire from politics before voting day and vanish into a monastery just to get away from it all. ;-) Then we'll get 4 more years of the Republicans and most Mudcatters will hate you for the rest of their lives.

"Being that that is a .44 Magnut, the most powerful opinion in the world, and can blow your head clean off, you gotta ask yourself one question, Rig..."

"Do I feel lucky?"

"Well? Do ya...punk?"

(Note to moderators: the above is a joke)

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 06:02 PM

Gallup Daily: No Bounce for Obama in Post-Biden Tracking

McCain creeps ahead, 46% to 44%
USA Election 2008 Gallup Daily Americas Northern America

PRINCETON, NJ -- It's official: Barack Obama has received no bounce in voter support out of his selection of Sen. Joe Biden to be his vice presidential running mate.

Gallup Poll Daily tracking from Aug. 23-25, the first three-day period falling entirely after Obama's Saturday morning vice presidential announcement, shows 46% of national registered voters backing John McCain and 44% supporting Obama, not appreciably different from the previous week's standing for both candidates. This is the first time since Obama clinched the nomination in early June, though, that McCain has held any kind of advantage over Obama in Gallup Poll Daily tracking.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/109834/Gallup-Daily-Bounce-Obama-Post-Biden-Tracking.aspx

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 06:46 PM

Composite polls, not filtered to make an electrifying news story, show Obama 1.7% ahead:

RCP National Average         45.7                 44.0               Obama +1.7
Favorable Ratings               +19.0        +16.4        Obama +2.6
Intrade Market Odds                 61.1                 37.1        -      Obama +24

INdividual news agency stories are always gonna be slanted whichevver way will make the most heebie-jeebies.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 07:45 PM

Ya know, Amos / Saul /Little hawk , This is my favorite part of the political year. Its just like when you have just begun dating and you expert her to lie to you and kiss your butt.

And that is serious commentary. Its worth $ if you are writing for Bill Mahre.

Seriously, the butt kissing begins tonight with Hillary's concession/promotion speech. How well she does will determine what rewards she could expect in the future and how well insulated she will be from accusations of being a spoiler.

If Barack is swift boated or Diebolded...

She could certainly run again, assuming we haven't engaged in a nuclear exchange under McCain.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Riginslinger
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 07:56 PM

"Why he might even retire from politics before voting day and vanish into a monastery just to get away from it all..."


                Does Reverend Wright run a monastery?

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 08:49 PM

"and presenting it as his/her own thoughts."

From whence? It is my conclusion, especially so because Canucks think Socialist Cuba is so great and long to live there.

I heard a first hand story from someone that just visited Cuba, Seems they hired a driver and one day the driver did not show up. He said his daughter was sick and he needed to take her to the hospital, then he could show up. Later he did show up and his wife contacted him. She told him he needed to bring some cleaning supplies to her at the hospital because her daughter's hospital bed was dirty and had blood on it.

The Libs only weapon when confronted with facts is to whine "Propaganda", unfair, unfair. They think everyone uses propaganda like they do. Everything that does not fit into their goody goody little idealistic socialist conception of how things should be is labeled propaganda. They are the only ones who know anything. It's sort of like a religion. "We have the only true religion and all others are false"

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 09:17 PM

You tell em, Guest,sawzz

Its typical plug and play liberal rhetoric all right, one size fits all the faithful.

They say that crazy people sometimes claim to have great powers.

When someone like Obama actually gets great powers, he is likely to go a little crazy.

juslike u

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 09:52 PM

Reverend Wright:

"The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color. The government lied."

"God damn America"

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Aug 08 - 11:13 PM

Now wait a minute there my friend,

Even at the NIH there is a 50-50 division between viral bio chemists as to a human enginered origin of HIV and the Belgium TB vaccine African monkey HIV infection theory regarding human HIV infection from that monkey vaccine and the subsequent epidemic.

No matter who said it, there is still a arguable point about AIDs genisis in the scientific community.


As for race specific infection research that has only been in the works for about a dozen years. Of course an African AIDs epidemic is only a bit higher as it is in the black population in Washigton DC which is close to 1 in 10 in NE DC neighborhoods. To call it a race specific virus is stretching the truth but naturally it will effect more blacks in Africa.

At any rate when a preacher tires to discuss the controversy in 7 words, he is bound to be out of bounds, but not entirely wrong either.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 27 Aug 08 - 12:00 AM

Your talent for distorting the truth by sliding it out of all context and twisting it has grown larger with each passing fit, Sawz.

If you keep it up you'll be too insane to even write a sentence.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Aug 08 - 12:06 AM

Relax Amos. He's just going to spew sites and picking out random tidbits. He's probably got a picture of Limbaugh on the ceiling over his bed. ;-D

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Riginslinger
Date: 27 Aug 08 - 12:25 AM

"He's probably got a picture of Limbaugh on the ceiling over his bed."
                  Boy, that would be the kryptonite of sexual arousal!


    "...when a preacher tires to discuss the controversy in 7 words, he is bound to be out of bounds, but not entirely wrong either."

                   No, he's entirely wrong, no matter how many words!

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 Aug 08 - 01:10 AM

I just told you, Sawza, Canada is 98% capitalist. Maybe 99%. And we're good at it too. If that doesn't fit your insane mythological notions about us, too bad. You may be under the impression we live in igloos here too for all I know... ;-)

I admire the Cubans because they've successfully resisted you Mafia bastards in Greater Imperial Amerika for 50 years now and they've kept you at bay. Plus they're more friendly, more polite, more mature, and more likeable than you are on an individual basis and they're lively and confident enough to do stuff for themselves rather than just sit on their couch like a stuffed potatoe and watch someone else do it for them on the TV screen. That's good enough for me.

They put you totally to shame as human beings, and so do a lot of other Third World people, but you'll never know it because you live inside a bubble of blind cultural ignorance, safe behind your embargo, your mountain of possessions, and your ill-founded fear of the fictional bogeymen that your politicians invented so they could keep successfully enslaving YOU.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: beardedbruce
Date: 27 Aug 08 - 03:09 PM

Washington Post:

posted at 2:35 PM ET, 08/27/2008
Russia Makes Trouble for the Democrats' Narrative

I wouldn't say that the words "Ossetia" and "Abkhazia" are on every delegate's lips out here, but Russia's aggression has spotlighted some interesting divisions within the Democratic Party -- and even the Obama team itself -- on foreign policy.

Barack Obama issued a very tough statement yesterday, after Russia recognized as independent countries two provinces of Georgia, South Ossetia and Abkhazia. He said "the U.S. should lead within the UN and other international forums... to further isolate Russia internationally because of its actions." Around the same time, as Bloomberg reported, two of Obama's senior advisers, former defense secretary Bill Perry and former Navy secretary Richard Danzig, were counseling against isolation and for engagement. I haven't seen any surveys on this, but it's clear that a lot of Democrats here feel more comfortable with the softer view.

Gov. Ted Strickland of Ohio told a group of us Post reporters and editors that "if Russians were to try to do, over in our sphere of influence, what we've been doing in theirs, the reaction would be rather severe." The governor emphasized that he wasn't speaking for Obama, but when I expressed surprise -- and wondered how Polish-Americans and Ukrainian-Americans in Ohio would react to his apparent inclusion of independent nations into a Russian "sphere of influence" -- he didn't back off. "It seems to me we have taken action that was almost designed to be provocative, and that just doesn't seem wise to me."

The problem for Obama is that this crisis, and his response to it, doesn't comport with the narrative many Democrats here treasure, which could be summed up as: McCain is a warmonger like Bush, Obama will bring back diplomacy, and America, by invading Iraq and condoning torture, has forfeited any right to complain about Russia.

Listen to Joe Biden tonight, and Obama tomorrow, as they seek to weave their uncompromising response to Russia and their critique of Bush-McCain overall belligerence into a narrative that comforts the faithful and makes sense to the country.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Aug 08 - 05:38 PM

Bruce,

International diplomacy is tough. There are no easy answers. Bush and McCain think that there are easy answers and have thus put us in our current pickle. Its time to try something new.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 03:08 PM

"out of all context"

Amos, you are the master of posting out of context.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 03:16 PM

Us American Mafia Bastards eh?

You could get rubbed out for that but I don't think you are worth the cost of an Anti-Little Hawk Cruise Missile.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 03:20 PM

One can create context or follow context or get out of the way.

Obama folks are still angry with the Clinton camp for The Mark Penn smears on Obama that continued long after it was impossible for Hillary to win.

The story that Hillary fans are going Republican is 99.9% fiction.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 05:10 PM

In a switch, McCain to Obama: "Well done"

By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer
35 minutes ago



DENVER - In a brief break from a fierce advertising war, Republican presidential candidate John McCain will air a one-evening-only ad with a simple message for Barack Obama: "Job well done."

The ad will air before, during and after Obama's nomination acceptance speech on national cable television.

In the ad, McCain addresses Obama directly, congratulating him for becoming the Democratic Party's nominee. McCain also recognizes the symbolism of a black man accepting the nomination on the 45th anniversary of the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.'s "I Have a Dream" speech.

McCain says: "Senator Obama, this is truly a good day for America. Too often the achievements of our opponents go unnoticed. So I wanted to stop and say, congratulations. How perfect that your nomination would come on this historic day. Tomorrow, we'll be back at it. But tonight Senator, job well done."

While the ad represents a moment of comity, it also casts McCain as a generous and gracious rival on the final day of the Democratic National Convention where McCain was regularly portrayed in a negative light.

As McCain concedes, this won't last.

Both candidates have been running a series of ads criticizing each other, vastly outnumbering any positive ads about themselves. But this is the first positive ad of the election by one candidate about the other.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 05:22 PM

I hope McCain does that. It should be noted that the Clintons and Biden and several others praised Biden the man before going on to the serious matter of pointing out the weakness of his platform.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 05:23 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 05:22 PM

I hope McCain does that. It should be noted that the Clintons and Biden and several others praised MCCAIN the man before going on to the serious matter of pointing out the weakness of his platform.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 06:29 PM

HEy-- finally, the man shows that he has some class. I often suspected he had it in there somewhere.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 28 Aug 08 - 06:42 PM

From "The Progressive":

MLK's Dream 45 Years Later


Forty-five years ago today, Martin Luther King, Jr. delivered his famous "I Have A Dream" speech to over 200,000 people from the steps of the Lincoln Memorial in Washington, D.C. African-Americans were "still sadly crippled by the manacles of segregation and the chains of discrimination" one hundred years after the signing of the Emancipation Proclamation, King said. He invoked "the fierce urgency of now" and declared that America must "live out the true meaning of its creed" that "all men are created equal." Forty-five years later, though still incomplete, America has moved gradually towards realizing King's dream. One year after King delivered his speech, President Lyndon Johnson signed the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which formally outlawed racial segregation in schools, public places, and employment. In 1966, Massachusetts Sen. Edward Brooke became the first African-American to be elected to the Senate by popular vote. In 1989, L. Douglas Wilder became the first African-American elected governor of a state. In Denver today, Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL) will become the first African-American to accept the presidential nomination of a major party. Rev. Joseph Lowery, who was a co-founder of the Southern Christian Leadership Conference with King, says that while Obama's nomination is a significant step for the civil rights movement, it is not the final step. "I think that, while it doesn't mean we've gotten to heaven... we are on our way as the old song goes," Lowery told Politico.

DISPARITIES STILL EXIST: In 2004, the National Urban League released it's first Equality Index, which sought to statistically measure the disparities between blacks and whites in areas such as economics, education and civic engagement. The index found that the status of African-Americans had improved since the Civil Rights era, with significant increases in "overall income, home ownership, business development and educational achievement" but that "there are still notable gaps between African Americans and whites." In total, the status of African Americans in 2004 was "73 percent when compared to the conditions of their white counterparts." In the 2007 Equality Index, the status of African-Americans had shown a slight improvement, rising to 73.3 percent.

'A LONELY ISLAND OF POVERTY': In his 1963 speech, King described black Americans as living "on a lonely island of poverty in the midst of a vast ocean of material prosperity." Forty-five years later, the economic disparities between African Americans and white Americans are still stark. In 2007, based on annual median income, black men "earned less than three-quarters of what white men earned" while "black women made 87 percent of what white women made." According to new census numbers, "inflation-adjusted median incomes of black and Hispanic households rose last year for the first time since 1999," but African-Americans still "had the lowest median household income in the country" at $33,916. In 2007, the unemployment rate for African-Americans was 8.3 percent, which is "more than twice the white unemployment rate." In census numbers released earlier this week, African-Americans once again had the highest poverty rate in America 24.5 percent.

'THE PROMISES OF DEMOCRACY': In calling for America to heed "the fierce urgency of now," King declared that "now is the time to make real the promises of democracy." Since then, African-Americans have been one of the most active and engaged voting communities in America. According to the 2006 census, blacks had the second highest registration rate at 61 percent and the second highest level of voter turnout at 41 percent. Despite this high level of civic engagement, barriers for democratic involvement by the African American community still exist. Earlier this year, the Supreme Court upheld Indiana's restrictive voter ID law, ruling that "states can require voters to produce photo identification without violating their constitutional rights." Though many Americans have a variety of proofs of identity, studies have shown that black and Latino Americans are far less likely than whites to have government-issued IDs. For instance, in a detailed study in Milwaukee, fewer than half of African-American and Latino adults had identification.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 12:34 AM

From Atlantic.com:

It was a deeply substantive speech, full of policy detail, full of people other than the candidate, centered overwhelmingly on domestic economic anxiety. It was a liberal speech, more unabashedly, unashamedly liberal than any Democratic acceptance speech since the great era of American liberalism. But it made the case for that liberalism - in the context of the decline of the American dream, and the rise of cynicism and the collapse of cultural unity. His ability to portray that liberalism as a patriotic, unifying, ennobling tradition makes him the most lethal and remarkable Democratic figure since John F Kennedy.
What he didn't do was give an airy, abstract, dreamy confection of rhetoric. The McCain campaign set Obama up as a celebrity airhead, a Paris Hilton of wealth and elitism. And he let them portray him that way, and let them over-reach, and let them punch him again and again ... and then he turned around and destroyed them. If the Rove Republicans thought they were playing with a patsy, they just got a reality check.
He took every assault on him and turned them around. He showed not just that he understood the experience of many middle class Americans, but that he understood how the Republicans have succeeded in smearing him. And he didn't shrink from the personal charges; he rebutted them. Whoever else this was, it was not Adlai Stevenson. It was not Jimmy Carter. And it was less afraid and less calculating than Bill Clinton.
Above all, he took on national security - face on, full-throttle, enraged, as we should all be, at how disastrously American power has been handled these past eight years. He owned this issue in a way that no Democrat has owned it since Kennedy. That's a transformative event. To my mind, it is vital that both parties get to own the war on Jihadist terror and that we escape this awful Rove-Morris trap that poisons the discourse into narrow and petty partisan abuse of patriotism. Obama did this tonight. We are in his debt.
Look: I'm biased at this point. I'm one of those people, deeply distressed at what has happened to America, deeply ashamed of my own misjudgments, who has shifted out of my ideological comfort zone because this man seems different to me, and this moment in history seems different to me. I'm not sure we have many more chances to get off the addiction to foreign oil, to prevent a calamitous terrorist attack, to restore constitutional balance in the hurricane of a terror war.
I've said it before - months and months ago. I should say it again tonight. This is a remarkable man at a vital moment. America would be crazy to throw this opportunity away. America must not throw this opportunity away.
Know hope.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 12:39 AM

CNN.com:

I imagine that lots of you out there remain fierce critics of Barack Obama. Next week Republicans will legitimately debate and challenge many of his ideas, especially about his call for a more activist government. It will be fascinating now when John McCain and Obama meet in debates.

But for this moment and for this purpose, I saw Obama's speech tonight as a political masterpiece. As I had a chance to say on CNN a few moments ago, it was in many ways less a speech than a symphony. I also sensed that we saw tonight an Obama who is growing into a new, more mature leader — stronger, tougher, harder-hitting than he had appeared only a few weeks ago.

Whether Obama will win this Novemember or not is still very unclear, but if he does, I imagine we may look back and say this was a major turning point.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Riginslinger
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 10:33 AM

I can't wait to see the debate between Joe Biden and Sarah Palin.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 02:06 PM

"It was a remarkable scene last night. The mood of the crowd, the stagecraft, the pageantry and the sheer enormity of the stadium made the evening feel like a cross between Lollapalooza, The Oscars, and the closing ceremonies of the Beijing Olympics.

Obama's speech was brilliant: well crafted and well delivered, touching on all the right notes. All that was expected, of course, and Obama delivered in spades. He got somewhat specific at times, deftly portrayed McCain as out of touch on the economy, put up his dukes on national security, and finished with an emotional flourish that drew on the history of the moment.

He made one mistake, though. His line knocking McCain for not following Osama bin Laden to his cave struck me as flippant and unnecessary. Though the crowd got a kick out of it, my sense is that that line that opened the door for Republicans and it will come back to haunt the Junior Senator from Illinois.

Whether the speech connected with the voters he needs to connect with around the country, we'll have to wait and see. This much is for certain: Obama is the muse of the liberal wing of the Democratic party. He moves them in a way no candidate has in two generations.

Yet, as the massive crowd inside the stadium testified, Obama's appeal reaches well beyond hardcore Democrats. It was no small feat to get inside Invesco field yesterday: a mile trek on foot, an hour or more wait in line in the hot afternoon sun. Yet people of all shapes, sizes, colors, and ages made the pilgrimage and filled the seats for the chance to see Obama accept the Democratic party's nomination for President - and he did not disappoint."

(From http://time-blog.com/real_clear_politics/2008/08/obamas_night.html

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 02:28 PM

Obama's lead is getting clearer:


RCP Average 08/18 - 08/28 -- 47.7 43.8             Obama +3.9
Gallup Tracking 08/26 - 08/28 2727 RV 49 41       Obama +8
Rasmussen Tracking 08/26 - 08/28 3000 LV 49 45    Obama +4
CNN 08/23 - 08/24 909 RV 47 47 Tie
USA Today/Gallup 08/21 - 08/23 765 LV 48 45       Obama +3
Hotline/FD 08/18 - 08/24 1022 RV 44 40                Obama +4
ABC News/Wash Post 08/19 - 08/22 LV 49 45          Obama +4

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Donuel
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 03:15 PM

The last 8 years of the ownership policy, which is nothing more than taking a low cost goverment function and outsourcing it to special friends of the administration for 10 times the cost, it costs YOU 10 times more to pay for it. When they are payed with borrowed money with interest you are paying 20 times more than the cost of goverment doing it in the first place.

I know this all too well.

Outsourcing and contracting out has become the biggest rip off in history and most people think it is the goverment.

Its not the goverment, it is the Republican plan to make money off what the goverment was originally designed to do.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 29 Aug 08 - 04:33 PM

How about a specific example D.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 30 Aug 08 - 07:02 PM

Posted August 30, 2008 2:15 PM

Barack Obama also holds an 8-point advantage over John McCain.

by Mark Silva

"ST. PAUL, Minn. - Barack Obama is getting high ratings for his acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention, with 58 percent of those surveyed giving it a positive review and 43 percent saying it could make them more likely to vote for the junior senator from Illinois seeking the White House.

Obama also has maintained an eight-point advantage over rival John McCain in Gallup's daily tracking poll, which includes the last two days of the convention and the day afterward - the day that McCain named his running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin. The Democrat leads the Republican by 49-41 percent in the daily track, a measure of Obama's "convention "bounce,'' Gallup says.

"The Friday interviewing was conducted in an unusual political environment -- the first conducted fully after Obama's well-regarded acceptance speech,'' Gallup notes.

Fifty-eight percent of Americans give Obama's speech a positive review, including 35 percent calling it "excellent."

Both ratings surpass those for the 2000 and 2004 presidential candidates - with Obama's excellent rating "higher than any other other recent candidate has received.,'' Gallup reports.(...)"    Swamp Politics.com)

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Riginslinger
Date: 31 Aug 08 - 10:26 AM

Since Sarah Palin stepped into the limelight, Oh Bummer has been running around demeaning small towns again. This won't win votes for him.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 31 Aug 08 - 11:36 AM

Rig:

Play nice, and stop the slander.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 31 Aug 08 - 09:53 PM

Regarding concerns that Clintonite Democrats may support Republican presidential hopeful John McCain (your report, 28 August), I would suggest such acts of Mugwumpery will not be indulged by the party membership.
Having seen Democrat hopes dashed by the most Neocon US government in history, Democrats realise the price that would be paid not only by the US but by the world at large if they failed to elect Barack Obama as president.

The world desired new leadership and Obama is that leader.

GREGOR MURRAY

Grampian Gardens

Dundee

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 01:30 PM

Amos is the only one with a license to slander.

He alone makes the rules on what people can post, what ie slander and what is not. He metes out "Summary Justice"

Il Duce, Der Führer, The Ayatollah of Mudcat

From: Amos

X-Ed, shut the fuck up.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Beardedbruce
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 01:36 PM

We conservatives here really have no-one to blame but ourselves.

Some here, like Amos and Bobert, have become such students of Bush that it is impossible to tell any difference between the tactics he is accused of and the ones that they have chosen to advance their own side.

I guess imitation IS the sincerest form of flattery.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 01:51 PM

IF either of you garbage-mouthed grumps would like to post specifics, I would be interested in reading them.

You ad hominem slanders, Sawz, are unimaginative, inaccurate, unkind and uncharitable, lacking grace, precision, accuracy and smacking of a deep lack of integrity.

I have no authority or any desire to prevent people from posting. I reserve my own right as an individual to call BS when I see it, as I do here.,

When you fill these threads with innuendo and gaseous generalizations of ugliness, you cast a very poor reflection of your own capabilities, mental or spiritual.

Apparently you have been poring over all my posts looking for the least charitable things I have ever said, with the idea in mind of taking them out of their context and offering them up as examples of my posting history.

That's a pretty vacuuous and pathetic impulse on your part, just because you don't like my political views.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 02:07 PM

"garbage-mouthed grumps"?


You are saying that any disagreement with you is invalid???



Please go insert your head back into it's orifice.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 02:07 PM

sorry- cookie.

"garbage-mouthed grumps"?


You are saying that any disagreement with you is invalid???



Please go insert your head back into it's orifice.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 02:13 PM

>>How about a specific example D

How about two

BlackWater USA
Halliburton

Lets make it three

KBR

They are all doing jobs soldiers used to do and charging ten times as much as a soldier is paid.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 03:39 PM

No, Bruce, and you know full well that is NOT what I am saying, and you know full well what it is I AM saying. If you find the current disarray of your chosen party so depressing that it makes you go all green at the gills and foamy at the mouth like Sawz, go do it in the dark streets at night. I don't want it, nor do I deserve it.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Beardedbruce
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:13 PM

Amos,

Actually, your recent comments have been a lot like the ones Martin Gibson was putting up here. Perhaps you need to relax and stop thinking that everyone who disagrees with you is evil- THAT is what you claimed Bush was doing, and you ARE doing it now.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:21 PM

Bruce

M-G said a lot of things but if you are implying that Amos' behavior in any way compares to the worst of M-G's attacks, I am willing to call that an unwarranted personal attack, with no basis in reality, on Amos.

I think you woe Amos and apology.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:23 PM

SO I am to believe the Amos's ad hominem slanders are imaginative, accurate, kind and charitable, graceful, precise, accurate and reflecting deep integrity?

"Shut the fuck up" Yeah, it is all of those things.

Heil.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:27 PM

I did not say the worst- but Amos has been getting more insulting, for less reason. I expect he will be as bad as the worst of M-G by about the election.

I owe him ( and Bobert) only the truth, and my honest opinion. If he acts in an obnoxious manner, it is my duty to let him know that his behaviour is negatively affectiing the viewpoint he is promoting- I point him out as an example of what we can expect if Obama were to win, and that gives independents more than enough reason to consider McCain, for all his faults.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:42 PM

Bruce,

If you think you are independent you are kidding yourself. In the six or seven years I have seen you on this form you have always toed the Republican Party line.

It was obviously not your honest opinion.
Please note, that you can't call Amos as bad a M-G just because you think at some point he might get that bad. You still owe him an apology. But if at some point, in the very unlikely event he does get that bad, having predicted it, you might be able to say "I told you so."

For now, it is an unwarranted personal attack, one that is not up to your usual standard of behavior. I am sure that the moderators are giving you some leeway because of your past civility. But for me, comparing someone who does not agree with you and occaisionally critiques your style of argument to the most disruptive, insulting vulgar troll ever to pollute this forum is a step too far.

Please note that Sawzaw, earns some criticism. He is constantly chasing Amos all over this forum hurling half baked insults at him. It is understandable that Amos responds once in a while.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:52 PM

IMHO, Amos is now just about as bad as M-G was about 1 year before he was kicked off. But he has gotten there in a short time- at this rate I expect he will reach the extreme that M-G reached in two months.


Just my opinion, milage may vary. It is Amos' reaction to ANY disagreement with his fixed viewpoint, regardless of how carefully or politely phrased that brings M-G to mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: Amos
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 04:56 PM

Bruce:


We've been at this game, and each other, too longmy friend. Perhaps you know my buttons too well! Your compatriot Sawzall has accused me of being a fascist, a Muslim religious leader, and a number of other things. Yet I have not gone trawling through the history of the Cat looking for dumb things he has said to throw back in his face. And when I corrected him on one such erroneous extraction from history, he dropped it and went and found another, without bothering to reveal where he found it. He has consistently demonstrated an underhanded, snide, passive-aggressive style which insinuates and plays innuendoes, smears and vilifies without detail or context.

Your own recent snide remarks about "Obama's supporters" and the imitation of our most despised and furless leader Bush are similarly indirect and unworethy as arguments. Why you would paint me with the same brush as those who post salacious and scurrilous slanders with no basis in fact escapes me. The salacious slanders i have posted all have a firm basis in fact.

Mebbe we could both lighten up some and give ole Sawz a better example to learn from.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 05:05 PM

"The salacious slanders i have posted "


I do not agree that you have established a basis for these slanders- YOU are defining what you say as factual, when that is arguable (IMHO).


You have gotten more personal in your insults, and I do not see that you have some special priviledge to do so. Ubermensch are NOT appreciated.

I have the utmost respect for your musical ability and judgement ( as I do Bobert's) but your pushing your own political viewpoint down other's throats in the manner you have been trying to is ... worthy of M-G. Try persuasion instead of browbeating.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views on Obama
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 01 Sep 08 - 05:05 PM

Main Entry:
sa·la·cious
Pronunciation:
\sə-ˈlā-shəs\
Function:
adjective
Etymology:
Latin salac-, salax, from salire to move spasmodically, leap — more at sally
Date:
circa 1645
1 : arousing or appealing to sexual desire or imagination : lascivious
2 : lecherous, lustful
— sa·la·cious·ly adverb
— sa·la·cious·ness noun



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